Best deer round
- Thread starter gunner4391
- Start date
I'd have to disagree.
The correct answer is: It depends.
How do you hunt? If you hunt from a stand placed in heavy timber where shots are short, a handy little levergun in .357 mag, 30/30, .44 mag, or .45 Colt would work about as well as anything else. In addition, the pistol cartridges tend to not shoot as far, so hitting yonder farmhouse isn't as much of an issue. For that use, they'd be "the best" IMO, and I'd prefer open sights.
If you're hunting the Colorado Rockies, the 30/30 isn't going to do as well if you have to shoot across a canyon at a big mule deer buck. Forget the pistol cartridges for such a thing. In this country, the 30-06, .308, 7mm-08, 7mm mag, and others are the rule rather than the exception; and a good scope is not considered optional by most who hunt this kind of country.
Here in the Arizona desert, any of the above might do pretty well. Coues deer aren't hard to kill, and they can be hunted in some places where still hunting/stalking are good options. A light weight rifle is good, because you'll likely climb up in the higher country for a good vantage point to glass from. Most like cartridges that push bullets faster rather than slower, but big killing power isn't all that necessary.
Heck, even our desert mule deer only average about 140 lbs or so, and top out a little over 200 lbs. In this country, the .243 might work as well as the 7mm mag for most shots. The 7mm mag and similar cartridges will give the possibility of longer shots to hunters/shooters capable of it, but most of the time it's really not necessary.
I'm still deciding whether to use the 7mm mag or my .243 this year. If I use the 7mm mag, it'll be because it's lighter to carry. I haven't shot a deer with my .243 in several years, so I'm tempted to take it instead. It's a fun little rifle to shoot, and it's very accurate as well.
The best? It depends on your likes, dislikes, needs, and capabilities. There is no "one size fits all" answer to this one.
Daryl
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Look at the ballistics and energy from a 7mm-08 and I believe you will find just as I did it beats the 30-06 and passes it at about 250 yards and beats the 243 hands down along with being the best over all rifle for any north American game
Even the 7mm mag is just a slight above it and is not even worth it when comparing recoil and muzzle blast anyway just to get that extra 200-300fps along with the extra weight a 7mm mag has along with what I call 19 inch cases LOL
As far as accuracy goes the 7mm-08 is fantastic in that area also.
How ever I was looking at some 7mm WSMs and they seem promising with that shorter bolt throw but I would still have that hit by a truck recoil and a giant muzzle blast so I will stick with that 7mm-08 for now
Even the 7mm mag is just a slight above it and is not even worth it when comparing recoil and muzzle blast anyway just to get that extra 200-300fps along with the extra weight a 7mm mag has along with what I call 19 inch cases LOL
As far as accuracy goes the 7mm-08 is fantastic in that area also.
How ever I was looking at some 7mm WSMs and they seem promising with that shorter bolt throw but I would still have that hit by a truck recoil and a giant muzzle blast so I will stick with that 7mm-08 for now
Fisherman66 and Christboy,
I have seen 270-.308 dies. I also watched a such chambered rifle sell yesterday.
I suppose our new guy is an expert on all things gay. I don't see how it can be any "gayer" than the long action equivalents.
Thank you for recognizing me as the self appointed "Gay Cartridge Expert". In the original context, your analogy of one rifle sale and an existing set of dies does not make .270/08 some future commercial success. In addition the .260 Rem and 7mm-08 ARE short action calibers that arguably do EVERYTHING better than some new and "gay" .270 short wildcat cartridge squeezed in between! Can't you just buy some "new" 270 Short mag and load it down?
What the heck, it sounds so darn "queer"
:barf:
I have seen 270-.308 dies. I also watched a such chambered rifle sell yesterday.
I suppose our new guy is an expert on all things gay. I don't see how it can be any "gayer" than the long action equivalents.
