Browning Hi Pwr

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Hiker

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I was crusing my local gun store yesterday and I noticed a very nice looking Belguim made Browning Hi Pwr 9mm w/2 magazines(13rd.) on consignment for $369. I've never owned a Browning Hi Pwr but I've heard they are excelent pistols. I'm probably gonna buy it today, is their anything I should look for? Thanks in advace.
Hiker
 
Greetings, sir. On the used HP, check it like you would any other used semi. If it meets your requirements and you want it, buy it. One of the advantages of HPs is that because they've been here so long, there are still quite a few pre-ban hi-cap magazines to be found. They are high, but less expensive than some of the newer hi-caps of which fewer were made before the goofy '94 ban. I've owned and shot HPs for about 30 years. The current, new MkIIIs feed and fire about any type of bullet configuration right out of the box, but the same cannot be said for all of the older guns, which also had less desireable sights and safeties. Almost every HP ever made has a magazine disconnect, but this is easily removed for shooters not wanting them although some do counsel against this. Removal will improve the trigger pull by 10 - 20%, depending upon the specific gun.
For practice, I've had good luck with Pro-Mag aftermarket 13 rnd magazines. Thus, you could pick up some of these at about $15 a pop and save your factory hi-caps. Excellent parts to "upgrade" your HP are available from Cylinder & Slide including extended safeties,sears, hammer types, and stocks. Bar-Sto makes stainless steel match grade barrels for HPs should you desire one. If your gun balks on blunter HP bullets, try Remington's 115 gr +P as it has a rounded ogive and yields an average velocity of 1251 ft/sec from the std bbl on one of my HPs. I do replace the standard recoil spring with a Wolff 18.5lb conventional recoil spring. Expect groups of about 2 1/2" at 25 yards with loads it likes. Hope this is of use. Best.
 
The High Power (or P-35) is an excellent pistol...one of my favorites. Check the piece over for proper function of the thumb safety and (if you care) the magazine safety. Look for signs of inept gunsmithing (punch marks in the frame, around the trigger pin, a over-throated chamber, etc.) Check the bore for bright, sharply defined rifling.

Be aware that earlier P-35's have an internal extractor (like a 1911's). In the 1960's (I think) they changed to the current one which is "pinned and pivoted" (it is clearly visible at the rear of the ejection port). I prefer the current style.

Also, check the press-fit lug within the frame that the barrel rides on to lock and unlock. Ensure that it's not loose or excessively worn (it'll have the finish worn from it. That's okay.)

Rosco
 
Not to throw cold water on you, but... Why not get the original, the Colt 1911XX .45.
The BHP, in my opinion, is really not a John Browning design... It was completed by some Belgian ehose name escapes me, and I believe Val Browning, after JMB's passing.

The 9mm parabellum does not justify itself as a belt pistol round. You may disagree, but I've seen too much data about folks absorbing about a dozen of them and living to tell about it. Remember: a good big man will beat a good little man every time.

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Yankee Doodle
 
BigG:

I have seen plenty of good, small men beat good, big men in fights. Hell, I've even seen extra-ordinarily skilled, big men get beat by mediocre, small men (well, okay, so the big men were strikers and the small men were grapplers).

I also know of historical cases of people being shot with dozens of Mauser 8mm rounds and .30-06 to fight on for hours. Does that make these rounds ineffective? It would under your logic on the 9mm Parabellum cartridge.

The European designer who completed the High-Power is Diudonne Saive, I think. JMB originally meant the High-Power to be a striker-fired weapon (like a Glock)! JMB also recognized the superiority of the cam lock system over the link system by this time, so the High-Power got the former.

Skorzeny

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For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the supreme excellence. Sun Tzu



[This message has been edited by Skorzeny (edited July 16, 1999).]
 
BigG...

To Clarify:
John Moses Went to Belgum quite often - Died and burried there in fact. FN wanted Browning to design a 9MM, and he did. FN suggested s couple minor changes to better fit there requirement and what they needed in a pistol... Other than that - the design went from God to Moses to us mortals.

