TylerD45ACP
New member
I just held a 3 inch model 13 38Special in just about mint condition. What a nice revolver. I want the same one but 357. I think it would make a good backup.
BUG really needed?
- Thread starter leathermarshmallow
- Start date
Tyler... A model 13 IS a .357.
OK... In the past as a police officer, and later while doing security duties I carried a back-up gun as a matter or course. While operating in the civilian world I amost never carry more than one firearm, with a second load. However there are times when a back-up gun is IMO a good idea as a civilian. My regular job finds me in different neighborhood's, at all hours.
When I'm dispatched to a ahhhh depressed property, or to a depressed area I often carry a second firearm. When I'm dispatched to any area late at night, or in the early morning I usually carry a second gun.
My logic is this... I believe that me being a stranger, a little older, with a regular job in a depressed area, or location makes me prime victim material. I know that most robbery's, and muggings are crimes of oppertunity. Thus the chances of my being a victim are much higher.
Further I know that predatory humans tend to hunt at night. The night enhances their stealthiness (if thats a word), and ability to make good their escape. Also people who conduct their business at night tend to be (not everyone) on the shady side. Looking for a 15 minute girlfriend, looking for drugs, out after a night of drinking, etc. And are less likely to call police. And predators know this. So IMO I believe that my chances of being made a victim in the late night or early morning are much higher.
So under some conditions I carry a second gun. Am I paranoid? yep.
While to some with confortable secure life styles, and living in secure communities... Carrying a second gun seems silly. While some who enjoy different lifestyles, and a different kind of a community will wonder how anyone cant understand the need for a second gun. I think it's all a matter of personal needs, and threat level's.
Glenn Dee.
OK... In the past as a police officer, and later while doing security duties I carried a back-up gun as a matter or course. While operating in the civilian world I amost never carry more than one firearm, with a second load. However there are times when a back-up gun is IMO a good idea as a civilian. My regular job finds me in different neighborhood's, at all hours.
When I'm dispatched to a ahhhh depressed property, or to a depressed area I often carry a second firearm. When I'm dispatched to any area late at night, or in the early morning I usually carry a second gun.
My logic is this... I believe that me being a stranger, a little older, with a regular job in a depressed area, or location makes me prime victim material. I know that most robbery's, and muggings are crimes of oppertunity. Thus the chances of my being a victim are much higher.
Further I know that predatory humans tend to hunt at night. The night enhances their stealthiness (if thats a word), and ability to make good their escape. Also people who conduct their business at night tend to be (not everyone) on the shady side. Looking for a 15 minute girlfriend, looking for drugs, out after a night of drinking, etc. And are less likely to call police. And predators know this. So IMO I believe that my chances of being made a victim in the late night or early morning are much higher.
So under some conditions I carry a second gun. Am I paranoid? yep.
While to some with confortable secure life styles, and living in secure communities... Carrying a second gun seems silly. While some who enjoy different lifestyles, and a different kind of a community will wonder how anyone cant understand the need for a second gun. I think it's all a matter of personal needs, and threat level's.
Glenn Dee.
A while back, one fellow posted that he carried two big Glocks, two little Glocks, two spare magazines for each, two boxes of ammo, two Bowie knives, and a pair of nunchuks. I guess he didn't want to take any chances. (I don't know how he moved; must have been a big guy, or maybe just a big something else.)
Jim
Jim
Claude Clay
New member
i train and teach not a BUG but the concept of a Secondary Weapon.
life comes at you fast and from many differnt directions. that is why we train with both hands and practice failour drills.
if you call it a Back Up Gun that has you to thinking about it (if at all) when something wrong happens with your main (or Primary) gun
if you label them as Primary and Secondary than mentally a whole lot of options open up all at once.
life comes at you fast and from many differnt directions. that is why we train with both hands and practice failour drills.
if you call it a Back Up Gun that has you to thinking about it (if at all) when something wrong happens with your main (or Primary) gun
if you label them as Primary and Secondary than mentally a whole lot of options open up all at once.
Yes, but a gunfight in Tiffany's looks more like a John Woo movie. A fabulous John Woo movie.
Yep. I generally have my range bag with me in the car, and I've got a second gun, as well as ammo. (It should also be mentioned that I have the means to secure it while I'm away from the vehicle.)
Hey, the nation's shopping malls are a battleground during the holidays. Who's keeping 'em safe?
