Browning A-5

in no way shape or form is a benelli a tweaked a5. i dont know who this benelli shooting engineer is, nor do i know your connections in italy, but whomever told you that should put the crack pipe down.

correct inertia causes the bolt to unlock and blowback, just like gas causes the same in an AR--based on our logic are we to assume that Stoner also robbed JMB? you cant compare apples to oranges.

clearly you missed my point on the triggers... it was simply that out of the box semi auto hunting shotgun triggers are all about the same, adequate, but not great. of course all of them can be tweaked and made considerably better.

Now back to my original point.... all browning did with this new gun is copy Benelli--very similar to what remington tried to do (however failing miserably) with the versamax. this leads one to believe that over the last 10 years both browning (winchester, FN) and remington have known they had an inferior system, yet have blown smoke (and dirty gases) up our butts about gas being a better system. in my mind they both basically admitted that the Benelli system (regardless of if you think Benelli is original or not) is a better one, otherwise why copy it????
 
Inertia is the resistance of any physical object to a change in its state of motion or rest, or the tendency of an object to resist any change in its motion. It is proportional to an object's mass.
Click to expand...

Now here is a discussion of the Benelli inertia action as compared to the original Browning Auto-5. Forgive me if I misread it, but it seems to be saying that the Benelli first uses inertia (the tendency of the floating bolt to remain at rest) to unlock the bolt and compress the inertia sping. The force of the decompressing inertia spring then sends the bolt to the rear http://www.chuckhawks.com/benelli_inertia_action.htm

Is that “blowback”? Wakeman calls it “delayed blowback” and I can’t tell from the article for certain, but after the recoil pulse uses the tendendy of the floating bolt to stay at rest (inertia) to unlock the rotating bolt head, I believe the extended recoil pulse assists the inertia spring to send the bolt to the rear. Again, not an engineer.

To me, the Benelli is substantially different from the A-5. (All my references to the A-5 are to the Auto-5 and not the new model about to be released.)
 
How about we take a deep breath here guys....and let me suggest that we look at the big picture...

Beretta owns Benelli and a number of other companies ...and like all the big companies in their semi-auto's they're trying to build and market a gun to everyone - at every level of shooting ( field and competition ) and price range ...in semi-autos Beretta in their own line has guns from $ 800 or so on the low end - all the way up to the UGB line at around $ 4,000 .../ in their Inertia guns - in their Benelli line of guns most of them are $ 1,000 - $1,875 or so with the Super Sport model being at the upper end ( which I still consider a hunting gun /as well as a sporting clays gun or skeet gun ) ...and they have Franchi, Stoeger, etc making shotguns as well ...

http://www.berettausa.com/products/ugb25-xcel-trap-12-ga-30/
of the Beretta gas guns ..

FN -(Browning - Winchester) offers a variety of semi-autos in Brownings Silver, Maxus and Gold lines ...and Winchesters SX3's etc ...and the Auto 5's are coming back in the mix as well...( with prices ranges from $ 850 - $ 1,700 or so ..)

Sure the A-5's will evolve into something new ...and why not / were the old ones that great ..maybe / maybe not. Sure Benelli makes a nice gun ...is it really "better" than a gas gun ...maybe/maybe not... Is the Beretta UGB the end all semi-auto making a bridge between the semi-auto and the break open action of the Over Under world ..maybe /maybe not.

John M Browning ...invented and sold the designs to over 100 different gun models ( rifles, shotguns and handguns ) ...and he sold them to Colt, Remington, Winchester, FN, etc ... / and after his death in 1926 - the Browning Arms Company we all call Browning today was formed in 1927 ...and their relationship with FN, Winchester has continued as well...

Is FN - Browning/Winchester looking at everything Beretta does ..in their gas guns and their inertia guns ...sure they are...just like these guys all did when John M Browning was alive and developing new guns .../ its no wonder that there are similarities to these designs in the new Auto 5's and the Benelli's ...and the Beretta gas guns and the Browning and Winchester gas guns...

My personal input on triggers ...is yes, on the lower price end a lot of semi-autos seem to be coming out with 6 lb triggers in them ...and a lot of creep and slack...and if you don't care that's fine...personally, I like my shotguns to have a nice crisp 4lb trigger ..with as little creep and slack as possible / just because they're shotguns doesn't mean you have to put up with crummy triggers...but fine tuning the build on a gun takes time ...and the more time they spend fitting and tuning a gun in the factory the more money its going to cost. At $ 4K - the UGB I've fired has a pretty nice trigger in it ...
 
