SirWendall
Inactive
I was wandering what a good backup gun to carry would be? I carry the G2 daily but can't decide on what to get next 
Backup gun
- Thread starter SirWendall
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Cheapshooter
New member
Any of the current popular mouse guns. The Kel-Tec P22 previously mentione. Or up the power level with just a tiny bit more weight and size with the P3at. If you particularly like Taurus, and want to keep with the brand, the PT 738 TCP will fit the bill perfectly. Other makes, Ruger LCP, S&W Bodyguard. plus more from other makers. If your manner of dress allows for a bit more bulk, and size you can step uo another notch to 9MM Luger with a Kahr PM9 (premium priced), or CM9 (much more affordable, but functions just as well)
ShootistPRS
New member
You are already carrying the backup gun you need to get one to carry as a primary.
The Taurus G2 is already a compact model.
The Taurus G2 is already a compact model.
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SirWendall
Inactive
@Cheapshooter I was thinking about the Kahr CM9. It's almost like a Glock 
TruthTellers
New member
Backup guns are very personal and they have to not just be smaller than the primary, small in size for the person, but fairly shootable and most of all, fit the theoretical use the person wants.
By theoretical use, I mean what situation do you envision yourself in where you will need to draw a BUG? Catastrophic failure of the primary? Separation of the primary gun from yourself (i.e. disarmed in a scuffle or lost during a disorienting event like an explosion, falling down a hill), lack of ammunition in a prolonged engagement?
Also, where do you think you will carry this BUG? Surely not somewhere as easy to access as the primary is. Will it be somewhere you can quickly draw from and fire accurately? If the BUG is for more firepower during a prolonged engagement, I'm assuming you're already behind cover, so a quick draw isn't critical here.
There's a lot of thinking that has to be thunk when considering a BUG. If you don't feel you absolutely need it or don't have the space for it on your person, maybe it's better if you just carried another magazine instead.
As for the hardware...
If you won't or don't want a revolver for various reasons, then you will have to look at .380's or Kel Tec's P32. I would not consider any other .32 besides the Kel Tec.
If you are open to a revolver, which I think you should be, Ruger LCR, S&W J frame, a Charter Arms, or North American Arms. The LCR is available in so many flavors, from DAO in a variety of chamberings to DA/SA .38 and .357's. I think .357 is too much, .22 sucks, so that leaves .38, .327, and 9mm.
The 9mm makes the most sense on paper, but because the Ruger works only with moon clips, you're going to have to think about how you would carry spare loaded clips for it. I don't think it sensible to do this for a BUG role, but reloading has to be in the realm of thought and plucking out empty 9mm and popping fresh rounds into a moon clip and then loading that into the gun is silly to seriously consider.
.38 is proven, .327 gives you one more round.
Where I think a good choice is would be the Charter Arms Pitbull, it's basically designed to be a backup gun. Going with the Charter gives you the realistic possibility of a reload as it doesn't use moon clips and you can use the ammunition from the primary weapon to reload the Charter.
North American Arms mini revolvers are the smallest BUG you can get, but they're also the toughest to shoot. If you feel you need a BUG, but can't carry anything bigger than this, then it's the only option.
If you go with a non-NAA revolver, it won't be cheap tho. Expect to pay over $400.
Personally, I would go with either a P32 or the Charter Arms. IMO, the .380's are more than I'd like to carry for a backup pistol and spare magazine.
By theoretical use, I mean what situation do you envision yourself in where you will need to draw a BUG? Catastrophic failure of the primary? Separation of the primary gun from yourself (i.e. disarmed in a scuffle or lost during a disorienting event like an explosion, falling down a hill), lack of ammunition in a prolonged engagement?
Also, where do you think you will carry this BUG? Surely not somewhere as easy to access as the primary is. Will it be somewhere you can quickly draw from and fire accurately? If the BUG is for more firepower during a prolonged engagement, I'm assuming you're already behind cover, so a quick draw isn't critical here.
