Bullet Casting Help
- Thread starter Mosin-Marauder
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Mosin-Marauder
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Okay, got it. Going to save up my work/ birthday money and get everything I need. 
FrankenMauser
New member
I saw water dropping mentioned.
So, I figured the obligatory warning was in order:
Water is your enemy around a casting pot. If a drop of water falls into your molten alloy, or a wet bullet is tossed into the alloy, the water with flash to steam explosively and spray molten lead all over the place. That molten, flying lead will burn any exposed skin, and stick to it. It will burn your eyes, and stick to them. It will do very bad things to any body part it hits. **
Many casters refer to such events as a "visit from the tinsel fairy" because once it happens, everything is covered in strings, globs, and spatters of lead that make it look like a fairy threw tinsel and glitter all over.
To avoid visits from the tinsel fairy, you must always make sure you're using DRY ingots; not sweating on your tools, bullets, or pot; and make sure that any water-dropping apparatus is assembled or built in such a way as to be below the level of the melting pot, be incapable of splashing, and keep anyone from easily retrieving bullets that might be mistakenly put into the pot while wet. (Most people use angled towels clamped to a bucket, and/or bench in some way. There are many examples on the castboolits forums.)
If you have suspect ingots or scrap, put it in a COLD (or at least empty) pot, and heat it up from there. As the metal comes up to temperature, it will dry any moisture present before getting hot enough for the alloy to melt.
--Alternatively, you could use a separate vessel for pre-heating ingots and/or scrap. My father, for example, used to use a cast iron frying pan on a coleman stove to get his ingots to about 350-375 F, before they went into the casting pot. It was a constant shuffle: Cold ingots went in one side. Hot ingots came out the other, and into the casting pot.
As a bonus, the pre-heated ingots don't take as long to melt in the pot, and they don't drop the temperature of the melt as much.
**There are several members of the castboolits forums that have shared their experiences with tinsel fairy visits that resulted in lead hitting their eyeballs. In every case, the lead caused their tears to flash to steam and offer some protection to the eyeball, but there was still enough retained heat in the lead to continue burning the eye and it didn't do anything for their skin. In ALL cases I've seen, the splattered lead had to be removed from their eyes by a doctor, after an excruciating trip to the hospital.
In one case, the guy couldn't even close his eye. He had a large glob of lead fused to his eyeball and eyelids, and just had to keep squirting saline into his eye during the trip to the hospital, and while waiting for a surgeon to figure out what to do.
So, I figured the obligatory warning was in order:
Water is your enemy around a casting pot. If a drop of water falls into your molten alloy, or a wet bullet is tossed into the alloy, the water with flash to steam explosively and spray molten lead all over the place. That molten, flying lead will burn any exposed skin, and stick to it. It will burn your eyes, and stick to them. It will do very bad things to any body part it hits. **
Many casters refer to such events as a "visit from the tinsel fairy" because once it happens, everything is covered in strings, globs, and spatters of lead that make it look like a fairy threw tinsel and glitter all over.
To avoid visits from the tinsel fairy, you must always make sure you're using DRY ingots; not sweating on your tools, bullets, or pot; and make sure that any water-dropping apparatus is assembled or built in such a way as to be below the level of the melting pot, be incapable of splashing, and keep anyone from easily retrieving bullets that might be mistakenly put into the pot while wet. (Most people use angled towels clamped to a bucket, and/or bench in some way. There are many examples on the castboolits forums.)
If you have suspect ingots or scrap, put it in a COLD (or at least empty) pot, and heat it up from there. As the metal comes up to temperature, it will dry any moisture present before getting hot enough for the alloy to melt.
--Alternatively, you could use a separate vessel for pre-heating ingots and/or scrap. My father, for example, used to use a cast iron frying pan on a coleman stove to get his ingots to about 350-375 F, before they went into the casting pot. It was a constant shuffle: Cold ingots went in one side. Hot ingots came out the other, and into the casting pot.
