As a general rule, don't face down four men with long guns with a handgun

R

Rant Casey

New member
I'll start with a little background info here. I live on a fairly large parcel of land, secluded from any other homes. Basically, it's a lot of woods, then a very large clearing. I don't see anyone on my property unexpected, ever and I have no neighbors. This morning I went out to do some groccery shopping, came onto my road and noticed a car parked suspeciously close to my house where I see four men in their early 20's walking around the back of my house all carrying rifles and shotguns. Here's the situation, my fiance is home alone and a relatively recently injured paraplegic. There are guns availible to her and she knows how to shoot, but not against four armed men. I get no cell phone service at my house, no one does. Even if I had cell coverage, no police would possibly make it to my house in time. I did what I thought was right, hid my car out of sight and ran towards them with their backs facing me. I got within maybe 20 yards of them after a 100 yard dash, gun drawn on them and made sure they realized they were not getting a second warning to drop their guns. Guns dropped on the ground, hands in the air turning slowly, about to crap themselves. I was kind of shocked they were the scared ones. It turns out I knew one of them and he was a friend of my fiance and he had been shooting out back of my house on my range. It seems he had called my house, left a msg then she called him back and said it was ok to come shooting at the house. It all went bad because no one told me anything, it had slipped her mind completely. I almost ended up in a gun battle with 4 armed young men in the middle of nowhere with absolutely no cover armed with a glock 21. I'm confident in my skills, but that is not the ideal situation for anyone to be in, bringing a handgun to a rifle fight. Here's the ironic part, I carry an Ar 15 empty with 5 mags in the back of my vehicle, had I not just barreled out of the vehicle I could have engaged them from a much safer distance, from cover and had them drop their weapons before advancing, but I admit I paniced a bit and barely even put the truck in park. In all honestly, I'm surprised everyone came out of this unscathed, this is my worst case scenario that I had hoped to be prepared for, and it was a false alarm.

In the end I invited them in my house, apologized if I scared them but let them know how close they came to dying (that was me being cocky). They were cool about it, the other three guys were a little shaken though. I let them know that they're welcome to come shoot here, however they need to let ME know, so next time I don't remember the ar in the back of my vehicle.


Just curious, how many of you would have shot first? I'm still a little shook up over it, because I realize that I almost shot four innocent men or engaged in an open gun fight with four people while drastically underarmed.
 
whoa...I think I would have called with my cell to warn the wife as I was making my way to the house on foot. I haved learned from my years in the military to always report (ie...pick up the phone) before engaging in any action alone.
 
Pretty scarey situation, probably would have reacted much as you did (& not shooting them on sight). This is a perfect example of WHY you must identify a threat & wait until it IS a threat. If one of them had pointed a rifle in my general direction, it would have ended a LOT different then it did.
 
I get no cell phone service at my house, no one does.
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Obviously he could not call ahead...

That is a very tough situation. I think that next time maybe you should take the time to run a few tactical actions through your head, such as grab the AR :)

OTOH, lets say that you, like most people did not have a long gun handy. The best bet may have been to drive your vehicle towards your house. Inside the vehicle, driving towards them you have the engine block to provide cover. Driving towards them would have also given you the opportunity to get a better look and possibly recognize the man ou knew, or at the least, see what their reaction to you arriving was like. Once you are near the house, and if you are still unsure of their intentions, get out and use the vehicle as cover while you covered them with your pistol. If shooting had started, you would have had decent cover while they were in the open, while also positioning yourself closer to get into the house where I presume that you have long guns and a land line.
 
Ironically, the vehicle mentioned is an H1 hummer, which would provide ideal cover as far as civilian non armored vehicles are concerned, hell it could provide cover for a platoon. Like I said though, this exact scenario was never played out in my mind before, one of the few that hasn't to be honest. I wanted to be able to surprise them with their backs turned while getting into handgun range. I really should have grabbed the rifle, but they were awfully close to my house, I would have had to run around back, open it, unzip the bag, load it, sure it wouldn't have taken long but in my head I didn't have any time to spare. I'm just thankful this was all a false alarm and no one got hurt.
 
