cartridge selection

[Webleymkv]

I don't see any real advantage of a 357 out of a 2 inch snubby compared to a 38+ or 9mm round out of a two or 2.5 inch 38 or nine barrel.

Moving to a 3 inch or longer barrel then the the 110gr 357 is pretty much the same as the better 9mm or 9mm+.

A 357 125gr out of a 3inch or longer gun has energy advantages over the 9mm+P...so it becomes a question, at this level, which do you shoot better.

If we look at Ballistics by the Inch, we see that from the 3" T/C Encore barrel (this would be analagous to a 2" revolver barrel since BBTI includes the chamber in the barrel length as is done with a semi-auto) that all of the 125gr .357 Magnum loadings tested are running 1250+fps while the fastest 9mm loading of comparable weight, the Cor-Bon 125gr +P, is running 1170fps from the same barrel length with the Federal 124gr Hydra-Shok and Speer 124gr Short Barrel Gold Dot running 988fps and 1108fps respectively.

Likewise, all of the 140gr or heavier .357 Magnum loadings are running 1,100fps or faster while no 9mm loading heavier than 125gr managed to break 1,000fps from the same 3" barrel length with Federal 135gr Hydra-Shok coming closest with 976fps.

From the 3" barrel, none of the .38 Special loadings tested could break 1,000fps regardless of their weight with the fastest being Cor-Bon 110gr DPX at 963fps.

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/357mag.html

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/9luger.html

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/38special.html

A 357 with heavier cartridges, to me, posses significant problems of over penetration if your shooting humans.

It depends on how much penetration you want I suppose. In the FBI tests, Winchester 145gr Silvertip .357 Magnum penetrated 15.8" in bare gelatin and 12.9" in clothed gelatin while Federal 158gr JHP penetrated 16.5" in bare gelatin and 15.9 in clothed gelatin. The Federal 158gr Hydra-Shok did penetrate excessively at 24.7" in bare gelatin and 34.5" in clothed gelatin likely due to lackluster expansion from low velocity (it was fired from a 3" barrel)

http://www.firearmstactical.com/ammo_data/357magnum.htm

By comparison, of the 147gr 9mm loadings tested (there are too many to list them all) penetration was 12.9-22.1" in bare gelatin and 15.6-22.85" in clothed gelatin.

http://www.firearmstactical.com/ammo_data/9mm.htm

Now, the FBI defines desirable penetration as 12-16", so the 145gr Winchester Silvertip .357 is within those parameters and the 158gr Federal .357 only exceeds them by 1/2". The 147gr 9mm loadings, however do not penetrate substantially less than the heavier .357 Magnum loadings and, in many cases, actually penetrate substantially more. Thus, I think it would be safe to say that heavyweight .357 Magnum loadings are available which offer no greater risk of overpenetration than 147gr 9mm loadings do.

Personally, I like the milder 110gr 357 but I'm shooting a 3 inch S&W 65 which is not too heavy so the heavier loads kick more than I like.

Recoil is a very subjective thing and what one person finds excessive another may not. I do not find normal factory 158gr .357 Magnum ammunition to be uncontrollable, or particularly unpleasant, in my 2 1/2" M66. I should note, however, that the grips have been replaced with ones that fit my hands well, that I'm a fairly large individual (6'4" and 300+lbs), and that I do a fair amount of shooting with other heavy recoiling guns and thus am accustomed to recoil.

 

[BlueTrain]

I think a point of confusion here with the .357 magnum and only with that cartridge, is that people say recoil when they are really referring to a different sensation, that of blast. At least when the 125-grain loads are the subject. I think I mentioned that I've shot very few 158-grain loads. In both a 3-inch and a 4-inch K-frame, the recoil was not particularly bad but the blast was something else. With a large frame and longer barrel, it isn't quite as bad but the blast is still noticeable.

With a .44 magnum as well as the .41 magnum, you sort of expect a lot of recoil and blast and you're never disappointed. However, from reading other threads, one is surprised that the police do not use either the .44 magnum or the .45 Colt in great numbers, loaded of course with hard cast semi-wadcutters.

While the bullet does the work, there's more to it than that. But one could also say the plow does the work and not the horse doing the pulling.

You can talk about how similiar certain pistol cartridges and certain revolver cartridges are, the dynamics of the two forms of handguns are quite different, not to mention the shape of the two guns. Revolvers are also a little more versatile, which may or may not be of any value. If your revolver (a Colt, of course) spends most of its time in the top right desk drawer in your study on the 14th floor of your apartment building, you probably don't worry much about how effective it'll be on alligators. But if you are, I'd go for the more powerful round.

 

[Don P]

Sig? I thought he is the captain of the Northwestern The discussion and controversy of cartridges and there effectiveness will never end

 

[Bob Wright]

My choice is the revolver in .44 Special. My ammunition is the Remington semi-jacketed hollow point at about 950 fps muzzle velocity. This bullet has a very short jacket with plenty of exposed, soft lead with a hollow point like Meteor Crater.

Bob Wright

 

[peacefulgary]

I prefer the 9mm Para.
If you do your job they will do theirs.