You betcha
Gun Jams
This evening I saw a cop show where the dash cam showed the officer walk up to the car he stopped, got to the driver window and got shot. Vest protected him but stepping back and firing his auto jams after the second shot. Happens to the best. At the range today and my NAA .22mag decides to lock up. Take it apart, can't see anything broke, put back together and it decides when it wants the cylinder to rotate or not. This was my bug for lack of having money for a better bug. BG's now take your'e cell phone when they rob you. A extra cell phone on you makes sense. Cops carry radios and cell phones. In the old west lots of cowboys carried more than one handgun and extra bullets. We're not that much more civilized now days. To each their own.
This evening I saw a cop show where the dash cam showed the officer walk up to the car he stopped, got to the driver window and got shot. Vest protected him but stepping back and firing his auto jams after the second shot. Happens to the best. At the range today and my NAA .22mag decides to lock up. Take it apart, can't see anything broke, put back together and it decides when it wants the cylinder to rotate or not. This was my bug for lack of having money for a better bug. BG's now take your'e cell phone when they rob you. A extra cell phone on you makes sense. Cops carry radios and cell phones. In the old west lots of cowboys carried more than one handgun and extra bullets. We're not that much more civilized now days. To each their own.
Flint Ridge
New member
Tyler hit on my point and others filled in as well. All sorts of reasons the primary fails, or you're simply on the move and fumble it - then what. Things fail. Handoff to The Bride, fastest reload.
Personally I carry a 380 and an extra mag. However, now that I have an LCR - 357, I like having both, but that one is The Bride's (w/38's).
How many is too many? Supposedly one chap was pulled over - forgot the State - but you have to tell the law as they arrive. So he said NINE! As in 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8...9. How could you walk, stand or be driving a car? I'd have to have them all the same or I would get totally screwed up. I'd draw one and another would drop out from somewhere. Be like a magic trick gone bad...
Maybe one in each front pocket - 2 - rear pockets - 4 - ankles - 6 - armpits - 8 and one at 4 o'clock is 9?
All what you are comfortable with, to each his own. Must say when traveling out of State like Baltimore and DC this summer I felt pretty vulnerable with the wife, kids and nothing in my pockets but cash.... oh and a couple of Knives!
Personally I carry a 380 and an extra mag. However, now that I have an LCR - 357, I like having both, but that one is The Bride's (w/38's).
How many is too many? Supposedly one chap was pulled over - forgot the State - but you have to tell the law as they arrive. So he said NINE! As in 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8...9. How could you walk, stand or be driving a car? I'd have to have them all the same or I would get totally screwed up. I'd draw one and another would drop out from somewhere. Be like a magic trick gone bad...
Maybe one in each front pocket - 2 - rear pockets - 4 - ankles - 6 - armpits - 8 and one at 4 o'clock is 9?
All what you are comfortable with, to each his own. Must say when traveling out of State like Baltimore and DC this summer I felt pretty vulnerable with the wife, kids and nothing in my pockets but cash.... oh and a couple of Knives!
orionengnr
New member
Except for one rather big thing....When you get into the whole "two is one and one is none" bit, then where does this train of "logic" end?
If you have three then "three is two" and "two is one" and "one is none" ergo "three is none"...nah, I'm not buying into that.
More importantly, factor in the odds of your ever having to use it, compared to the sworn officer.
My bet comes down on the side of, nearly zero.
However, as has been repeatedly stated, it's not so much the odds as the stakes.
As such, if you want to carry two or three guns, that is your choice, and far be it from me to argue.
Me, I'll take my chances with just one....and if I bet wrong, mark my headstone as such and use me as an eternal example of "poor choices".
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TylerD45ACP
New member
MY primary (Some Commander 1911 in the future S&W 1911 right now is my carry piece) I want to get a 3" model 13 as a BUG to my Commander 1911. I felt the 13 and it is light even with the bull barrel. (I would carry 1mag in 1911 + 2 reloads. Then the 13 with 1 reload. Sounds good to me .
.I'm unclear how this conundrum differs between police officers and citizens. Since we are talking about handguns carried on the person, and not factoring in a carbine or shotgun in the car, the concerns are the same; loss of primary, failure of primary, etc. If you do factor in those long guns the officer often has at his disposal, the importance of each handgun on the civilian is only magnified.
The existence of the potential for over-implementation of a reasonable practice is no reason to condemn the exercise of that practice to a reasonable degree. The possibility that a paper thin slice of the concealed carriers out there will carry more than one back-up gun needs not discredit the practice of carrying one. It's like saying that, because someone out there could decide to drive around carrying a full set of back-up tires, everyone who carries one spare is paranoid. It seems to me to be an overreaction to a largely theoretical equipment decision.