As a bonus, the pre-heated ingots don't take as long to melt in the pot, and they don't drop the temperature of the melt as much.
**There are several members of the castboolits forums that have shared their experiences with tinsel fairy visits that resulted in lead hitting their eyeballs. In every case, the lead caused their tears to flash to steam and offer some protection to the eyeball, but there was still enough retained heat in the lead to continue burning the eye and it didn't do anything for their skin. In ALL cases I've seen, the splattered lead had to be removed from their eyes by a doctor, after an excruciating trip to the hospital.
In one case, the guy couldn't even close his eye. He had a large glob of lead fused to his eyeball and eyelids, and just had to keep squirting saline into his eye during the trip to the hospital, and while waiting for a surgeon to figure out what to do.
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http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?83651-A-myth-about-water-and-molten-lead
Frank, look at the above link on castboolits . com. While it's a real bad idea to drop water on hot alloy, it doesn't always explode. As mentioned in that thread, the water HAS to get under the surface of the molten lead to cause the steam explosion.
Frank, look at the above link on castboolits . com. While it's a real bad idea to drop water on hot alloy, it doesn't always explode. As mentioned in that thread, the water HAS to get under the surface of the molten lead to cause the steam explosion.
Mosin-Marauder
New member
Well...umm...might rethink casting a bit before I buy anything. Just uh...yeah. thanks.
nemesiss45
New member
I have a couple more points real quick.
on fluxing, I have not seen it mentioned, but you really need to stir yours lead while you flux. toss your wax on, let it smoke, and ignite it. then stir the pot vigorously (not so vigorously that you splash lead though... I did that once when my pot was too full... bad mojo...). I also like to scrape the sides of the pot to get all the gunk out.
water and hot lead IS a bad mix... but a drop on the top of the molten lead will just dance and turn to steam. a wet chunk of lead tossed into the pot will carry the water under the surface of the lead, very likely spraying lead out. if you water drop, like I do, never, ever, ever, toss your defect bullets back in to the mix. I just let them wait until my next session to know they are bone dry.
on fluxing, I have not seen it mentioned, but you really need to stir yours lead while you flux. toss your wax on, let it smoke, and ignite it. then stir the pot vigorously (not so vigorously that you splash lead though... I did that once when my pot was too full... bad mojo...). I also like to scrape the sides of the pot to get all the gunk out.
water and hot lead IS a bad mix... but a drop on the top of the molten lead will just dance and turn to steam. a wet chunk of lead tossed into the pot will carry the water under the surface of the lead, very likely spraying lead out. if you water drop, like I do, never, ever, ever, toss your defect bullets back in to the mix. I just let them wait until my next session to know they are bone dry.
FrankenMauser
New member
I was after the general concept, more than technical specifics.
However, I very much disagree with generalized statements that are commonly put forth on this subject, along the lines of, "water is less dense than lead and water drops won't break the surface." I agree with the theory, but not the reality of the situation.
I have witnessed both water drops AND ice, in the form of hail (even less dense), penetrate the surface of molten alloy and cause tinsel eruptions.
The bottom line is: Moisture + molten lead = bad day.
Mosin-Marauder
New member
Okay. You're scaring me. So I can't cast when it's humid outside because the lead will condensate, and if I sweat on any of my tools, I get an explosion. Sounds perfectly safe.
Don't add cold lead to a pot half full of liquid lead on a really humid day. Wear safety glasses. That's about it. You might want to wear welding gloves (I don't while I'm casting, but I have some handy)
If you add lead to a cold pot, you don't even care whether the lead is wet because it'll be dry by the time it melts.
I don't believe 90% of the stories about 1 drop of sweat falling the pot and exploding. It will explode if you get a drop below the surface somehow (tossing it a piece of lead with condensation or a tiny trapped pocket of water.)
If you add lead to a cold pot, you don't even care whether the lead is wet because it'll be dry by the time it melts.
I don't believe 90% of the stories about 1 drop of sweat falling the pot and exploding. It will explode if you get a drop below the surface somehow (tossing it a piece of lead with condensation or a tiny trapped pocket of water.)
