Bullet Weight Question

For over 30 years most manufacturers of defensive ammunition have sought to meet the FBI's standards for penetration and expansion. This includes penetration and expansion after passing through barriers. I linked to this information earlier in this thread, that is what the criteria are.

We can go to websites to see what bullets are built to do that. You can go to Brassfetcher or LuckyGunner and see results. As well as other places.

Point being most ammo for defensive purposes does this. Meets the standards or comes very close.

Most ball ammo penetrates very well.

The Buick O' Truth that I linked to earlier, shows 22 l.r. jacketed ammo penetrating windshields.

Car and truck doors these days are most often not steel but plastic, aluminum and very thin steel alloy.

tipoc
 
"...through auto glass or even a car door..." That's not a good idea with any bullet. Kill or otherwise damage the driver and you now have an uncontrolled, one ton plus, projectile. Makes no difference if you're a cop or not either.
There's no reason or excuse for shooting at a moving vehicle. Especially with a hand gun. Doing so is irresponsible. Even if the driver is aiming his 1 ton plus projectile at you. You will not stop a vehicle with any firearm. Physics doesn't allow it.
It's got nothing to do with the bullet weight anyway. It's about bullet construction.
"...the FBI's standards..." They're not now nor have they ever been the arbiter of any such thing. They're cops who use what they're told to use. Same as any cop.
 
There's no reason or excuse for shooting at a moving vehicle.
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Actually there is, particularly from an LEO perspective. If the driver is actively trying to seriously injure and/or kill people, the LEO will engage in all manner of behavior in the hope (however slim) of stopping the individual. They do that kind of thing all the time however poorly thought out. I think oftentimes they are looking for maybe even that "lucky shot" for fear of having to explain or incur liability when they let someone get away and subsequently seriously injure or kill someone afterward. I don't necessarily agree but I understand the thinking. It's certainly a gamble but I don't recall seeing too many officers getting prosecuted for shooting at a driver in that kind of scenario where they either miss and hit a bystander or the driver scoots away in a panic and/or wounded/dying and hit somebody.
 
In this question about the wisdom of shooting at moving vehicles the issue is can I make a shot that can end the immediate danger posed and does not endanger others and that is justified. It's actually the same question that is asked and answered any time a shot is taken at another human.

It's not an absolute abstract question it's concrete and based on the situation.

"Never shoot at a moving vehicle!" Really? Never? This is an absolute statement and I don't know that it helps folks on how to judge when to shoot and when to not shoot. Actually it does not help because it presents no criteria on which to base a decision.

tipoc
 
We just had a shooting in my small town. BG’s pulled up to a guy on the sidewalk, passenger sticks a gun out the window (attempted robbery? Drug deal gone bad?). Guy on the sidewalk moves off line and puts 5 rounds into the passenger door. 4 of the 5 hit the BG. THROUGH the door.

There are times when shooting into a vehicle is appropriate.
 
You want a 9mm load exclusively for shooting into or out from vehicles, go with a 147 +p hard cast. One of the outside “ranges” I got to shoot at had plenty of targets to test loads, from tv sets to cars.
 
Federal/Speer is owned by Vista Outdoors and already tested this for you. Jk, they did it for law enforcement as the largest ammunition company in America. What do they know as a sister company of ATK which puts rockets in space...

:)

https://le.vistaoutdoor.com/wound_ballistics/load_comparison/load_comparison.aspx

Contrary to what people think, when metal is harder it is becomes more likely to shatter. Ie the strongest chain is Grade 120. Grade 120 lifts more than any other Grade, but nick it or physically attack it? Destroyed. So Hard Cast usually gets thrown around like it's depleted uranium. It ain't. Hard Cast easily shatters (break up) on hard surfaces. Then you just lost your mass forward of the break.
 
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Federal/Speer is owned by Vista Outdoors and already tested this for you. Jk, they did it for law enforcement as the largest ammunition company in America. What do they know as a sister company of ATK which puts rockets in space...
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I had forgotten all about that site. Thanks for the link.
 
wild cat mccane said:
No problem.



Pretty much don't have to read anything in this thread but that link. :)
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Phew, man going forward we can save all sorts of time. Rather than have people discuss and share their opinions and experiences we can just do Google searches.

Sarcasm aside that is a useful link. I do think there's other information in this thread still worth reading (and no I'm not so vain as to mean my own).

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
 
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wild cat mccane said:
Federal/Speer is owned by Vista Outdoors and already tested this for you. Jk, they did it for law enforcement as the largest ammunition company in America. What do they know as a sister company of ATK which puts rockets in space...

:)

https://le.vistaoutdoor.com/wound_ballistics/load_comparison/load_comparison.aspx

Contrary to what people think, when metal is harder it is becomes more likely to shatter. Ie the strongest chain is Grade 120. Grade 120 lifts more than any other Grade, but nick it or physically attack it? Destroyed. So Hard Cast usually gets thrown around like it's depleted uranium. It ain't. Hard Cast easily shatters (break up) on hard surfaces. Then you just lost your mass forward of the break.
Click to expand...
Holy jesus!!! I checked out for a little while revisted to find this link. A lot of useful information here. Many thanks!
 
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