bad day at the range

F

Furminator

New member
Just had to do a little venting plus ask a question about my S&W Model 19.

While at the indoor range today in West Allis, I was loading one of my magazines when all of a sudden I felt a searing pain across my abdomen. Turns out someone else's bullet or a part of one had richochet and hit me hard enough to leave a welt on my stomach. Needless to say, I was a little disturbed. When I told the rangemaster about it, he pretty much just shrugged. I mean, I didn't expect him to give me a big hug or anything, but he came across as pretty indifferent to the whole thing. My first question: is it that common to be hit by bullets at indoor ranges?

Also, while shooting my S&W Model 19 with Magtech 158 gr. 357, all of a sudden the gun seemed to bind up. The cylinder did not want to rotate and I could only pull the trigger with great difficulty. When I got home, I looked at the gun and the part of the barrel that comes out toward the cylinder had split along the bottom. This is a rarely used gun that has never been fired with 125 gr. 357's and only a couple of boxes of 158 gr. 357's have been put through it. Probably has less than 300 rounds through it altogether and most of those were .38's. Any advice on what I should do here?
 
Sounds like a call to S&W Customer Service is in order. I am sure they will happily fix your Model 19.

As far as the ricocheting goes I have spent a good amount of time shooting indoors. Everything from .357 158 grain out of a Model 60, 9mm, .40, .45, .22lr, .45 Colt. NEVER have I or anyone around me been grazed or hit by bullets or bullet fragments.

I have been hit with bullet fragments when shooting jacketed bullets at steel targets at ranges of less than 10 yards.
 
I've been hit a number of times at indoor ranges from splatter, or I suppose ricochets off the plates, etc. Usually from the waist down. Some left bruises, others just welts, all were annoying and disconcerting. Its also why I dont shoot prone off the floor at those type ranges anymore. I guess its just the nature of the best at those type ranges. Then again, I've been hit at outdoor ranges too.

On the Mod. 19, I'd call S&W and ask what they think you should do.
 
I don't visit indoor ranges any more, to many idiots, would rather shoot on my own land, but it is not uncommon what happened to you.
As for the S&W call them and tell them to pay for shipping both ways. They will send you the shipping label, but you may have to go to a supervisor to get it. They won't offer it!!
 
I can't recall being hit at an indoor range. (All two or three(?) visits, in my life.)

However, I am the ricochet magnet, in my family. If anyone is going to be hit... it is me.

Last year, I was hit 14 times in a single day. (With soft and hard targets ranging from 10 to 300 yards.) Number 13 prompted me to, literally, hide behind the truck, and use my brother as body armor. That's when #14 smacked me in the wrist. The steel jacket from some Wolf 7.62x39mm sliced me pretty good. (Somehow avoiding the objects between myself and the target.) I couldn't feel my hand for about 3 hours; and the cut was about 1.5" long, by 1/4" wide and deep.

The sad part was that we were doing nothing unsafe. I am just horribly unlucky.



In a similar location, but on a separate occasion; my one of my brothers was hit by a .310" steel-jacketed 123gr HP. It was fully intact, and he was lucky it was travelling slow enough to come to rest in his multiple layers of clothing. Some morons at the gravel pit "range", about 3/4 mile away, let things get a little out of control.


As for your Smith:
It sounds like the forcing cone is what split. It could have been caused by a number of issues. Most likely: A squib, followed by a normal load. Improper timing. A barrel obstruction (other than a bullet, and possibly originating in the cylinder). Call S&W. See what they say.
 
to many idiots,
If you doubt that, the next time you go to a range look at all the hits on the side walls and the roof of the range.
The range that I shoot at there was an "Idiot" with a Glock that started firing as fast as he could with the target only about 7 feet out. One of the rounds hit the target hangar and sprayed several people. Luckly the range officer saw and heard, pulled his card and he will never be shooting there again. Luckly no one was hurt.
I still go to indoor ranges in winter but the only time I have been hit was out door shooting close to the back stop.
 
My first experience with anything coming back downrange was on my most recent range visit. There were a couple of guys blowing through mags with an AK variant of some kind. One round hit a steel support of sorts on the wall and sent some jacket back up range, gave me a nasty looking, but shallow cut on the arm. A few rounds later, and another one did the same thing, splattering me and my shooting buddies with shrapnel. I brought it up to the guys next to me as politely as I could muster, they didn't care in the least. I didn't realize how much damage they caused until I pulled my target back in and saw that a good quarter of my target (Standard man sized silhouette) had been ripped to shreds. I did inform the RO, and he guaranteed me that he would take it up with the other shooters.

I've been there many other days, and I have never seen anyone miss the target in that end lane badly enough to hit the wall. Hope I never experience it again.
 
If you sweep up brass at an indoor range, you will find the occasional bullet that has hit the target carrier and returned to the firing line, at a fair rate of speed. They are generally fairly splattered and generally won't do much more than sting or bruise...but that's why we wear eye protection. :)

As for the S&W call them and tell them to pay for shipping both ways. They will send you the shipping label, but you may have to go to a supervisor to get it. They won't offer it!!
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They certainly will offer it. I have never talked to a supervisor at S&W or Springfield. If perchance they fail to, ask about it. S&W and Springfield have the best Customer Service in the business.
 
"is it that common to be hit by bullets at indoor ranges?"