Just a suggestion for the future, since you don't have cell coverage at your house: it might be useful to carry a good walkie-talkie with you, and make sure your girlfriend keeps one on her at all times. As remote as your location is, you might even want to get something with a base station. I doubt you will have a situation exactly like this arise again, but it certainly does illustrate the value of good communication.
 
Moderator, I respectfully submit ...

that "Gen Disc" is a good spot, to get our attention and thinking going.

The poster appears to handled it, to a successful conclusion but now needs positive feedback. Sound like the communication area is prime concern.

Secondary area is the GF and what are her options???

Please let this ride here, (unless get way out of hand)

JHR
 
Because of the setup and details of my property, . . . this same scenario could have played out at my place.

Without cell phone service, . . . I would have simply driven past my house as though I were a neighbor, . . . then parked, . . . gotten out, . . . and slipped through the bushes, and tree line into the house. Reason? My AR is in the house, . . .

As stated by creature, . . . get the LEO's on the way first if it is possible. Another reason for getting into the house first.

Once inside, . . . I would have prepared for the battle, . . . but not initiated anything. I would also have gotten my binoculars and tried to ID them, . . . as well as my camera and taken pictures of them.

Four guys with rifles against myself and my wife are bad odds, . . . and I give you kudos for all turning out OK, . . . but I certainly would have done some heavy thinking before confronting 4 rifle toters with a handgun. And I absolutely would not have confronted them without being behind some kind of cover. Not being sarcastic or mean spirited, . . . but that is the kind of action that gets chronicled on headstones. Find some cover, . . . or at least concealment before initiating the confrontation.

May God bless,
Dwight
 
interesting scenario.
i live out in the country as well and have thought about similar "encounters".
my solution was to put a gun safe in the shop in the barn. I dont keep anything valuable in it (worried about humidity etc), an old AR and a 30-30 lever, a bunch of mags and ammo.
never had to exercise that option, but it makes me feel good to know i can.:)
 
I would definitely get a portable phone that you can use out there. At the very least a car phone. Remember those? lol
 
I would start shopping for a communications company and offer up a portion of my land to lease as a site for a cell tower.
 
Creature ~

It costs around $200 to purchase a cell phone repeating station to install in your home, and for some rural folks, it is money well spent. However, it really only works if your area has spotty reception rather than none at all. In cases where you have no coverage at all, you're SOL.

Important: even someone with otherwise good coverage can have the cell phone crap out for some other reason (battery died? phone died? tower's out?). For this reason, it's really necessary to have back up plans that do not rely on technology, even in situations where relying on technology might be your first choice.

pax
 
Why isn't the AR loaded and ready to go?

One of my worst nightmares is someone breaking into my house, and, due to not having either a gun in reach, or a gun loaded, I go down.

I figure ST. Peter might reject me on the grounds stupid and Heaven don't mix.;):D
 
Tough situation, glad everything turned out ok. Seeing that your vehicle is an H1, I would have driven towards them. The sounds of the vehicle barreling over the yard could have alerted your fiance of possible trouble. As others have stated it also offers cover.

If their weapons had been cased you probably would have read the situation much differently. ie; friendlies instead of foes.
 
Just curious, how many of you would have shot first?
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Why would there have been ANY reason to shoot first? Nothing you described indicated the guys were doing anything with mal-intent. They were simply armed and by your house. Yes, that might be bothersome, but they did not try to gain entry or act like they wanted entry.

When you first saw them, they were walking around behind your house. You then had to park in a hidden location and sprint the 100 yards to catch up. I don't know how big your house is, but by the time you did all that, those guys had to be well on their way away from your house.

So when you finally engaged these four guys, the perceived threat was already moving away from you and your home. As such, not only did you engage 4 more heavily armed guys whilst out in the open, with no cover for yourself, from too close, and only with a handgun, it sounds like you did so needlessly.

I can't imagine that anybody in that situation would have shot first.

Why isn't the AR loaded and ready to go?

One of my worst nightmares is someone breaking into my house, and, due to not having either a gun in reach, or a gun loaded, I go down.
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I think the AR probably isn't loaded and ready to go because he doesn't sleep in his car or keep his car in his house when he sleeps.
 
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