Buckshot or Birdshot?

It's your decision to make, for whatever reasons you care to make it. I use Federal LE-127 00 in the magazine and Brenneke KO 1-ounce slugs in the Sidesaddle.

IMHO the best bet is to have all your loved ones under cover behind you and your shotgun if trouble happens, and prepare your 'fatal funnels' in advance in the event of misses or overpenetration. Loaded bookshelves, filing cabinets, heavy furniture, decorative stone or brick interior walls, etc...

lpl
 
I dont load buckshot in mine when my kids are home, I use #4 turkey loads
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+1

Some times I have to laugh when we get to debating shotgun ammo for HD.
I love when guys are talking about staggering slugs and buckshot in there mag tube or what they carry in their side saddle (I am not trying to be a jerk, one of my shotguns is tacticool, I'll admit it;)) but who exactly do we expec to break into our houses? I had somebody tell me the other day that they keep some bird bombs in his side saddle in case he needs to lob one down the hall as a distraction!:eek: do we think we are going to have a squad of former green berets break in. my guess is that if, God forbid, I ever have to touch off a gun in my house its going to be against a thief or crackhead. and in all reality I'll probably be blind and deaf following the first shot.
 
Not so blind... My shot gun makes a small dark orange muzzle flash. Deaf? Yes!
Not expecting an armored intruder but given various seasons could be wearing alot of energy absorbing clothing. Just like hog doggin... I use bulldogs to catch the hog because the curr dogs just ain't got the knock down power even if heavier than the bulldog. Right dog for the right job just like ammo... But I do concede most home invaders are "turkeys"!:D
Brent
 
I have a sxs 'coach' gun I keep loaded with hi-brass #6 right bbl and 3" mag 00 left.
I have a pistol back-up, I sure would hate to have to blast anyone at all but an intruder at night is likely gonna get the #6 to legs and if I see any sort of weapon to the face.
 
Some times I have to laugh when we get to debating shotgun ammo for HD.
I love when guys are talking about staggering slugs and buckshot in there mag tube or what they carry in their side saddle (I am not trying to be a jerk, one of my shotguns is tacticool, I'll admit it) but who exactly do we expec to break into our houses? I had somebody tell me the other day that they keep some bird bombs in his side saddle in case he needs to lob one down the hall as a distraction! do we think we are going to have a squad of former green berets break in. my guess is that if, God forbid, I ever have to touch off a gun in my house its going to be against a thief or crackhead. and in all reality I'll probably be blind and deaf following the first shot.
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:D

I'm all for personal/self defense and people having as many guns as they'd like. But...I agree. I get considerable entertainment reading quite a few forums on the net about some people's plans. No doubt it's good to have well thought out plan, but some situations are rather amusing.

Kind of like the average Joe that has a 9-5 job working at some cubicle who has a ccw and carries a couple of bug's. More power to 'em, but really, what's the odds they'll need one bug, let alone two? I also imagine them sitting at their cubicle and suddenly some terrorist overtakes the office building and after average Joe exhausts his main ccw and primary bug, finally has to run through broken shards of glass to confront the main terrorist and at the last moment reaches for his secondary bug that is taped to his back and saves the day.

I guess you never know, it could happen.
 
do we think we are going to have a squad of former green berets break in.

No, I don't think so. It isn't likely, thank goodness.

But before you cavalierly dismiss the possibility completely, think about a certain former Navy Seal who went criminal. Or the former operator from a certain unmentionable unit who- surprise, surprise, regular psych evals notwithstanding- turned out to be a serial rapist (subsequently arrested, convicted and imprisoned).

While I don't suggest overestimating your opponents, you should be a little more careful about underestimating them too...

lpl
 
Essentially, which ammo is "best" for HD is almost as subjective a topic as which weapon is "best" for HD. Obviously, there are many factors to consider here when considering "ideal" ammo type (or weapon type for that matter). Your location of residence (apartment, house, urban, rural, etc.) will probably have quite a bit to do with such a decision.

Whatever you decide on, just become very familiar with it. Also, dont mix ammo within the tube (as some do) as this could become quite the detriment if the (expletive) should ever hit the fan. Chances are you wont have the time or the "mental awareness" necessary to keep track of nor utilize multiple types of ammo during a violent and brief HD encounter.

But, as I mentioned before, I personally prefer 00 buck as even birdshot can penetrate. Thus, if dealing with two types of penetrative ammo (even if one is a bit less so than another), I would certainly prefer to go with the more "powerful" of the two.
 
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I hope I didn't come arcoss the wrong way, I think that if you feel the need to have an armsel striker and an AR with an m203 attached for home protection, be my guest.
I'm bit trying to condem any one for there taste in home protection, more than a shotgun and a pistol on hand doesn't seem nessacary to me but thats just my feeling.
 