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Every man Dies.
Not Every Man Truely Lives...
FREEDOM!

RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE
 
Skorzeny, if you're going to get as big a gun as a HP, you mize well get a .45.

A pistol is a defensive weapon, you use it at short distances. An assailant can be on you in less than one second in a room of average size. No matter what anybody thinks, a 115 grain 9mm does not equal a .45. No way. Read the US ammunition tests of 1907. The tests were to replace the woefully inadequate .38s which proved ineffective against dedicated assailants.

9mm Luger could shoot 12 times into a steer and he would be unaffected. Two or 3 .45s would put him down.

Read also the Miami FBI fight with one dedicated attacker who put 8 of 'em down. The FBI blamed the ammunition... that's why they went first to the 10mm and later to the 40 S&W.

Kodiak, thanks for the clarification. I just knew JMB would never design a nine mm parabellum on his own account. Not after having built the .45. Think of the 9mm Browning Long and 9mm Browning Short (380 ACP).

Just to let you know, I'm a Browning fan, too. BAR and .45 are his best, to me. M2 also.
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Yankee Doodle




[This message has been edited by BigG (edited July 16, 1999).]
 
When buying a used HP, always check to see if the magazine safety is present. Some people take them out to get a better trigger pull. It should be there, since carrying or using a gun designed for it that doesn't have it can get into legal problems.

Also be aware of war time HPs made during the German occupation of Belgium. Belgian sabotage took the form of spoiling the heat treatment so the guns will fire OK for acceptance, but go barely a magazine without failing.

Jim
 
That is the nastiest thing I heard today!
Spoiling a Browning!

WAR IS HELL...




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Every man Dies.
Not Every Man Truely Lives...
FREEDOM!

RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE
 
That is a good price IF it has not been shot much and the finish is in good shape AND it is a Mk II or Mk III, otherwise I would pass.

If you like the design and don't need the "real thing", the Bulgarian, Hungarian, and Argentine clones are excellent and under $200 new; leaves room for buying hicaps. I would actually prefer them to an old BHP as a tool.

JMB was awesome, but not perfect. He thought the double stack mag would never work; Dieudonne J. Saive made it work, and improved other things on the basic HP design JMB left behind.

All the 45 has over the 9mm is .097 inches in diameter. If you really think that makes any significant difference in stopping, you need help.

Bullets stop cuzz of where we put them, and what they do after they get there (expand, penetrate, stretch). Shot placement and the particular load are waaaaay more important than caliber.

For example, in the FBI fiasco in Miami, some 9mm loads would have been a better choice than many 45 loads considering the shot placement. Considering hit ratios, the 9mm would have been better, since with 7 shot 45s, they would have made even less hits than they did before running dry. You can't place what you don't have.

I've worked with some of the best CT and security forces around the world, and they have no problem making the 9mm work for them; must be the shooters? :)

They have no interest in the 40/45, and are only interested in the 224 Boz for the anti-armor capabilities.

Know a lady who saved the bacon of some good ole boys w 45s/357s who emptied their guns into a loonie without effect; she dropped him with several quick and accurate puny ole 9mms.

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The 9mm vs .45 controversy has been raging for some time. I like them both, and love the Browning Hi-Power. It was the first handgun I ever purchased. Had to sell it, but have a newer model now.
If your only talking about military hardball only, then yes, the .45 beats the nine.
But when your comparing the modern day hollowpoints, you'll find that their statistics are virtually identical. I would never feel undergunned with my Hi-Power loaded with 115 gr HP Cor-Bons, or my Colt loaded with the Cor-Bon 200 gr Speer HP.
The only time it's an issue is if your in a situation where you may need to shoot through alot of clothing (up north in the winter). Then you run a big chance of your hollowpoint plugging up and not expanding. If that could happen, then I would make sure to carry a .45. If you live in the south, like myself, then it's a moot point. Enjoy your Browning, it's a classic!
 
I own both a hi-power and 1911. Love 'em both, feel equally well protected by both, have at one time or another carried both.
The 1911 gets the nod as my carry gun because it's a Lightweight Commander, which makes it easier to carry, and I shoot it a little better. Nothing more.