What are the odds of a private citizen having to use their gun compared to an officer? That is a good discussion on it's own. Is the use defensive or offensive. The private citizen is almost never going to be on the offense, going into a fight aware and prepared with a gun in his hand, a situation that is not uncommon in law enforcement. I would have to guess the civilian is more likely than an officer to find himself in need of a gun for defense, as he is a much more likely target for an assault than is a police officer. All but the scariest crazies tend to prefer us "soft" targets.
Where does it end? Truth be told, for most of us, on most days, it ends at one. For some of us, it ends at two, either daily or occasionally. We make this decision, for the same reason that reasonable humans make most day-to-day decisions: practicality. The vast majority of us are, after all, reasonable, and mostly practical, people. Of course, we are also easily self-deluded. The fact that one gun is generally comforting enough to me has no effect on the statistical reality that two guns provide better protection.
What are the odds that I will need that BUG? Even longer than the long odds that I will need the first gun. But, like you say, it's not about the odds, it's about the stakes. When the stakes are life-and-death, police officers and private citizens alike have every right to a back-up plan.
_Muad'dib_
New member
"What are the odds that I will need that BUG? Even longer than the long odds that I will need the first gun. But, like you say, it's not about the odds, it's about the stakes. When the stakes are life-and-death, police officers and private citizens alike have every right to a back-up plan. "
This makes the most sense to me. And since it's such a longshot to actually need it, make sure it's comfortable IMO. Like I said in another post, don't see a reason to carry two big caliber guns. If someone wants to I think that's fine. In all reality it's a better BUG. Just don't burn out on it.
This makes the most sense to me. And since it's such a longshot to actually need it, make sure it's comfortable IMO. Like I said in another post, don't see a reason to carry two big caliber guns. If someone wants to I think that's fine. In all reality it's a better BUG. Just don't burn out on it.
TylerD45ACP
New member
:barf::barf::barf: BRADY, you said. :barf:
MikeNice81
New member
I am seriously considerring carrying a BUG to go with a primary.
What if some one grabs my strong side arm and I can't get to my primary? If my strong side arm is cut or shot how am I going to get my primary out and ready?
If I have my daughter with me I much rather be able to move her in to a safe position with my strong arm and return or commence fire with my off hand.
There are many reasons to carry two guns. Including failures and such. So I think it is perfectly reasonable for some one to carry two guns. A knife is also a good idea in case you are in a wreck and need to cut your seat belt.
Leave the cuffs at home unless you are a cop. You don't want to risk a "false imprisonment" or kidnapping charge.
What if some one grabs my strong side arm and I can't get to my primary? If my strong side arm is cut or shot how am I going to get my primary out and ready?
If I have my daughter with me I much rather be able to move her in to a safe position with my strong arm and return or commence fire with my off hand.
There are many reasons to carry two guns. Including failures and such. So I think it is perfectly reasonable for some one to carry two guns. A knife is also a good idea in case you are in a wreck and need to cut your seat belt.
Leave the cuffs at home unless you are a cop. You don't want to risk a "false imprisonment" or kidnapping charge.
TylerD45ACP
New member
^+1 Those reasons and a billion more are ones to carry a BUG. Nice post.
I carried two revolvers to work everyday for 27 years. Never needed the backup, but it was reassuring to know it was there if I ever did. One of the nicest things about being retired is I have a choice of carrying or not. Today I normally carry one .357 with two reloads in the car. It’s also nice to realize that I don’t have to go anywhere where I may need two guns.
If having a bug with you makes you feel secure go for it, but I really don't see the need for most to carry one.
Dave, with all respect there are two BIG differences. The average police officer can expect to be sent into a potentially dangerous situation, whereas the average citizen will not be dispatched to a dangerous situation. Second, the average police office once aware of criminal activity must take actions, the average citizen should retreat if all possible.
If having a bug with you makes you feel secure go for it, but I really don't see the need for most to carry one.
Dave, with all respect there are two BIG differences. The average police officer can expect to be sent into a potentially dangerous situation, whereas the average citizen will not be dispatched to a dangerous situation. Second, the average police office once aware of criminal activity must take actions, the average citizen should retreat if all possible.
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spacecoast
New member
Trying to control your daughter with one hand and fire accurately with your other (weak) hand sounds like a dicey proposition at best. You might want to get her some earmuffs and practice that before you need to do it for real.