Mosin-Marauder
New member
So, if I just wipe off the lead before I toss it in, it should be fine?
If there's any doubt about the lead that you are adding.... just bake it at 250-300 in your oven for a while (use an OLD cookie sheet). You can then add it without worry, either as soon as you are sure it is up to 250° or the next time you cast. You can even warm the ingots to be added on a hot plate, but you have to be careful to get them hot enough to dry, without accidently getting the points of contact hot enough to make a melted mess on the hot plate.
Casting can be done safely if you use common sense and be aware of what you are doing, all the time. Just remember you are working with a liquid that is 700 degrees. You don't want to spill it on you or have it splashed on you.
And remember that the tools you are using are also at a temp close to that. I will get reminded of that way more often by accidentally bumping/touching the pot edge or a mold or mold handles than I do with an accidental drip that splattered on the table.
Casting can be done safely if you use common sense and be aware of what you are doing, all the time. Just remember you are working with a liquid that is 700 degrees. You don't want to spill it on you or have it splashed on you.
And remember that the tools you are using are also at a temp close to that. I will get reminded of that way more often by accidentally bumping/touching the pot edge or a mold or mold handles than I do with an accidental drip that splattered on the table.
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kilimanjaro
New member
Add a welder's apron to your list of safety gear.
Instead of dropping them in water, just use a damp towel on a cookie sheet, drop the bullets on that, they cool off just fine.
Any bad bullets come out of the mold and on the cookie sheet, DO NOT toss them back in the pot, wait until the next smelt session. There is never any reason to hurry or shortcut any process in casting or reloading.
Instead of dropping them in water, just use a damp towel on a cookie sheet, drop the bullets on that, they cool off just fine.
Any bad bullets come out of the mold and on the cookie sheet, DO NOT toss them back in the pot, wait until the next smelt session. There is never any reason to hurry or shortcut any process in casting or reloading.
Two times I have had lead blow out of the pot, once was a unsuspected deluge that caught me with my smelting pot sitting within range of the water pouring off the roof. Got so bad so quick I could hardly get to the valve on the propane tank to shut things down. The mess was a real PITA to clean up. The show was awesome, seeing molten lead shoot up 3+ feet in the air and spread out over about 6' of ground was really impressive.
The other time was smelting down WW's and had one with moisture in it that had been sitting inside my shop for a couple of years. Who knew. IT was however MUCH less than the above show, but did launch molten lead up close to 2ft out of the pot. Luckily for me I was well out of the way.
Overall however I have not had any issues what so ever while smelting down over a ton of alloy or while pouring up several thousand bullets. As long as you pay attention to what your doing, and wear something that will absorb the heat should you get a drip or splatter on you while pouring your going to be just fine. That said, trust me when I say, dripping alloy on you at somewhere north of 650 degrees is going to leave a mark, even through denim jeans. Just be careful and use common sense and you should be fine.
The other time was smelting down WW's and had one with moisture in it that had been sitting inside my shop for a couple of years. Who knew. IT was however MUCH less than the above show, but did launch molten lead up close to 2ft out of the pot. Luckily for me I was well out of the way.
Overall however I have not had any issues what so ever while smelting down over a ton of alloy or while pouring up several thousand bullets. As long as you pay attention to what your doing, and wear something that will absorb the heat should you get a drip or splatter on you while pouring your going to be just fine. That said, trust me when I say, dripping alloy on you at somewhere north of 650 degrees is going to leave a mark, even through denim jeans. Just be careful and use common sense and you should be fine.
FrankenMauser
New member
Yea...
When I sold my house in Utah, last year, there was still lead splattered all over the driveway from a tinsel fairy visit 2 years prior (spontaneous hail storm on a calm, clear, 95 degree summer day).
I removed a little here, a little there, and put quite a bit of effort in before listing the house ...but that stuff just didn't want to come off. The buyers thought it was from some kids making a mess with "glitter glue".