Every gun collector and shooter should own a Hi-power at least once. It's a classic.
 
If you like the Hi-Power, go for it. The BHP is an excellent example of a modern autoloading handgun, even though it has been around since 1935.

I won't get in the middle of the 9mm vs .45 debate. I own both and like both. My personal Hi-power has been in my "family" since 1983 and has never, ever malfunctioned. So, from that standpoint it has my admiration.

Buy it, enjoy it, good shooting.
 
Don't want to get in an arguement with any of you but sometimes I think the computerized spec's of a certain cartridge tends to fog the real issue. Yes, I carry a .45, never hurts to put the odds on your side, but in the past I have carried a lowly 9mm from time to time. Couple friends of mine that worked in Africia for a while are only here because of the Brownings they carried. I've also seen individuals in a certain frame of mind take multiple .308 hits only to be stopped by a well placed .223 round in a vital area. Lived in Fairbanks, Alaska for a number of years. Old timer I knew got his share of moose each each, few bears too.. His only firearm was an old 22 long rifle. Go figure.
Probably not worth much but that's my two cents worth.
 
Hi-Powers bite. If you have never fired one before, you may be one of those prone to Hi-Power hammer bite. Fortunatly, not all of us are so affected. For those that are, the cure is often to sell off an otherwise fine pistol. If at all posssible, try to fire it before you buy it, or fire a HP to see if the hammer bites your hand. I missed out on a similar bargin by mere min. on a used but fired once HP in .40 S&W that the previous owner loved, but could not shoot. Unlike the 1911, there is no easy fix such as an exteneded beavertail without a lot of $$$. I have 2 HP's, both wear Speigal(sp) grips which are slimmer than the factory grips. Why HP instead of 1911? It fits my hand better.

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Want to feel your age?Check it out. http://web.superb.net/boy/age1.html
 
I see the "hammer bites" comment mentioned a lot with the HP.
Easy remedy - BOB the hammer or install a ROUND Commander hammer.
Easy eh ? ;)
My friends HP bites him from time to time - Hasn't got me yet though !

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"The Gun from Down Under !"
http://www.para1911fanclub.w3.to/
 
The Browning HP is an excellent Pistol, Check out the technical areas that previous posters have suggested, and then buy it rapidly as that is a fine price if the condition is acceptable.

Avoid at all costs involving yourself in the .45 vs. 9mm wars, as a winner will never be declared. Note: a "real" Gun Nut will have both anyway.

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TJS
 
HS: I have both styles on my HP's, and both bite with the same teeth. The occasional strike on the back of the hand is mearly a nibble, or rather a hello how are you. Not a big deal at all. The real bite is when a small piece of flesh gets trapped between the hammer an the frame. A glove, like a bikers glove or a """"gasp""""golfers glove would prevent it during practice or such, but for carry it would look somewhat odd. I would wear one if I was affected, but so far in the few hundred rounds I've fired, have been spared.

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Want to feel your age?Check it out. http://web.superb.net/boy/age1.html
 
Well here goes. I don't have a web site but have found a site called photopoint which should allow me to link some pictures of my custom brace of Hi-Powers here (an FN Mk III and a FM Detective - an Argentine "chopped" Hi-Power manufactured on FN equipment left as part of the Belgian contract with Argentina). There are 3 pix with full descriptions of modifications.

Of note here is the use of the newest hammer design offered by Cylinder & Slide on the MK III. There is NO web bite with this hammer at all!

click link here

Let me know what you think.

-=[Bob]=-
 
Thanks for all of the responses, I went to the shop Friday to purchase the pistol and it was already sold! Oh well I really didn't need another pistol just don't have a Hi power in my collection. As far as the 9mm vs. .45 goes I have many pistols of both calibers (Sigs, H&K's, Berettas, Glocks, old Colt 1911's, assortment of 1911 clones, Kahr and Taurus's) and I never feel under guned with a 9mm.
Hiker
 
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