<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Remember one thing it matters not at 5 yards weather you pop someone with #6 or 00 or a slug the energy is all in one spot, a .223 may do the same but it will certainly penetrate much more than the #6 shot.[/quote]
Energy does not cause incapacitating wounds. "Energy Dump" is a myth, and is not in itself a factor in wounding, though it does cause the large temporary cavity found in high velocity rifle wounds. What the bullet and it's interaction with the target tissue (penetration, fragmenting, expansion, shattering bone, etc.)do to critical structures is all that matters.
The buck that you describe being hit in the shoulder bone probably suffered much greater wounds because the slug probably shattered the bone creating secondary missiles, and went into near immediate shock. I guarantee you it was not actually brain dead for at least 10-15 seconds. The smaller doe you describe demonstrates my point about not being able to stop anything quickly and reliably with any kind of gun. It lost both lungs and had a damaged heart, but was able to run 70 yards because it still had oxygen in the blood for a short period of time. People work the same way, like the lil black shirted chaps you describe.
As far as knocking someone back, that's a function of momentum (mass*velocity) and not energy. A .223 has a lot of energy (mass*velocity^2), but not nearly as much momentum as a 12 ga slug, so it won't knock anything over. Shooting a solid steel plate is not a valid comparison, as that is a perfectly elastic collision, whereas a slug hitting even an armored person transfers its momentum over a much longer period of time and space. People also react differently and less consistently than steel plates. Will it drive an armored person back? I can't say for sure because there are so many other variables, but I would not rely on this "stun" effect to save my life. Stunning someone does not stop them from getting back up and shooting at you again. And a slug is also a HUGE overpenetration risk compared to a .223 or a pistol caliber.
Energy does not cause incapacitating wounds. "Energy Dump" is a myth, and is not in itself a factor in wounding, though it does cause the large temporary cavity found in high velocity rifle wounds. What the bullet and it's interaction with the target tissue (penetration, fragmenting, expansion, shattering bone, etc.)do to critical structures is all that matters.
The buck that you describe being hit in the shoulder bone probably suffered much greater wounds because the slug probably shattered the bone creating secondary missiles, and went into near immediate shock. I guarantee you it was not actually brain dead for at least 10-15 seconds. The smaller doe you describe demonstrates my point about not being able to stop anything quickly and reliably with any kind of gun. It lost both lungs and had a damaged heart, but was able to run 70 yards because it still had oxygen in the blood for a short period of time. People work the same way, like the lil black shirted chaps you describe.
As far as knocking someone back, that's a function of momentum (mass*velocity) and not energy. A .223 has a lot of energy (mass*velocity^2), but not nearly as much momentum as a 12 ga slug, so it won't knock anything over. Shooting a solid steel plate is not a valid comparison, as that is a perfectly elastic collision, whereas a slug hitting even an armored person transfers its momentum over a much longer period of time and space. People also react differently and less consistently than steel plates. Will it drive an armored person back? I can't say for sure because there are so many other variables, but I would not rely on this "stun" effect to save my life. Stunning someone does not stop them from getting back up and shooting at you again. And a slug is also a HUGE overpenetration risk compared to a .223 or a pistol caliber.
. I also agree that a slug will have more penetration than a load of shot, if you re-read my first post I was refering to the fact that some say that a slug will possibly kill some persons even with a vest. A slug does penetrate yes, but not as much as a FMJ from .223 or any load in my .44 Mag. I have experimented with this in some old buildings here. My choice and what I keep at hand is a Rem 1100 12 guage with a 20 inch barrel and loaded with 2 3/4 #4 Magnum for 4 rounds.....the fifth is a slug, for just in case. If anyone is interested E-mail me and I will tell you about a 110 pound 2 legged critter (In a black suit) in a Sampan and a .357 magnum with 125 grain hollow points (not quite Geneva Convention 
OOPS!!