I am looking for a backup revolver. It will be for occasional deep concealment duties. It will (as the title states) be primarily used when I carry a backup (and the backup isn't my LCP), mainly when carrying another revolver to somewhat alleviate the low capacity of a revolver. It will be pocket and sometimes ankle carried.
Criteria...
Capacity must be 6 or more. Six is simply the minimum I feel comfortable with (especially should I eventually move to a carry state where this gun may occasionally see lone use when dropped in a pocket when I go out to run some errands).
Relatively lightweight since it will often be a pocket gun. I can pocket my over 20oz SIG P290RS and Taurus 85CH, so something over 20oz can be doable (heck, I sometimes pocket carry my S&W M&P40c in jeans, though it definitely overfills my pockets). Lighter is better, but isn't everything (this gun isn't really going to be pocket carried in dress slacks often, see individual considerations, but in more heavy duty pants like jeans and some khakis). Size is more important though.
Caliber is pretty open. In these small revolvers, especially if I go with a lightweight one like the LCP or an alloy revolver, recoil and quick follow up shots can be a problem but in a small caliber they are OK and some can even be pleasant to shoot. Also, a smaller caliber equals greater capacity, and 99.9% of the time this will be paired with another gun and won't be the primary, so while I'd rather have more power than .22lr, there is a .22lr on my list.
Individual considerations... Please don't advocate for an auto, or different role, or larger caliber snub. I am very much a part-time CCWer. In MD it is tough to get a permit, so I can only carry when out of state on my UT permit (so, 2-4 times a month on average, and at least 1-2 times most months). I'm not going to drop my .38 snub in my pocket to run errands since I can't carry everyday. I don't need a small everyday carry, I can't carry to work (even if I lived in a shall issue state, I'm a teacher and most states don't allow that), I rarely go to formal or business formal events (and a suit coat or blazer/sport coat is a concealment garment), and when I do carry, I'm shopping or sightseeing and dressed casually (i.e. it is easy to conceal a larger gun). When I do carry out of state, I usually go with a larger auto (CZ PCR/P01/75 Compact or similar size) and I recently bought a 6 round 3" Colt King Cobra for when I want a revolver. Heck, if I ever do change my mind about 5 rounds, I have a S&W 442, so I don't need to buy something in that class anyway. Even if the courts eventually require MD to go shall issue (I'm somewhat hopeful, but I've been hopeful for well over a decade) and I decide I want something smaller for daily carry, I will soon have in my possession my previously mentioned Colt, and I also have a S&W M&P40c and a RIA Officer sized 1911. So, my needs are pretty well covered, I'm looking for a fun and useful niche gun.
So, the guns...
Colt Cobra. Pros: a decent size and weight for range practice and quick follow up shots, 6 rounds of .38+P, same speed loaders (and holsters if I want) as my King Cobra, currently available in the $600-650 range (including fees if bought online). Cons: a bit big and heavy for the intended role (maybe too much most of the time).
Kimber K6s. Pros: 6 rounds of .357mag in a small pocketable package, though I'd usually load it with .38+P. Cons: quite a bit of recoil and slower follow up shots when shooting magnums, very loud when shooting magnums, it can be a little heavy for a pocket, expensive.
Ruger LCR in .327mag. Pros: 6 rounds of .327mag which can approach weaker .357 loadings and definitely matches or beats .38+P, can be downloaded to .32H&R Mag for less recoil and noise, reasonable price, very light. Cons: I don't really like the looks of the polymer revolvers, loud and heavy recoil in .327mag.
S&W 351PD. Pros: the more I research the more I'm interested in .22mag as a backup defensive cartridge (especially with the short barrel loads like the Speer Gold Dot and I think Hornady makes one), 7 rounds in a J-frame would be terrific, it would fit my holsters for my 442 and Taurus 85, I could use any of the grips I have for my 442. Cons: it is getting expensive, rimfire reliability (though in a quality defensive round like the Speer it should be less of an issue), it is very loud if shot indoors, heavy trigger pull (especially DA), for a pocket gun I think I'd rather have the 351C but it isn't approved for sale in MD so I'd have to live with or do something with the exposed hammer on the 351PD (which isn't ideal).
S&W 43C. Pros: no exposed hammer is a plus on a pocket gun, 8 rounds, cheap practice ammo (and with that it would likely get the most use of all these options), fits my J-frame holsters, can use my J-frame grips, price isn't bad. Cons: it is only a .22lr, rimfire reliability, heavy rimfire and J-frame trigger pull (made worse by being DAO).
Wild Cards:
Forget the deep carry niche and get a S&W 627PC (the 2.6" version so it would still be a carry gun). I want one, they are beautiful, and 8 rounds of .357mag would be nice in an occasional carry gun (and it would probably become my primary home defense gun).
Taurus 851. I used to be a big Taurus fan, but over the past few years they have lost me (I had a gun in the polymer gun recall, I have an issue with cylinder binding on my Taurus made 2" Rossi 461, I've read a lot online of people with newer production Taurus revolvers with the same issue, and both of my Rossi 461 revolvers were in the current safety recall, apparently they can fire if dropped or jarred). Still, a 6 shot revolver that is a hair smaller than the Colt Cobra, the steel version is lighter, and it is also available in a lightweight aluminum, and I can get the lightweight version with the bobbed hammer (851CH) for as little as $250 plus FFL transfer fee, I may have to consider it (though if I get it, I'll always have a little worry about it in the back of my mind). The negatives said, my Taurus 85CH has come to have one heck of a good trigger after a lot of use, it seems they use better spring design than the S&W J-frames on their small frame revolvers.
So, what do you think of my options (when considering my individual needs)? You guys helped me out quite a bit with the Cobra vs. King Cobra recently, so I'd like to hear what you say.