Thank you for recognizing me as the self appointed "Gay Cartridge Expert". In the original context, your analogy of one rifle sale and an existing set of dies does not make .270/08 some future commercial success. In addition the .260 Rem and 7mm-08 ARE short action calibers that arguably do EVERYTHING better than some new and "gay" .270 short wildcat cartridge squeezed in between! Can't you just buy some "new" 270 Short mag and load it down?
What the heck, it sounds so darn "queer"
:barf:
fisherman66
New member
I made no analogy. The 7mm-08 is a ballistic twin (the twin with the stunted growth) to the 7x57. Does that make the 7mm-08 gay? Really, it isn't an argument I'd ever bother to bring up if it weren't for your twink semantics.
Now those are some interesting statements, purely based on opinion, and likely intended at a bit of promoting one's own preferences.
Passes the 30-06 with....what? Energy? Not a chance. Trajectory? What loads are you comparing? Your information is lacking, and erronious from what I've read. Have you done extensive testing of your own to show this to be true? As bullets get heavier, the differences greatly widen between the 7mm mag and 7mm-08.
Does this mean that the 7mm-08 isn't a good choice? Nope; it just means you might want to stop bad-mouthing the others.
Beats the .243 hands down...how? Looking up my .243 load in my ballistic's chart, and comparing it to the fastest 120 grain load for the 7mm-08 looks like this:
7mm-08 120 gr spitzer
MV=3000 fps Muzzle energy=2398 ft/lbs POI= -1.5 inches
200 yards
velocity = 2549 fps energy=1730 ft/lbs, POI = 0.0
500 yards
Velocity = 1949 fps, energy = 1012 ft/lbs, POI = -40.9 inches
.243 Win 100 gr spitzer
MV = 3250 fps, energy = 2418 ft/lbs, POI = -1.5 inches
200 yards
Velocity = 2793 fps, energy = 1732 ft/lbs, POI = 0.0 inches
500 yards
Velocity = 2129 fps, energy = 1006 ft/lbs, POI = -33.9 inches.
My load uses a 100 grain bullet pushed to 3250 fps using IMR-7828SSC, and the actual bullet I use has a higher BC. For the purposes of this comparison, I used same make/bullet styles.
BTW-that 120 gr bullet gave the BEST trajectory and energy figures for the 7mm-08.
As weight goes up in the 7-08, the trajectory drops more throughout the spectrum, and the energy goes down at the muzzle, but gets a little higher (50 ft/lbs) at 500 yards than the 120 grain bullet in the same caliber/cartridge.
That being the case, I'd say they're about equal in that comparison. If there's a difference, it's slightly in favor of the .243 Win. Granted, most factory loaded .243 ammo isn't loaded to top velocities, but neither are they for the 7mm-08.
Daryl
Breadslinger
New member
From coast to coast, many deer at varying distances under a multitude of circumstances, one cartridge has done it all...the .270 Winchester. Does this make it the perfect choice? Beats me, but its my choice and I tend to stick with what works. 
mapsjanhere
New member
7x65R in a single shot.
So what your saying Daryl is you some how shoot a 175 grain bullet out of that 243 you have also.
I would like to see the specs on that LOL
7mm goes from 100 grain to 175 grain bullets which makes it perfect for me
And no I'm not bad mouthing anyone and made my statements knowing after 50 years of shooting every caliber there is the 7mm-08 is the best one I have ever found for myself
Doesn't mean that would hold true for anyone else.
I have my own data and it does show exactly what I said.
Does not beat the 30-06 hands down but it does pass it and has a slight more energy at longer ranges due to the ballistic coefficient of the 7mm bullet
Does not mean the 30-06 or the 243 is not a good caliber either way and only that I like the 7mm-08 more.
Look in the high powered rifle silhouette competitions and you will find a big percentage of the shooters shooting that 7mm-08
At least they were back when I was in them
I load my own and do a lot of math to do that if you want to take a look at it here
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=318179
Does not matter what you are reloading for there are math equations all over the internet as a way to make that caliber accurate as can be.