There's a lot of thinking that has to be thunk when considering a BUG. If you don't feel you absolutely need it or don't have the space for it on your person, maybe it's better if you just carried another magazine instead.
As for the hardware...
If you won't or don't want a revolver for various reasons, then you will have to look at .380's or Kel Tec's P32. I would not consider any other .32 besides the Kel Tec.
If you are open to a revolver, which I think you should be, Ruger LCR, S&W J frame, a Charter Arms, or North American Arms. The LCR is available in so many flavors, from DAO in a variety of chamberings to DA/SA .38 and .357's. I think .357 is too much, .22 sucks, so that leaves .38, .327, and 9mm.
The 9mm makes the most sense on paper, but because the Ruger works only with moon clips, you're going to have to think about how you would carry spare loaded clips for it. I don't think it sensible to do this for a BUG role, but reloading has to be in the realm of thought and plucking out empty 9mm and popping fresh rounds into a moon clip and then loading that into the gun is silly to seriously consider.
.38 is proven, .327 gives you one more round.
Where I think a good choice is would be the Charter Arms Pitbull, it's basically designed to be a backup gun. Going with the Charter gives you the realistic possibility of a reload as it doesn't use moon clips and you can use the ammunition from the primary weapon to reload the Charter.
North American Arms mini revolvers are the smallest BUG you can get, but they're also the toughest to shoot. If you feel you need a BUG, but can't carry anything bigger than this, then it's the only option.
If you go with a non-NAA revolver, it won't be cheap tho. Expect to pay over $400.
Personally, I would go with either a P32 or the Charter Arms. IMO, the .380's are more than I'd like to carry for a backup pistol and spare magazine.
Oldjarhead
New member
I generally carry two guns on me anyway, but in these extremely hot summer months in central Texas, I find carrying two small, but potent guns adequate, than one larger one, that is hard to conceal in the summer. Jim Cirillio, the famous NYPD stakeout cop, that was in something like seventeen gun battles, in his stakeouts, had this to say about backups. He carried his primary, usually a good size gun and then a good snub revolver as a backup, he called his "New York reload." That was in the 1970s. Today in summer I carry a Kahr PM9, with 124g gold dot hollow points for short barrels, and a Smith and Wesson 640 Centennial in .357 magnum with full .357 Hornady Critical Defense 125g hollowpoints. Either one can be my primary or my backup. Depends on which one I can deploy faster, I guess. Easier for me anyway.
Cheapshooter
New member
Not really. The Kahr 9MM is about the same size as the Glock 380. Plus no trigger dongle safety thingy on the Kahr, and a lot longer trigger pull.
Personally I like it better than the Glocks of close to the same size.
reynolds357
New member
After I went through closed quarters combat training, I traded my back up gun in for a back up edge weapon.
I like having a 2nd pistol as a pocket option that I can put my hand on without revealing I'm carrying, handy if approached by someone "shady" in parking lot.
I started with a LCP 380, "better than nothing" but didn't have faith in a 380 to stop an attacker ASAP which is the goal.
I moved up to a Kahr PM9, a bit larger than LCP, very pocketable size (CM9 less pricey version).
More confident in 9mm ballistics than 380 and the PM9 is easier to shoot well.
PM9 chrono averages:
Federal HST 124 +P @ 1,120 fps / 345# KE
Corbon 115 +P JHP @ 1,264 fps / 408# KE
After while it occurred to me that it might be advantageous to carry the 2nd gun pocket option in weak hand pocket in case dominant hand was stabbed, shot, had pit bull attached
ect...
Shooting a LCP 380 one handed weak hand sucked a lot.
Kahr 9mm definitely better one hand weak hand too.
Summary:
LCP 380 "better than nothing" but hard to shoot well and 380 ballistics are not what I want to bet my life on.
Kahr PM9/CM9 is pocketable, offers decent ballistics and shoots well for size.
I started with a LCP 380, "better than nothing" but didn't have faith in a 380 to stop an attacker ASAP which is the goal.
I moved up to a Kahr PM9, a bit larger than LCP, very pocketable size (CM9 less pricey version).
