Are Premium Loads Worth It?

T

ThomasT

New member
I was watching ammo test on Youtube today in particular the Remington 115Gr Hollow Points. The reason is I have several hundred of these loaded and about 800 more loose bullets to be loaded. Its what I carry in my S&W9VE that is my truck gun. I also shoot them from my Marlin Camp Carbine.

In the vidoes they seem to penetrate to around 12+" and expand very well with picture perfect mushrooms. Loaded in the UMC brand they are well under $20 for a box of 50. Why would a person pay a dollar or more for the specialty rounds when these look like they should work just as well? They are cheap enough to use for practice too. Here are some of the videos I watched.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxTaz-RlDOU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-n6Wv-f1HI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhcPNMYLBzA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiA2LnWmrrM
 
It looks like a good round. Some concerns I have are:

1) The 4th video was next to useless for evaluating the effectiveness of the round. All it did was show how it might expand in ideal circumstances.

2) Videos 1-3 were interesting; but only one used actual ballistic gel and none of the gels were calibrated, which can throw off testing.

3) No barrier testing other than denim. If you don't have to defeat all of the barriers in an FBI test, you can make a round cheaper.

4) I'd be concerned how terminal ballistics might change fired out of a carbine. Will it break up? Petals peel off? The water drum test showed some core and jacket separation just from a pistol.

All in all though, I'd say the UMC 115gr JHP looks like an excellent value based on those videos.
 
You can find Federal HSTs for about $30 per 50, if you look around.
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To me this is the benchmark. They meet the criteria and are used by many law enforcement agencies (which should save them from being labelled exotic). I do make an exception when hiking with a 10MM - but I can easily explain my primary concern was of animals which accounts for the "exotic" round.
 
For use in a 4-5" pistol, it's hard to beat 115-124 GoldDots-nothing more is needed.
The carbines will turn many of the bullets made to expand in short barrels into washers at close range. For dedicated carbine use, I have a case of 147 GoldDots that work perfectly. They will still expand @100 yards about like 115-124's from a pistol @ 10 yards.
 
Just about every bullet can look impressive, given favorable circumstances, which may or may not be present during an actual situation.
If you're looking for a performance edge there's other more reliable things.
Like shooting and survival skills.
 
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Raimius I will check and see if I can find any of the federal loads you posted. My point was that the remington 115gr bullets seemed to give decent expansion from guns with barrels around the 4" length.

They are what I carry and what I have loaded and lots more to be loaded. I don't get all excited about excessive expansion. I like to have good penetration. The speer gold dots expand but I always felt maybe they expanded too much. I admit I have never tried them because every time I try to buy some they are out of stock and no back order.
 
Just checked at Midway and Grafs and no Gold Dots in stock. If I could find some I would give them a try out. I also like the 115gr XTP bullets. I do have some of them loaded.
 
Remington's UMC brand isn't their "premium" band. If you're using factory ammo, you have to try a box of as many brands as you can to find the ammo your firearm shoots best. The price of said ammo means nothing.
Camp Carbines were discontinued in 1999, but there's a bit of 16" velocity data with different factory brands here.
http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/9luger.html
 
T.O. I know that the UMC isn't a premium brand. That was my point. It seems to expand and penetrate as well as the high dollar stuff and do it for a lot less money. I for one will not pay over a buck a round for ammunition. In my earlier post I stated I was handloading these bullets. I rarely ever buy factory ammo.

Thanks for the link. I have owned camp carbines a long time. My buddies 13 year old son killed his first deer with one. The deer ran about 45 yards and dropped. It never ran out of sight. Its easy to make hits on a man sized target at 200 yards with one.
 
Just checked at Midway and Grafs and no Gold Dots in stock. If I could find some I would give them a try out. I also like the 115gr XTP bullets. I do have some of them loaded.
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Ammunitiondepot.com currently has 50 round boxes of Gold Dots in stock. Their shipping is a bit high if you're only buying a box or two, but I have never had an issue dealing with them.
 
Hi jasmith85. I was not looking for loaded ammo. Only componant bullets. I never checked to see if midway or grafs had loaded ammo. Like I stated earlier I almost never buy factory ammo. But thanks for the link.