A lot of people just look at that muzzle velocity those factories always advertise and think yep that must be really good going that fast
I look at the science part of it all and know it does not matter what caliber I use I can make it accurate to the max
Friends of mine that shoot the 30-06 always tell me they have to use that 150-180 grain bullet size because the others are just not accurate even when they reload
Then I teach them the math and they find out that 30-06 can shoot anything from a 100 grain to a 200 grain bullet very accurately after all
After they shoot my 7mm-08 they instantly want one for themselves also LOL
Roy is correct... Numbers will never kill a deer at all LOL
Those 270s are bad to the bone also and I hear sometimes, "Ar'nt those things just an old has been caliber"? I'm like HUHHHHHH who told you that them 270s are bad to the bone.
I would like to see the specs on that LOL
7mm goes from 100 grain to 175 grain bullets which makes it perfect for me
And no I'm not bad mouthing anyone and made my statements knowing after 50 years of shooting every caliber there is the 7mm-08 is the best one I have ever found for myself
Doesn't mean that would hold true for anyone else.
I have my own data and it does show exactly what I said.
Does not beat the 30-06 hands down but it does pass it and has a slight more energy at longer ranges due to the ballistic coefficient of the 7mm bullet
Does not mean the 30-06 or the 243 is not a good caliber either way and only that I like the 7mm-08 more.
Look in the high powered rifle silhouette competitions and you will find a big percentage of the shooters shooting that 7mm-08
At least they were back when I was in them
I load my own and do a lot of math to do that if you want to take a look at it here
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=318179
Does not matter what you are reloading for there are math equations all over the internet as a way to make that caliber accurate as can be.
A lot of people just look at that muzzle velocity those factories always advertise and think yep that must be really good going that fast
I look at the science part of it all and know it does not matter what caliber I use I can make it accurate to the max
Friends of mine that shoot the 30-06 always tell me they have to use that 150-180 grain bullet size because the others are just not accurate even when they reload
Then I teach them the math and they find out that 30-06 can shoot anything from a 100 grain to a 200 grain bullet very accurately after all
After they shoot my 7mm-08 they instantly want one for themselves also LOL
Roy is correct... Numbers will never kill a deer at all LOL
Those 270s are bad to the bone also and I hear sometimes, "Ar'nt those things just an old has been caliber"? I'm like HUHHHHHH who told you that them 270s are bad to the bone.
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No, they don't; but when someone promotes a particular cartridge, and supports their claim by saying to look it up, that's usually what I do.
I'm a ballistic's fanatic to some extent, and always have been. I don't generally study a lot of charts, instead leaning towards making my own decisions from experience. Even so, I've studies the charts enough to know how a lot of cartridges compare to one another in that respect.
I like to get the most from my cartridges in both accuracy and terminal performance, so I do things with that in mind.
As I said above, there's nothing at all wrong with the 7mm-08. It and it's ballistic twin (7mm mauser) have taken just about every game animal on earth, including elephant. There's no arguing with it's effectiveness on game, but IMO it falls short of being best in most respects. When one claims it out-performs the 30-06 at a distance, and also claims it's "almost as good" as the 7mm mag, while beating the .243 hands down, I just have to go look up some data.
Any of them can and have killed lots and lots of deer, along with a bunch of other cartridges. Each will do it reliably in the hands of a skilled rifleman, and each can fail if he shot goes awry. The "best" is always a matter of opinion; some more experienced than others.
Daryl
.The parameter of diverse deer hunting would place versatility pretty high on the list of desirable attributes.
A rifle optimized for western bitterbrush hunting might be a bit of a handicap in deep woods and the reverse is true.
When I pick up my 257 Ackley that weighs 7 lbs with the 6x42 Leu on top,I do not wish for something else.
I do not think there is a "best".It is the one you know and trust.And,the 30-30 has killed a lot of deer out west.
I antelope hunt on foot in what amounts to sage/desert."Flat" ground is not so flat if you look close.A buddy once told me,one minute you were walking away,then you disappeared.A little bit of a draw or bowl,defilade!!
If you are in foothills,brush,oakbrush,it might be Colorado but it is short range bush shooting,or cross the draw.
