Colt 1911 Defender in 45 input

I've noticed ramped barrels typically come with shorter barreled 1911s. What is the purpose of them? If done correctly, is the traditional ramp and barrel better for 1911s?
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Below is a pic of a fully ramped barrel from DW Guardian in 38 Super.




Fully ramped barrels show up in 1911s of all sizes.

The intent of them was to more fully support the head of the case on all sides. The traditional barrels offer full support on more or less about 60% of the case head and leave some unprotected. This was not an issue till the 1980s when, in competitive shooting, many shooters took to overloading the 38 Super round in order to make major power factor. In many cases they began blowing out the bottom of the cases, or badly bulging them, in the area that was unsupported. So fully ramped barrels began with pistolsmiths to solve the issue in 1911s.

It also became an issue with the 10mm and later the 40 S&W (the latter particularly in Glocks where "Ka-Booms" with Glocks became famous, or infamous).

Colt has never made any fully ramped barrels that I'm aware of (unless for a special order). But other makers do offer them.

In 45 acp and 9mm case head blow out has never been an issue. It hadn't been an issue for the 38 Super either till the 80's and 90's.

If you want to experiment with heavy loads while handloading then it is a wise way to go. For general plinking and self defense loads against humans it is not necessary.

I don't know truthfully, if it helps in feeding or not. There are reliable guns with and without integral ramps. They certainly have not been a game changer when it comes to that.

Integral ramps have been available on guns, other than the 1911, for a long time.

tipoc
 
I'm not a fan of ramped barrels, but for alloy-framed guns, it prevents sharp edges on JHPs from damaging the frame.
My first Star PD came to me with some divots already visible, and, at the time, I carried Winchester Silvertips because they seemed to not make the situation any worse.
When I bought a vintage LW Commander, I just decided to load hardball and not worry about it.
I have "heard" that ramped barrels do not feed as well as the standard "two part feed ramp" in .45s, but have no personal experience with the former.
 
I'd prefer the Defender in .40 S&W. I've had the 45 ACP and it kicks awful with +p ammo. Just to light and small for the cartridge.

Deaf
 
oldfart1944 said:
This is one of my biggest points of contention with the 1911 platform. The feed ramp is on the frame and the barrel entry is simply taper ported. The distance in the contiguous area is determined by the link pin and changes with age very rapidly as the link pin is a very stressed part. I charge $300 to make that modification with absolutely no guarantee of hollow point feeding as the 1911 was NEVER designed to shoot hollow points in the first place
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A person can simply have the link pin replaced.

Modification to a ramped barrel as the above poster showed?

I'm guessing a 'smith can't guarantee hollow point feeding due to the nose of the bullet hitting the ramp lower than other designs?
 
This is one of my biggest points of contention with the 1911 platform. The feed ramp is on the frame and the barrel entry is simply taper ported. The distance in the contiguous area is determined by the link pin and changes with age very rapidly as the link pin is a very stressed part. I charge $300 to make that modification with absolutely no guarantee of hollow point feeding as the 1911 was NEVER designed to shoot hollow points in the first place
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"Changes very rapidly" I have guns that are over 60 years old and have the original link pin and link with no signs of damage to either. But I suppose that if I was to shoot 30,000-50,000 rounds a year through a single gun that I might have to replace both the pin and link once every few years, or depending on what I shot through it, more often. As those parts are quite cheap it is no burden to make the change.

It was three generations ago, or more, that shooters figured how to throat a barrel and polish a feed ramp on a GI 1911 so that they would reliably feed lead WC and SWC bullets for match and national match shooting. Bar-Sto began making them in the 1960s or 70s IIRC. About 3 decades back factory manufacturers learned to produce barrels that reliably feed jhp ammo. It's more often the mags that are the issue there than the ramp or the barrel.

So if the question is can a 1911 pattern pistol reliably shoot JHP ammo the answer is yes. Without hesitation, yes. They been doing it for some time now. If a fella says but my gun won't shoot x brand of ammo...then use another brand of ammo or gun, that's on the shooter and not the gun.

tipoc
 
The chamber entrance to that barrel looks to very poor quality and rough on the left side. I take down the sides a few thousands and polish the area to a mirror like finish!
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The gun was dirty when I took that pic. As it works flawlessly, with quality DW usually puts in their guns, I see no reason to arbitrarily begin grinding on things.

tipoc
 
It was three generations ago, or more, that shooters figured how to throat a barrel and polish a feed ramp on a GI 1911 so that they would reliably feed lead WC and SWC bullets for match and national match shooting. Bar-Sto began making them in the 1960s or 70s IIRC. About 3 decades back factory manufacturers learned to produce barrels that reliably feed jhp ammo. It's more often the mags that are the issue there than the ramp or the barrel.
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My experience with the 1911 platform has been that mags not working in a particular model says just as much about the particular model as the mags. A good 1911 will run with the far majority of mags out there.
 