I started reloading in 1982 and just use my reloads. They seem to shoot just as well and are far cheaper.
 
Are Premium Loads Worth It?
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This is something you need to determine for yourself. Most major bullet manufacturers produce quality expanding bullets, even at the entry level. A poorly placed perfect mushroom kills no better than well placed FMJ. This is why my criteria is more on accuracy and reliability from my particular gun, than claims by others of what works best for them.

Don't cheap out on defensive loads guys.
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I've found over the years that price, many times does not relate to performance, especially when it comes to bullets. The shooting world has been filled with pricey gimmicky SD/HD projectiles over the last few years, many claiming to have massive expansion as compared to standard HPs. Most of these are here today and gone tomorrow, despite the claims and their excessive costs. Similar to hunting bullets. Every year there's a flood of new bullets that are supposed to superior to anything used in the past. Still, good ol' Core-Loks still take down game just as consistently, at a much lower cost. One needs to do their research and not just fall for advertising hype and thinking the highest cost means the highest performance. Many of us remember the old "flying ashtrays" meant for massive expansion at .45ACP velocities. Problem was, they didn't feed reliably in many 1911s.
 
I've found over the years that price, many times does not relate to performance, especially when it comes to bullets. The shooting world has been filled with pricey gimmicky SD/HD projectiles over the last few years, many claiming to have massive expansion as compared to standard HPs. Most of these are here today and gone tomorrow, despite the claims and their excessive costs. Similar to hunting bullets. Every year there's a flood of new bullets that are supposed to superior to anything used in the past. Still, good ol' Core-Loks still take down game just as consistently, at a much lower cost. One needs to do their research and not just fall for advertising hype and thinking the highest cost means the highest performance. Many of us remember the old "flying ashtrays" meant for massive expansion at .45ACP velocities. Problem was, they didn't feed reliably in many 1911s.
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Thank you Buck460 you said that very well and summed up what I was trying to say. I do believe some bullets are more gimmick than have any real performance advantage over whats already out there.

The Hornady rubber tipped bullets for lever actions is a perfect example. I would like to see a high speed picture of one in flight. I bet that little pointy rubber nose is flatter than a pancake from air pressure. The real advantage they have is being loaded to a higher pressure and velocity. John Barsness made the point that nothing flattens trajectory like velocity. At least out to 300 yards.

So if premium handgun bullets do offer a few percentage points more effectiveness I still think a slightly lesser hollow point right on target would be better than a less perfect shot from a two dollar bullet. And with the cheaper bullets you can afford to practice with what you carry. Not only do you get to see how they group but get to verify with a couple hundred rounds that your gun will feed them and eject them every time without fail.
 
Barnes all copper , and others have sown they are better performers and more consistant that is worth it for hunting and SD so that's what I use !! :)
 
"Heck Yea" the ammo manufacturers say about premium loads. "Makes us a ton of money."
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Thats how I feel about it. "Buy our Super Bullet and your safety is guaranteed". Sure it is. The simple, inexpensive bullets in the videos I posted looked they would work as well as anything else. Plus people have been stopping fights and killing each other with round balls and round nose bullets for a few centuries.

Premium bullets to me are like the high dollar fishing lures that cost $5 and on up. I think they catch more fishermen than they do fish. I have caught a bunch of bass on just red and white spoons, silver spoons and H&H spinners. And they are cheap. Maybe thats why they work so well. If I snag one and lose it no big deal. Tie a new one one and keep fishing. And the biggest bass I ever caught was caught with a plastic worm. About the cheapest lure you can get.
 
This is totally anecdotal, but I ave seen one shot stops a FMJ target loads and 1 shot stops with hollow points and other duty loads. Most of the people who had 5 or 6 holes in them were no longer combative. Hits count multiple hits are better.

Legally of course you have to be able to articulate why you shot so many times (he was still coming at me).

I subscribe to "shoot a 45" (accurately of course) because i know the bullets won't get smaller and hopefully will get bigger. I own and carry a 9mm, but prefer a 45. I'd carry a 44 mag auto if I could conceal it and make multi accurate hits

YMMV
 
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