I know of a cranky old ex Marine sniper gunsmith who will use an iron sight 30-40 Krag on Pronghorn and might grab a .50 rolling block carbine to hunt in Idaho.
A Ruger #1 might be a great platform,a might an Encore carbine with an ACOG on it you could put in your ruck..
A rifle optimized for western bitterbrush hunting might be a bit of a handicap in deep woods and the reverse is true.
When I pick up my 257 Ackley that weighs 7 lbs with the 6x42 Leu on top,I do not wish for something else.
I do not think there is a "best".It is the one you know and trust.And,the 30-30 has killed a lot of deer out west.
I antelope hunt on foot in what amounts to sage/desert."Flat" ground is not so flat if you look close.A buddy once told me,one minute you were walking away,then you disappeared.A little bit of a draw or bowl,defilade!!
If you are in foothills,brush,oakbrush,it might be Colorado but it is short range bush shooting,or cross the draw.
I know of a cranky old ex Marine sniper gunsmith who will use an iron sight 30-40 Krag on Pronghorn and might grab a .50 rolling block carbine to hunt in Idaho.
A Ruger #1 might be a great platform,a might an Encore carbine with an ACOG on it you could put in your ruck..
Wow I had forgot all about that lever action in 257 roberts a friend had.
That is a really neat little gun.
He says the same thing about his gun
That's all he ever needs or wants
He was just like me
We went to the range he fired two shots though the bulls-eye I fired two from my 7mm-08 though the bulls-eye we traded and shot a couple from each others gun all though the bulls-eye and we both called it a good day.
In the mean time we were both laughing about the others out there firing ten thousand rounds as a way to try to find out why they could not get a good group LOL
Waterengineer
New member
rbb50:
Who is th emaker of the 257 Roberts lever gun? I never saw one but suddenly need one.
Is it a Browning? Thanks.
Who is th emaker of the 257 Roberts lever gun? I never saw one but suddenly need one.
Is it a Browning? Thanks.
His was a savage model 99 but I cannot remember the designator
It was a beatiful gun with nice checkeing and all and very old but looked brand new topped off with a 7 power scope
I think browning and ruger also make them now days and his was a disconntinued model
Think I remember him saying his dad had to special order it in that caliber from savage
First one I have ever seen like it and may not ever see another one I thought
It was a beatiful gun with nice checkeing and all and very old but looked brand new topped off with a 7 power scope
I think browning and ruger also make them now days and his was a disconntinued model
Think I remember him saying his dad had to special order it in that caliber from savage
First one I have ever seen like it and may not ever see another one I thought
Actually Daryl I knew some old country boys that would hunt deer with nothing but a 22 rimfire
They would swear by them and always say something like
I gets in that brush in my camo an when they comes up I pops up an shoot em in tha haed with that there 22 and they goes rights down every time
trying to get that texas slang they talk in writing just right LOL
I always thought that was illegal but they would always say stuff like, Them there revenuers aint scare me no how LOL
Yeah I lived in some stange places down here in texas and I don't think them boys had much schooling when they were growing up but they usually had what looked like about 100 antlers laying around all over with a bunch of nice mounts on their walls LOL
They would swear by them and always say something like
I gets in that brush in my camo an when they comes up I pops up an shoot em in tha haed with that there 22 and they goes rights down every time
trying to get that texas slang they talk in writing just right LOL
I always thought that was illegal but they would always say stuff like, Them there revenuers aint scare me no how LOL
Yeah I lived in some stange places down here in texas and I don't think them boys had much schooling when they were growing up but they usually had what looked like about 100 antlers laying around all over with a bunch of nice mounts on their walls LOL
Oh the difference between his and other lever guns was it had a rotory magazine
When you opened the chamber the rounds would push down into the magazine so that was neat also because it could be reloaded with some regular soft points unlike the tubes which needed flat or round points
When you opened the chamber the rounds would push down into the magazine so that was neat also because it could be reloaded with some regular soft points unlike the tubes which needed flat or round points
