Best non +P 9mms for a short barrel (Sig 365) for SD

RickB said:
There was a case, very well publicized, including a TV show episode about the incident, in which a guy (hiking somewhere in California, IIRC) who'd used a 10mm handgun in a shooting was accused of being a homicidal maniac for choosing it.
I don't know if the accusation figured in the verdict or sentence, but it did come up.

Sort of related; an acquaintance, who happens to be an attorney, was accused, by another attorney, in court, of being a violent maniac, the latter presenting a youtube video of my buddy at an IDPA match as evidence.
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OK. Well, I guess *anything* is possible and there may be real merit to staying within the bounds of "normal" although plenty of people would accuse us of being violent maniacs for owning firearms at all.

Anyways, in the context of ammo selection, from the reviews I've read, it doesn't appear that fluted bullet designs are THAT much more effective than reliable JHP, to justify either the cost or perceived risk of looking weird for owning it.

So to conclude this thread, just buy Federal HST 124g ammo and all things will fall into place :)
 
IdaD said:
This is probably unpopular but I've gone back to Winchester White Box in 115 grain JHP. It's been reliable and accurate in my guns and I can get it locally for $16 per 50 round box plus sales tax. I think regularly shooting carry ammo is a good idea and this makes it easy and affordable. In the past I've carried Gold Dots, Critical Defense or more commonly HST but I got tired of having to buy online in bulk to spread out the shipping cost and I'm unwilling to pay $1/round for the 20 round retail boxes of that stuff. Maybe I'm just lazy or cheap, or probably both.
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I'm not sure I'm convinced by the need to regularly shoot the ammo you carry. Maybe I'm an idiot (that's a strong maybe!!!) but the point of shooting a given ammo is mainly to ensure that it cycles reliably in a given handgun, right? And unless it's a weird off-brand or an inconsistently loaded re-manufactured product, about the only thing that could prevent it from cycling is the shape of the bullet. Some guns seem to have trouble feeding flat-nosed bullets, especially higher grain "Heavy for caliber" (i.e. long) hollow points. I've heard of a few .380 guns choking on the rubber tips on Hornady bullets. Some pistols have steeper or shallower feed ramps than others.

But once you've run a box or two of Carry Load X through Pistol Y, I would imagine that's a good representative sample. Variations among manufactured cartridges will be insignificant. So I'm not sure I see why I'd continue running expensive JHP ammo through my gun once I've seen that 20, 40, etc. have all run and cycled properly.

Am I missing something?

As to carrying ball ammo -- I won't tell you not to. It still drills holes and they're only slightly smaller than expanded bullets, and not all JHPs will expand the same way every time, etc. Anything can overpenetrate. I carry JHP because I already own it :) And eventually when I shoot it off, I'll replace it with the same stuff.
 
OhioGuy said:
I'm not sure I'm convinced by the need to regularly shoot the ammo you carry. Maybe I'm an idiot (that's a strong maybe!!!) but the point of shooting a given ammo is mainly to ensure that it cycles reliably in a given handgun, right? And unless it's a weird off-brand or an inconsistently loaded re-manufactured product, about the only thing that could prevent it from cycling is the shape of the bullet. Some guns seem to have trouble feeding flat-nosed bullets, especially higher grain "Heavy for caliber" (i.e. long) hollow points. I've heard of a few .380 guns choking on the rubber tips on Hornady bullets. Some pistols have steeper or shallower feed ramps than others.

But once you've run a box or two of Carry Load X through Pistol Y, I would imagine that's a good representative sample. Variations among manufactured cartridges will be insignificant. So I'm not sure I see why I'd continue running expensive JHP ammo through my gun once I've seen that 20, 40, etc. have all run and cycled properly.

Am I missing something?

As to carrying ball ammo -- I won't tell you not to. It still drills holes and they're only slightly smaller than expanded bullets, and not all JHPs will expand the same way every time, etc. Anything can overpenetrate. I carry JHP because I already own it :) And eventually when I shoot it off, I'll replace it with the same stuff.
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I still use cheaper FMJ for most of my practice shooting but I also rotate the carry ammo out once or twice a year. So part of it is making sure the ammo functions properly and hits where I expect it, and part of it is keeping it somewhat fresh. I don't know how important having fresh ammo is but it seems more important in everyday carry ammo than it does with hunting rounds that are sitting in my safe most of the year.

As to FMJ as carry ammo, I don't think that's a great idea. It isn't as effective and it's worse from an over penetration standpoint. The WWB I carry is JHP, not FMJ.
 
IdaD said:
This is probably unpopular but I've gone back to Winchester White Box in 115 grain JHP. It's been reliable and accurate in my guns and I can get it locally for $16 per 50 round box plus sales tax. I think regularly shooting carry ammo is a good idea and this makes it easy and affordable. In the past I've carried Gold Dots, Critical Defense or more commonly HST but I got tired of having to buy online in bulk to spread out the shipping cost and I'm unwilling to pay $1/round for the 20 round retail boxes of that stuff. Maybe I'm just lazy or cheap, or probably both.
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Nope, yer not..I know guys who carry FMJ, same stuff they shoot at the range..cuz it's cheap and they realize that in the teeny chance you may have to shot somebody, that will be fine. I'll bet it hurts like hell.
Yes you will get the 'not gonna bet my life on.....', but I think it's fine. Shooting is a great past-time but even at $10 for 50...if ya shoot a lot, it can be pricy...
 
Once I decided to get my 365, I checked a lot of short barrel 9mm tests and the round that consistently performs extremely well is the 124 grain HST. There are a lot of great 9mm hollow points but most just don't expand that reliably against heavy clothing from a short barrel, particularly in non +p.
 
The downside is the bullet shape which may not be the best if you wind up in court defending yourself. I am old and value performance over being killed by a carjacker and winding up in court.
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PLEASE........
 
"Find out what your local LE uses and assuming it feeds in your gun, carry that ammo"
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Pretty solid advice...it's what we do.

But I'll add: I reload all of our practice ammunition to the same recoil impulse judged by feel and the gun's reaction to it. Impact points vary less than an inch at 10 yds. Saves money and encourages practice, where the boutique rounds carried by LEO's are too expensive to practice with. YMMV, Rod
 
Just an update on this. I did run about 30 rounds of Speer Gold Dot 124gr +P (regular - not the Short Barrel) and my 365 handled it very well. As good as the Shield I once had. As some have said, shoots like a bigger gun.

I'm not sure if the standard GD +P is optimized when shooting out of a shorter barreled gun (like the short barrel version or HSTs), but at least I know it worked and was manageable.
 
This is good info. I'll pick up my P365 when I get home in May. I think I most of my HST and Gold Dot is 124+P; never considered 147gr out of a short barrel pistol before. While I do almost all my training with FMC, I do practice with my carry gun and ammo at every range session...simply five rounds with four different drills, starting cold from the concealed position. This helps me cycle through my carry ammo, but not so much that it's cost-prohibitive.

ROCK6
 
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