More confident in 9mm ballistics than 380 and the PM9 is easier to shoot well.
PM9 chrono averages:
Federal HST 124 +P @ 1,120 fps / 345# KE
Corbon 115 +P JHP @ 1,264 fps / 408# KE
After while it occurred to me that it might be advantageous to carry the 2nd gun pocket option in weak hand pocket in case dominant hand was stabbed, shot, had pit bull attached
ect...Shooting a LCP 380 one handed weak hand sucked a lot.
Kahr 9mm definitely better one hand weak hand too.
Summary:
LCP 380 "better than nothing" but hard to shoot well and 380 ballistics are not what I want to bet my life on.
Kahr PM9/CM9 is pocketable, offers decent ballistics and shoots well for size.
I have recently begun thinking about carrying a BUG, at least some of the time. How do you plan to carry yours? IWB weak side, pocket carry, ankle or some kind of off body carry? All provide access to a 2nd gun should your primary get lost, stop working, or run out of ammo. All have their own unique advantages. IWB weak side is good if your strong hand is out of commission (fending off an attack, injured or for whatever reason). Ankle carry provides easy access to your gun while sitting and/or driving. Pocket carry lets you put your hand on the gun without drawing attention if you think a situation is about to unfold but it hasn't really presented itself yet. Off body options like the various Maxpedition bags allow a full sized or near full sized gun if you want it. Of course, they all also have their own disadvantages (size of gun, ease of access, off body isn't fully under 100% control 100% of the time, etc.). Personally, I'm leaning towards all of them depending upon the situation/my choice of the day (I figure I want my primary to always be in the same place for easy muscle memory, but for some reason I don't feel that is as urgent for a BUG).
Assuming pocket or ankle (probably the most common choices), you probably want to go small. Be careful that whatever you get has usable sights (I am going to have to take a loss when I trade my LCP, and I'm definitely getting rid of it since the sights are nearly unusable). If you get a small 9mm, try to borrow or rent one to be sure that the one you want to buy isn't too bad on recoil (recoil isn't just comfort at the range, and you hear people say you won't feel it if you ever really need it, but high recoil can also mean slower follow up shots which might matter quite a bit). I have found my SIG P290RS and a Kahr PM9 I've shot in the past to be pretty decently comfortable for such small pistols, and my S&W 442 and my Kel-tec Pf-9 are quite uncomfortable, especially when practicing with defensive loads. If you go with a snub, my suggestion is to go with steel if you can (if your BUG location requires something lighter and you go alloy or polymer, be sure to use a lower recoil ammo), and if you do go with a .357mag load it with .38spl.
There are quite a few nice .38spl and .357mag snubs, small pocket .380s and micro-9mms so I won't make a specific recommendation. I will mention my choices. I plan to trade my LCP due to the poor sights, I want either a Colt Mustang, SIG P238 or a Remington RM380 (though from what I read, the RM380's sights may only be marginally better). In 9mm, again, I don't like my Pf-9, but my SIG P290RS is terrific for a small 9mm, and if I went lighter I'd go with the Kahr PM9. If the Shield was available at current prices when I got my P290, I probably would have bought the Shield (both are good guns). I have a S&W442 that I may keep, but if I do I will only load it with lower recoil rounds (lower grain weight or possibly wadcutters, no +P), and see myself carrying my Taurus 85CH more often (when I regularly carried snubs, I usually carried both). I'd like to get a Kimber K6 to take on the the snub role, I like the extra round (6 v. the J-frame's 5) and the extra weight should help with recoil/quicker follow up shots.
One option you might want to consider, since your primary is already a smallish compact gun (or larger subcompact), why not carry two of the same gun? It may be too big for pocket carry in most pants, but it would work well IWB/weak side or in an ankle holster and would work in a jacket pocket in spring, fall and winter (I have a decade old Taurus PT140 Millennium Pro so I know the size pretty well). After shooting it a bit at the range, and finally carrying it for the first time when I went to VA today, I really like my S&W M&P40c for carry. I'm thinking of doing that myself when I don't carry the 2nd gun in a pocket and picking up a 2nd M&P40c.