First two shots were : Federal Strut-Shok Turkey Load, 3-1/2", #4 Lead, 2 oz., 1300 fp.
Results: Full penetration @ the first wall-stand, all pellet stopped at the interior side of the second wall. Since he wasn't far from the wall, most pellets still hit in a fist-size radius, pretty good punch IMO.

Second two shots were: Remington Express Buckshot, 2-3/4" Shell, #00 Buck, 9 Pellets @ 1325 fps
Results: Full penetration of both interior and exterior wall. Close grouping in the first wall but in 4small holes+2 bigger holes, similar pattern displayed in the second wall (6 small holes, 1 bigger hole).


(I will post the photos tonight)
Conclusion:
I don't think I will use buckshot for HD anymore.
I will be using a combo of birdshot for close quarter defense scenario and slug for out door defense scenario.
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Ramp tech:

You damage your credibility and reputation here on this forum, by making such detailing claims like this, then promising the forum that you will follow up very quickly with documentation, and then totally failing to do so.

That really raises questions about your post.

.
 
I don't have sheetrock in my house. Penetration thru my walls will take alittle more than bird shot. So it's nothing but buckshot, if they get past all the dogs here. But then again I'm so far back in the woods that it ain't a issue.
 
This debate again?

Wow, here we are talking about the same thing again. Many things have been said here and many opinions have been expressed. what has not been said is the circumstances when each person chooses the weapon and round to use.

some say can the shotgun and use .223, some say use a handgun. some say 00 buck only. Some refer you to websites that shoot gel and some offer to shoot hogs and you choose. Some say do not over estimate your BG and some say don't under estimate your BG.

All of these have merit. None of them have validity in the original content of the OP. He was pointing out penatration into drywall. I found it interesting. I have personal experience with a 9mm silvertip and drywall, I have experience with .223 and 00buck shot at people inside buildings as well as 9mm Glazer rounds.

IMO, If you are using a weapon for HD, your target is 99.9% likely to be a crook looking to get some of your property for a quick buck. When you rack the chamber of a 12 guage he will likely run away. The rest of the time you will need to be prepared to use your weapon. In that case it seams that you could concievably kill with a .22LR, is it practical? Probably not.

Should you have to fire, I think it would be better to kill the first time out. Our gunners were armed with 00 buck and trained to skip the round for riot control, I would have no problem loading #4 lead BBs in my shotgun for HD. I would be interested to know how that round does with drywall.

This is not meant to put anyone down, just remember before you give advice, that the circumstances for a particular weapon's use for HD is different for different people. I live in the country, my needs are not the same as someone who lives in South Central LA or one who lives in an apartment in New York.

Mel
 
Turkey load (yeah I know turkeys a bird) is IMHO a good in-between bird and buck.
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#4 buckshot or maybe BB is probably the sweet spot IMO. You don't see much lead BB anymore and the waterfowl loads tend to have pretty stiff recoil.

There's no difference between a #4 "turkey load" and a #4 "squirrel load". I don't know why people keep talking about "turkey loads" here.

No one would consider picking a HD handgun ammo that has a fraction of the penetration of a .22 short or 25 ACP yet the same people recommend birdshot that does exactly that.
 
No one would consider picking a HD handgun ammo that has a fraction of the penetration of a .22 short or 25 ACP yet the same people recommend birdshot that does exactly that
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thats exactly why I pick it, don't want to shoot my neighbors through a wall.
just my opinion though, you are entiteled to yours.
 
Stop the threat:

That should be your first responsibility. Using what gives you the most confidence to stop the threat. Personally, I use Federal Low-Recoil 00 buckshot. It is still very effective and has good penetration and allows for more accurate follow up shots, (Says law enforcement on the box). It is a good alternative to the magnum buckshot loads (that may penetrate your walls of home and/or apartment). Bottom line though, use what you think will do the job....
 
pretty soon I want to find low recoil buckshot loads, but right now with the Obama rush still going, I grabbed what I could find in bulk (regular Remington 2 3/4" #4 & #00 buckshot); I also found a lone Remington 2 3/4" magnum #00 buckshot and tested it (12ga Mossberg 500 with short barrel) to see if it would be managable...interesting is putting it mildly :eek:

the recoil hit me so much that every time I got pushed rearwards I would endup unlocking the action and ejecting the empty shell (even as I was leaning forward to brace for the recoil); due to muscle memory and ingrained technique I was still trying to open the action to reload the weapon since I wasn't expecting to have the action already open from the recoil; summary...I stick with NORNAL loads until I can get reduced recoil loads; I will AVOID magnum loads since they recoil so much it causes an unexpected stoppage for followup shots
 
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