I had a Colt Commander, it had too many problems that Colt didn't fix. I was unreliable. My EMP is reliable, hundreds of rounds with no hiccups. The Colt Defender in .45 that I shot was a horrible recoiling beast without a shooting glove. My EMP suits me perfectly. IMO Colt is overrated.
 
My experience with the 1911 platform has been that mags not working in a particular model says just as much about the particular model as the mags. A good 1911 will run with the far majority of mags out there.
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Agreed; if a gun needs a specific mag to run, it's probably a matter of that mag's particular dimensional idiosyncrasies being a match for the gun's.
Not necessarily that there's something "wrong" with the mag, just that the mag and the gun have diverged from the original gun/mag/ammo system introduced in 1911.
 
shootbrownelk said:
I had a Colt Commander, it had too many problems that Colt didn't fix. I was unreliable. My EMP is reliable, hundreds of rounds with no hiccups. The Colt Defender in .45 that I shot was a horrible recoiling beast without a shooting glove. My EMP suits me perfectly. IMO Colt is overrated.
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It seems with Colt, the era (a span of several years or so) determines quality and reliability. I'm wondering if long time aficionados of the 1911 platform agree or disagree with me.
 
Agreed; if a gun needs a specific mag to run, it's probably a matter of that mag's particular dimensional idiosyncrasies being a match for the gun's.
Not necessarily that there's something "wrong" with the mag, just that the mag and the gun have diverged from the original gun/mag/ammo system introduced in 1911.
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This can be overthought.

This post recognizes something important. That over the decades there have been different manufacturers of 1911s and makers of a variety of magazine designs.

It is not always the case that all well made 1911's will work with all mags. A good many issues folks have with 1911s have less to do with the guns than the mags.

tipoc
 
I had a Colt Commander, it had too many problems that Colt didn't fix. I was unreliable. My EMP is reliable, hundreds of rounds with no hiccups. The Colt Defender in .45 that I shot was a horrible recoiling beast without a shooting glove. My EMP suits me perfectly. IMO Colt is overrated.
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Your experience is not common. It's also yours. Mine is different. I generally shoot 185 gr. ammo out of the Defender in deference to the short barrel.

"I was unreliable". I assume you mean "It".

In general the Colt Defender and it's kin have received quite good reviews. That doesn't mean that all will take to it and it doesn't mean that every gun that comes out the plant is excellent. Just means it's a gun.

tipoc
 
Originally Posted by shootbrownelk View Post
I had a Colt Commander, it had too many problems that Colt didn't fix. I was unreliable. My EMP is reliable, hundreds of rounds with no hiccups. The Colt Defender in .45 that I shot was a horrible recoiling beast without a shooting glove. My EMP suits me perfectly. IMO Colt is overrated.

It seems with Colt, the era (a span of several years or so) determines quality and reliability. I'm wondering if long time aficionados of the 1911 platform agree or disagree with me.
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People have been complaining about a perceived decline in Colt quality since commercial production restarted after WWII.
I have Colt products manufactured in the early 20th Century, up through the early 21st, and I've seen lots and lots of them made throughout that period.

I think it depends a lot on your rating system. If you look at two guns, and decide that the one with a beavertail is more valuable than one without, or that the one that has a "tighter" slide to frame fit is necessarily a better gun, then you might conclude that a Colt isn't as "good" as another gun.

If I were to choose a time frame as one in which Colt quality was more variable - excellent guns have been made in every era - I'd pick the early Series 80 years, as I think there was a certain amount of cheapening of the product, a la 1964 Winchesters.

Shootbrownelk had a Commander that never worked right, while mine has never not worked right - even though it was made during that early '80s period - and both situations are perfectly believable
 
That's b.s. :rolleyes:

Just get the Defender, ... or a New Agent if you can still find one. The Defender works better for guys who are too lazy or inept to master the N.A.'s gutter sight system. :rolleyes:

That said, both guns will do what 3" 1911s were specifically designed for - which is, first, easy carry, and second, to put aggressive a-holes, at bad-breath distance, face-down on the urban concrete.

You can thank me later. :cool:
 
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