Checking a Pistol on a Flight

In the early 1970's it was easy. You checked the gun at the luggage counter and they put it into a box and away the box went. When you got off the plane the Pilot or First Officer were passing out boxes to passengers exiting the plane next to the Flight Deck. In the 1980's you requested a "Red Tag" and the counter clerk knew what that was. Attach the tag to unloaded gun with your name and flight number, put it into your checked baggage and all was well. Today I will not play the game. I do go to some cities that do not like guns. I carry my defensive items (knife and mace) in my checked baggage which I do not have to declare. I fly the Big Delta airlines.
 
A bit off topic. BUT, how is the airline legaly allowed to be in control of the firearm in areas where citizens are not?
 
This has always interested in as well since I am a Chicago resident. I haven't flown in some time, but the last time I did I was considering taking a pistol down with me to Houston. I'm actually glad I didn't as I was on business, and one of the lodgings was shared with ex cons, so we were patted down and all that every time we came in. Good luck to me explaining THAT to these off duty cops!! Especially considering the company I was made to keep.

I read a story a while back about someone who was arrested at O'hare trying to check in a pistol. I can't remember exactly WHY he was apprehended, but it turns out they tried to throw the fact that he didn't have a valid Chicago Firearms Permit, or CFP, in his possession for the gun. Unsure of what happened to him and I cannot corroborate the story with any evidence.
 
Many shooters that do take a gun print 3 copies of the rules and regs. Then way you can give a copy to someone who wants to free lance the rules and make them what they think they ought to be.

A bit off topic. BUT, how is the airline legaly allowed to be in control of the firearm in areas where citizens are not?
from post #22

I dont think the airline is really in control as the flier (customer) is the only one supposed to have a key to that lock. The customer shows gun and locks the gun and keeps the key-no TSA keys is the law, I believe.

But otherwise they would just say "we are safe"-- "you are not"...
 
Hi, Ace Breaker,

You are correct, I forgot about that law. But in refreshing my memory, I find reports that some departments routinely ignore it (as they do with the FOPA) and make arrests anyway. That is done under department orders to make arrests in all questionable gun carry situations and let the higher-ups take care of the situation.

In addition, I have been told that some departments will honor the law ONLY if the officer is on official business, not on vacation or personal business, even though the law does not distinguish.

So, what I read does not add up to a well-understood "right" of police or retired police to carry a gun anywhere; in fact the law calls it a "privilege". In some areas, things are much as before and officers can't depend on the law to keep them from arrest if they are found carrying a gun. Note that there are no penalties assessed for police officers who simply ignore the law and arrest the carrier; the only recourse is under civil law.

Jim
 
But in refreshing my memory, I find reports that some departments routinely ignore it (as they do with the FOPA) and make arrests anyway. That is done under department orders to make arrests in all questionable gun carry situations and let the higher-ups take care of the situation.

In addition, I have been told that some departments will honor the law ONLY if the officer is on official business, not on vacation or personal business, even though the law does not distinguish.

So, what I read does not add up to a well-understood "right" of police or retired police to carry a gun anywhere; in fact the law calls it a "privilege". In some areas, things are much as before and officers can't depend on the law to keep them from arrest if they are found carrying a gun. Note that there are no penalties assessed for police officers who simply ignore the law and arrest the carrier; the only recourse is under civil law.
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I hate to say this but it sounds like hearsay. Where is this information coming from? Are you LEO and is this personal experience? Here is what I know. It was a huge deal when this law was signed. A huge deal in the LEO community. We've been travelling for years without one single hiccup. I have not personally ever been hassled, and none of my co-workers have. I know myself and many people who carried to the east coast, Washington DC and surrounding areas with zero problems. The only time carrying on the job becomes a factor is carrying on the airplane armed in situation like prisoner escorts. Otherwise there have been no issues. I've gone into federal buildings with zero issues armed and off duty. All of this stuff you are talking about is news to me and I've yet to hear anyone else confirm this talk. Nothing like this ever comes up in the national law enforcement news magazines while other issues in New York do get brought up. I would carry armed in New York and be completely conforted with the fact that I have a federal law backing me up.
 
In the past years or two, I've checked handguns in baggage in CA, MD, NC, TN, MS, KY, IN, MO, LA, GA, and Florida of course. I usually fly Delta or US Air, but occasionally fly Southwest. Every time I do it, I use a locked case inside soft luggage with a TSA lock. Some TSA or airline agents ask to see if it's loaded, others don't even want to see it. Some want the red tag in the case, some want it outside. In any case, there is rarely a problem.

One time it was a problem was a layover in Newark where I spent the night in the airport without my luggage, as it had to stay checked. It's the only time I've ever had a layover in a non-gun-friendly town, and it was the last.

Other times, I've had easily resolved problems. For example, I've traveled with firearm in a soft case inside of locked hard-sided luggage. It's legal, but it confuses people, and the TSA has to have you around to swab the inside of the suitcase. Also, their regulations allow you to have a loaded magazine inside a mag pouch, but it can confuse the TSA because they don't see it very often, so I avoid that.
 
LEOSA Issues

The case itself deals with a LEOSA issue for travelling LEOs. It also references a New York case as part of the decision. There were some other LEOSA issues that came up in the search, but I could not find links to the articles that were still active.

Anecdotally, the guy who ran my Chicago firearms permit class, who was an ex-Chicago cop, spoke of instances where Chicago and NYC hassled and arrested LEOs carrying under LEOSA. But that's stories in a classroom so take it for what its worth.
 
My experience mirrors wayne's. It really is a minor issue. Show up early, know your TSA & airline rules.

Only issues I have ever had are while flying out of SJC in CA. They will check your case, but then come and get your keys so TSA can swab the interior. They do not allow you to be present. Other issue I had there is more a matter of gun safety. Counter clerk made me prove unloaded on a colt sa. I notified him that I would need to cock it in order to do that and then proceeded. IMO cocking a gun at the checkin counter is not a great idea. Next time I will just remove the cylinder.
 
The case itself deals with a LEOSA issue for travelling LEOs. It also references a New York case as part of the decision. There were some other LEOSA issues that came up in the search, but I could not find links to the articles that were still active.

Anecdotally, the guy who ran my Chicago firearms permit class, who was an ex-Chicago cop, spoke of instances where Chicago and NYC hassled and arrested LEOs carrying under LEOSA. But that's stories in a classroom so take it for what its worth.
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There were issues in play in that case beyond a cop carrying over state lines on vacation and things have come a long way since 2008. LEOSA is well known throughout LE circles and was even expanded in 2010 by President Obama. Everybody knows about it and abides by it these days, I haven't seen or heard of any cops being hassled over out of state concealed carry in years.
Personally, I've carried out of state under LEOSA (I am active, not retired) since it's inception and have never had a problem anywhere, including Boston, NYC, Baltimore, Atlanta, and other big cities.

For the record, I've never had an issue checking a weapon on a flight either (nothing to do with being a LEO, I don't tell them that), I just claim the gun, show or assert that it's unloaded, sign the card and put it in the suitcase with the gun case. A couple of times TSA has checked my gun with me there, but that's never been a problem either.

Someone earlier said that your ammo must be packed separately, that's not true, in can be in the same case as your gun. I just pack it in the original box since it's easier and complies with everyone's rules and, again, I've never had a problem.
 
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