Edit at 10:20am: Several edits to clean things up... Never forget to proofread
Edit 2 (see edit 1): The Taurus is the 856
Criteria...
Capacity must be 6 or more. Six is simply the minimum I feel comfortable with (especially should I eventually move to a carry state where this gun may occasionally see lone use when dropped in a pocket when I go out to run some errands).
Relatively lightweight since it will often be a pocket gun. I can pocket my over 20oz SIG P290RS and Taurus 85CH, so something over 20oz can be doable (heck, I sometimes pocket carry my S&W M&P40c in jeans, though it definitely overfills my pockets). Lighter is better, but isn't everything (this gun isn't really going to be pocket carried in dress slacks often, see individual considerations, but in more heavy duty pants like jeans and some khakis). Size is more important though.
Caliber is pretty open. In these small revolvers, especially if I go with a lightweight one like the LCP or an alloy revolver, recoil and quick follow up shots can be a problem but in a small caliber they are OK and some can even be pleasant to shoot. Also, a smaller caliber equals greater capacity, and 99.9% of the time this will be paired with another gun and won't be the primary, so while I'd rather have more power than .22lr, there is a .22lr on my list.
Individual considerations... Please don't advocate for an auto, or different role, or larger caliber snub. I am very much a part-time CCWer. In MD it is tough to get a permit, so I can only carry when out of state on my UT permit (so, 2-4 times a month on average, and at least 1-2 times most months). I'm not going to drop my .38 snub in my pocket to run errands since I can't carry everyday. I don't need a small everyday carry, I can't carry to work (even if I lived in a shall issue state, I'm a teacher and most states don't allow that), I rarely go to formal or business formal events (and a suit coat or blazer/sport coat is a concealment garment), and when I do carry, I'm shopping or sightseeing and dressed casually (i.e. it is easy to conceal a larger gun). When I do carry out of state, I usually go with a larger auto (CZ PCR/P01/75 Compact or similar size) and I recently bought a 6 round 3" Colt King Cobra for when I want a revolver. Heck, if I ever do change my mind about 5 rounds, I have a S&W 442, so I don't need to buy something in that class anyway. Even if the courts eventually require MD to go shall issue (I'm somewhat hopeful, but I've been hopeful for well over a decade) and I decide I want something smaller for daily carry, I will soon have in my possession my previously mentioned Colt, and I also have a S&W M&P40c and a RIA Officer sized 1911. So, my needs are pretty well covered, I'm looking for a fun and useful niche gun.
So, the guns...
Colt Cobra. Pros: a decent size and weight for range practice and quick follow up shots, 6 rounds of .38+P, same speed loaders (and holsters if I want) as my King Cobra, currently available in the $600-650 range (including fees if bought online). Cons: a bit big and heavy for the intended role (maybe too much most of the time).
Kimber K6s. Pros: 6 rounds of .357mag in a small pocketable package, though I'd usually load it with .38+P. Cons: quite a bit of recoil and slower follow up shots when shooting magnums, very loud when shooting magnums, it can be a little heavy for a pocket, expensive.
Ruger LCR in .327mag. Pros: 6 rounds of .327mag which can approach weaker .357 loadings and definitely matches or beats .38+P, can be downloaded to .32H&R Mag for less recoil and noise, reasonable price, very light. Cons: I don't really like the looks of the polymer revolvers, loud and heavy recoil in .327mag.
S&W 351PD. Pros: the more I research the more I'm interested in .22mag as a backup defensive cartridge (especially with the short barrel loads like the Speer Gold Dot and I think Hornady makes one), 7 rounds in a J-frame would be terrific, it would fit my holsters for my 442 and Taurus 85, I could use any of the grips I have for my 442. Cons: it is getting expensive, rimfire reliability (though in a quality defensive round like the Speer it should be less of an issue), it is very loud if shot indoors, heavy trigger pull (especially DA), for a pocket gun I think I'd rather have the 351C but it isn't approved for sale in MD so I'd have to live with or do something with the exposed hammer on the 351PD (which isn't ideal).
S&W 43C. Pros: no exposed hammer is a plus on a pocket gun, 8 rounds, cheap practice ammo (and with that it would likely get the most use of all these options), fits my J-frame holsters, can use my J-frame grips, price isn't bad. Cons: it is only a .22lr, rimfire reliability, heavy rimfire and J-frame trigger pull (made worse by being DAO).
Wild Cards:
Forget the deep carry niche and get a S&W 627PC (the 2.6" version so it would still be a carry gun). I want one, they are beautiful, and 8 rounds of .357mag would be nice in an occasional carry gun (and it would probably become my primary home defense gun).
Taurus 851. I used to be a big Taurus fan, but over the past few years they have lost me (I had a gun in the polymer gun recall, I have an issue with cylinder binding on my Taurus made 2" Rossi 461, I've read a lot online of people with newer production Taurus revolvers with the same issue, and both of my Rossi 461 revolvers were in the current safety recall, apparently they can fire if dropped or jarred). Still, a 6 shot revolver that is a hair smaller than the Colt Cobra, the steel version is lighter, and it is also available in a lightweight aluminum, and I can get the lightweight version with the bobbed hammer (851CH) for as little as $250 plus FFL transfer fee, I may have to consider it (though if I get it, I'll always have a little worry about it in the back of my mind). The negatives said, my Taurus 85CH has come to have one heck of a good trigger after a lot of use, it seems they use better spring design than the S&W J-frames on their small frame revolvers.
So, what do you think of my options (when considering my individual needs)? You guys helped me out quite a bit with the Cobra vs. King Cobra recently, so I'd like to hear what you say.
Edit at 10:20am: Several edits to clean things up... Never forget to proofread
Edit 2 (see edit 1): The Taurus is the 856
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