Geez, I hope not.

Although I was at the range today and noticed a fair number of bullet holes on the bench/rest. How the hell does that happen?
 
Although I was at the range today and noticed a fair number of bullet holes on the bench/rest. How the hell does that happen?
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Thank you! I never understood how that happens. Honestly it scares me to be in there with some people.
 
I have never been hit an indoor range, but have been several times at outdoor ranges, the last time being this incident :
hit by a .310" steel-jacketed 123gr HP. It was fully intact, and he was lucky it was travelling slow enough to come to rest in his multiple layers of clothing. Some morons at the gravel pit "range", about 3/4 mile away, let things get a little out of control.
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Hit me square in the chest, had enough force to give me a little bruise. Scared me to death, called it a day, went home and had a cold one.

I have had bullets/fragments hit me, both accidental, and purposefully at a local range. During one incident, a couple morons were shooting scatter guns on the range next to the one were were using, and decided to send a few our way, thinking they were far enough away that it would do no damage to anything............. MORONS!!!!! They were about 100 yards away when they let loose with the 12 gauge pumps. The pellets bounced off the roof over the bench, off us, off our car.......they didn't draw any blood, but it was not enjoyable. We screamed at them to hold thier fire, waved, jumped up and down.......and they kept laughing and firing. At this point, a couple rounds were fired into the ground between the two idiots (the next shots wouldn't have been "warning shots")........and I think they soiled themselves as they ran away.......seems they didn't care to be shot at either. They said they didnt know the range was in use, and were just "having fun". Couldnt prove they knew we were there, so they were able to walk away.

A few incidents like that, and a few too many Range Officers who think they are God, have seen to it that I havent shot at an indoor range, or designated range of any type in years. The wide open desert, and a few mountain valleys are where I shoot now.
 
Ozzieman, it's funny you should mention it but I did notice all the bullet holes and scrapes on the sides of the range walls yesterday!

Thanks for all the feedback, guys. I have to admit that after it happened yesterday I couldn't relax and get back into my groove, kept half expecting to get hit again. I generally prefer to shoot outdoors but it's getting harder and harder to find good outdoor spots.

On a sidenote: has anyone ever heard of someone dying from one of these range richochets?
 
The sheer amount of close calls you guys have dealt with makes me want to go buy my own land and avoid dealing with people. Yeesh.

And to think the worst injury I ever got at the range was closing the slide on a Desert Eagle and having it take a chunk of my pinky with it...
 
I've been to a number of outdoor ranges that had plenty of holes and dings in the walls, benches, and overheads, so its not just an indoor thing.

Personally, these days I prefer to shoot alone when at all possible, which is what I usually do. Anytime I'm at a range where I have to shoot with other people, but especially the indoor ranges, I usually wear my vest. Not much help on rifle rounds, but pistol rounds and anything else flying around, its a comfort, and this time of year, its warmer outside. Sucks in the summer though.

Realistically, I think when you consider the number of rounds fired, and the number of these little incidents, it probably works out to a very low percentage. Still, when you get to the range and see some of the nit wits floating around and how they shoot (the ricochets aint looking all that bad now, eh? :) ), sometimes its better to just go back to the truck and come back later.
 
You truly did have a bad day. Sorry. The really bad news is that you may be s.o.l. when it comes to your 19.

It sounds to me as if you have a split forcing cone. The 19 is a K frame magnum. Over the years there have been some problems reported with forcing cones splitting on K frame magnums, generally at the bottom of the cone, which corresponds to the bottom of the part of the barrel that protrudes from the back of the frame. Usually, these have been attributed to heavy use of 125gr. magnum rounds. I haven't heard of a cone splitting due to use of 158gr. magnums and, in fact, this and other forums are filled with posts telling folks that it's perfectly fine to shoot the 158gr. magnums from K frames. Generally, we're warned against shooting the hotter 125 gr. stuff. However, nothing's impossible in this world.

Smith has a great service department that goes out of its way to please its customers. They'll certainly lend you a sympathetic ear. But, your problem is that Smith is very likely to tell you that it no longer has replacement barrels in stock. The 19 was discontinued a couple of decades ago and, in fact, Smith stopped making K frame magnums altogether earlier this decade. I'm not sure what Smith will be able to do for you in light of that.
 
Good luck with your model 19, and please let us know how your treated by S&W. They(19s)are great pieces of craftsmanship, but sure take a beating with some 357 loadings. As to getting hit by a ricochet at a indoor range, it happens unfortunately, but fortunately not too often and rarely does one hear of a ricochet doing any real damage in those situations. It sure does highlight the importance of eye protection always though. I really feel for you guys whos only option is a indoor range or even having to worry about others at an outdoor range that is open to the general public.
 
I exclusively just shoot at indoor ranges. So far I have
never been hit by any flying material. Your story does not
sound good at all.

Do they have some sort of barrier between the lanes where
you shoot?
 
Those photos of the split forcing cones look exactly like what happened to my M19, even as to the location of the split. I feel kind of bad about it because this gun was one of my favorites and it had not been fired that much at all; if anything, I pampered it.

As far as the shooting lanes, there is no sort of barrier between individual lanes other than at the shooting stations themselves, and even there it looks like some sort of heavy particle board, not sure if it's bulletproof.
 
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