Assuming pocket or ankle (probably the most common choices), you probably want to go small. Be careful that whatever you get has usable sights (I am going to have to take a loss when I trade my LCP, and I'm definitely getting rid of it since the sights are nearly unusable). If you get a small 9mm, try to borrow or rent one to be sure that the one you want to buy isn't too bad on recoil (recoil isn't just comfort at the range, and you hear people say you won't feel it if you ever really need it, but high recoil can also mean slower follow up shots which might matter quite a bit). I have found my SIG P290RS and a Kahr PM9 I've shot in the past to be pretty decently comfortable for such small pistols, and my S&W 442 and my Kel-tec Pf-9 are quite uncomfortable, especially when practicing with defensive loads. If you go with a snub, my suggestion is to go with steel if you can (if your BUG location requires something lighter and you go alloy or polymer, be sure to use a lower recoil ammo), and if you do go with a .357mag load it with .38spl.
There are quite a few nice .38spl and .357mag snubs, small pocket .380s and micro-9mms so I won't make a specific recommendation. I will mention my choices. I plan to trade my LCP due to the poor sights, I want either a Colt Mustang, SIG P238 or a Remington RM380 (though from what I read, the RM380's sights may only be marginally better). In 9mm, again, I don't like my Pf-9, but my SIG P290RS is terrific for a small 9mm, and if I went lighter I'd go with the Kahr PM9. If the Shield was available at current prices when I got my P290, I probably would have bought the Shield (both are good guns). I have a S&W442 that I may keep, but if I do I will only load it with lower recoil rounds (lower grain weight or possibly wadcutters, no +P), and see myself carrying my Taurus 85CH more often (when I regularly carried snubs, I usually carried both). I'd like to get a Kimber K6 to take on the the snub role, I like the extra round (6 v. the J-frame's 5) and the extra weight should help with recoil/quicker follow up shots.
One option you might want to consider, since your primary is already a smallish compact gun (or larger subcompact), why not carry two of the same gun? It may be too big for pocket carry in most pants, but it would work well IWB/weak side or in an ankle holster and would work in a jacket pocket in spring, fall and winter (I have a decade old Taurus PT140 Millennium Pro so I know the size pretty well). After shooting it a bit at the range, and finally carrying it for the first time when I went to VA today, I really like my S&W M&P40c for carry. I'm thinking of doing that myself when I don't carry the 2nd gun in a pocket and picking up a 2nd M&P40c.
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I've carried a gun, almost every day of my life, for almost 40 years. In uniform, I always carried at least one BUG, a Smith 642.
I've tried to carry two guns off duty. One is none, two is one etc. And, I made a discovery. Carrying around two concealed guns is a PITA.
When just doing normal people stuff, shopping, running around, going to a public bathroom, it's a pain to keep everything secured.
Off duty I carry a P239 and two spare mags. It's served me well.
For me, the inconvenience of carrying two guns all the time just wasn't worth it. Losing one in a public place scares the crap out of me. Trying to protect two guns is tough. At least at work, one is in a real secure duty holster. Off duty? Not so much.
I've tried to carry two guns off duty. One is none, two is one etc. And, I made a discovery. Carrying around two concealed guns is a PITA.
When just doing normal people stuff, shopping, running around, going to a public bathroom, it's a pain to keep everything secured.
Off duty I carry a P239 and two spare mags. It's served me well.
For me, the inconvenience of carrying two guns all the time just wasn't worth it. Losing one in a public place scares the crap out of me. Trying to protect two guns is tough. At least at work, one is in a real secure duty holster. Off duty? Not so much.
Nanuk, the 357SIG round really has my interest! I have a Glock 24L longslide 40 and have been tempted to put a LW 357SIG 6in barrel in it! I have an interesting collection here and after looking at and using various calibers I put a 357SIG way up there, quite the round!
I have a G33 I carry alot, nice pistol!
I have a G33 I carry alot, nice pistol!