The old Auto-5 IMHO is still the king of semi-autos. I have shot thousands of rounds through mine. I currently own 3. They are very reliable. I purchased all of mine used and one thing I have noticed is almost to the gun, when I first broke them down, the rings were not set right, for either high base or low base shells. And that is maybe where some people have had problems with them.

Set the rings correctly and the old Auto 5 will usually run with the best of them, with the least maintance of about anything. An Auto 5 doesn't kick as hard as a Benelli in my experience and the Benelli gives more trouble, and they are harder to work on IMHO. And they sure as heck don't look nearly as pretty as a fine classic Auto 5.

I couldn't even begin to count the game that has fallen to my Auto 5's and can't remember one malfunction in the field from any of mine.

This new fangled gun will have some big boots to fill, and I will guarantee you it production cycle will be only a fraction of the lifespan of the old Auto 5.
 
Is that “blowback”? Wakeman calls it “delayed blowback” and I can’t tell from the article for certain, but after the recoil pulse uses the tendendy of the floating bolt to stay at rest (inertia) to unlock the rotating bolt head
Click to expand...

Not really. Blowback actions rely on the inertia of the bolt and spring pressure to keep the bolt closed until the bullet/shot have cleared the muzzle. They are common in low powered pistols and 22s. You can chamber more powerful cartridges in blowback actions, but the weight of the bolt and the stiffness and size of the spring required soon becomes prohibitive. If there's a bolt head that locks to keep the bolt from opening too soon it's not really a blowback action, regardless of how the bolt head is unlocked.
 
I dont think there is any way to compare the new to the old.
When I think of A-5's I think of watching my dad drop 5 quail with 5 shots on a wild covey rise with a Sweet 16. Or watching my grandfather fold ducks and doves with a Belgian Light Twelve. Or watching my turkey hunting mentor dump and old boss gobbler with his magnum twelve. The original had some class and style. A sythetic stock film dipped reincarnation... not so much.
The last time the attempted to improve the A-5 We ended up with the A-5G. It was a ****. Maybe this time they'll do better.
 
Still shoot my Light 12 A5 and it has served me well for many years. Beatifully made and alway brings the birds home.
 
For starters, my father taught me to hunt using a 20 gauge single shot breach action. Let me tell you, that sucker kicked like a mule. I have yet to come across a shotgun that kicks that hard. Later, once I had mastered basic safety and it was time for my younger brother to start learning, I graduated to a Remington 870 youth model (also 20 gauge). During one of our dove hunts I swapped guns with my granddad, and I fell in love with his Browning "Light Twenty" (Belgian made). Later, on my sixteenth birthday I received a used 20 gauge A5 (Japanese made) that has been my go to dove gun for the last fifteen years. I've never had cycling or any other mechanical issue with the gun in all those years, and it is still my favorite.
 
Saw 20 new Browning A5's today! Being functioned tested at the private range where I shoot. At first I told one of the Browning guys doing the testing that I would keep it a secret, but he said they are in the catalog, so no secret. To me the only thing about them that remotely looks like an Auto-5 is the squared off back of the "hump back" Auto-5. They were taking a break during firing 10,000 rounds through 20 guns. I think they had some more things to do yet this week. He sounded very happy with their results so far.
Just too bad they didn't let an innocent bystander take a turn!:D
 
Well..I'm an old guy and have shot the old Auto5 for over 40 years. All you had to do is change the friction rings out once they were worn..make sure mag tube was clean...and once in a few years take it apart and PROPERLY clean it and I can say they were utterly reliable. As far as uncomfortable to shoot....give me a break. I was 10 when I started. One reason they quit making them was that it was expensive to manufacturer, and everyone wanted the lighter plastic guns.
I can say I shot high and low brass with excellent reliability. As for me, I'll take the older ones any day..JMHO.;)
 
I love my auto-5's.
They have never failed to fire and
when you shoulder one, it points
where you're looking.
This new Europeanized shotgun is fine
I guess but's it's not a John Browning
shotgun!
 
i own a A5 sweet 16 and a 1100 and yes there is a different recycleing time, it's milla seconds, but there is a difference. for me its the time i need to get back on target (i just never seem to hit a grouse on my 1st shot ) so for in the field what little delay there is presents no problem. I probaly won't buy the new one though, my wife thinks having 5 shotguns around is enough.
 
My dad left me his old Auto 5 made in 1953 and it still works like a champ, but it is very well taken care of. I am ordering a new Auto 5 as soon as I can. It will look good next to my other Brownings !! :D
 
I took my sweet 16 out sunday. I got 1 shot off at a grouse, only got pine needles to show for my troubles though.
 
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