Archery question ...

I guess if I shot one and it ran across my neighbors or further I'd get a lot of neighbors and tell them that I see blood and get everyone to help track. Then tell them poachers must be doing this and after locating deer tell them to help put it in my truck and the game warden wants me to bring it to him for investigation. And take it straight to the processing plant! :)
 
Originally posted by Pahoo:

Would agree that this is always a good policy but for these types of hunts/ conservation effort, not easy or realistic. Practically all are conducted in City/County areas, housing additions, city and county parks that border on houses. Even some golf courses. Most of these areas are not directly controlled by private homes.
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Not always easy, but always realistic to try. I don't know where the OP lives so I don't know his local/state regs on trespassing. But here, you need permission to step foot on any private property you don't own......unless you are a meter reader or utility worker. Even then, by law they are supposed to stay within the easements or get permission. If one can't get access to where a deer will probably drop, they need to find a different place to hunt. Pretty simple. Shooting a deer without a legal way to retrieve that animal is also illegal here. City and County parks and other municipal areas are not private property. If hunting there is legal, with or without a specific permit, access is usually a given. Same goes for a municipal Golf Course. But if it is private, even if open to the public for golfing, you need to have permission to be on that property for other reasons. In my experience, I have found that folks generally take deer/deer hunting and their rights to own private property very dear and very personal. Around here, I have seen more family/friend/neighbor relationships ruined over deer/deer hunting and trespassing during deer hunting than by woman and money. My understanding is, the OP says he would be hunting in area surrounded by private property. Realistically then, he needs permission to enter the neighbors yard ethically and odds are....legally. Gettin' permission is still more realistic than dropping a deer within 20 yards with any archery equipment.

Originally posted by Doyle:

See NoSecondBest's post about why deliberate head shots are a BAD idea on deer. WAY too many deer get wounded by idiots who THINK they are good enough for a consistent head shot
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+1
 
I have shot many deer with a rifle that were standing on the edge of deep ravines. You better believe I did not want that deer taking two steps. If you hit a deer broadside with a rifle through the flat shoulder bone it will drop. Period. I have had people try to tell me otherwise. I think not. I have hit running deer at that spot and the deer goes down like a bag of cement falling off a moving truck. I have also shot a couple between the eyes. If the deer is facing you, how do you "Shoot the jaw off" the deer without hitting it in the neck or shooting over it's head? That must be a pretty anemic round you have if you shoot the jaw off and it bounces off the neck. I strongly suspect (After hearing 7 fast shots out of a '94 Winchesters) that if the jaw stories are true, the hunters probably were not aiming at the head to begin with. I have seen or killed deer with: an arrow through the neck(And just about any part of the anatomy you can imagine) front legs shot off, back legs shot off, gutshot, assshot, bullet hole through the ear, nose shot off, bullet hole through the main beam, and healed over bullets and buckshot in every cut of meat you can imagine. I can only think that whoever did that shooting was just aiming in the general direction of the deer. You aim where you want to and let people that are better shots aim where we want to. Oh, this should get the self righteous experts wound up, I also frequently hunt with center fire .22's.
 
Most people's advice here is spot on unfortunately there are people on here that don't know what they're talking about (gunplummer). But hunting where you're talking about IF you want to keep peace probably wouldn't be a wise decision.
 
I've posted my comments based on my experience. I try to offer the best advice I can to help you answer your question. However, there is a lot of advice put on the internet by people who don't have good advice to offer. They either make stuff up, guess and don't really know, or just like to jump in on any conversation and take the opposite stand even if it defies any logic what so ever. Read it all, try to sort out the BS from the real stuff, and make the best decision you can. Some of the comments posted are very helpful (most are in this post) but some are really off the wall. You figure out which is which. Best of luck.
 
I hunt deer in an area that is surrounded (within 100 yards in some places) by some of the most rabid anti-hunters in the world.

Your best bet is to only take shots on a completely calm animal, at close range, and be absolutely certain that you're going for the front-half/middle of the lungs, trying not to hit the opposite leg. Don't take heart shots, you don't need to hit the heart for quick kills and I've been told (and my experience would seem to bear it out) that heart shot deer run farther. Theory is that it hurts more, so they don't stop until they die whereas double lung shots without the heart don't tend to hurt as much so they stop and look back. I don't know, but it does seem to be true.

It might also be because heart shots also tend to hit heavy leg bone, which probably does hurt a lot more than "just" a hole through the chest.

In any case, a completely calm deer that has no idea your there and takes an arrow through both lungs will OFTEN run only 20-50 yards and stop to look for what bit it.

Notice that I say "often". No guarantees, ever.

In any case, you're hunting legally. Come what may. If you know the folks nearby and are on good terms with them, let them know what you'll be doing and ask permission to recover/track deer before it happens. If not, or they refuse, and the deer goes onto and does not leave their property, contact Environmental Conservation or local LE and let them deal with it.
 
Excellent post Brian...especially the info about calling your local DNA or LE.

Here in Ohio, many have the false impression that if you shoot an animal and it runs from land you are legal to hunt on to posted land or land you don't have permission to hunt on that it's ok to track that animal without land owners permission. It's not and this can get you a fat trespassing ticket.

If the scenario of a shot deer running from land you are legal to hunt to posted or land you don't have permission to hunt, either get permission to track from the land owner or get ahold of your local game warden.

I had to do this on a nice buck that went onto an anti-hunter's property and piled up no more than 75yds onto his property. This guy owned no more then 6 acres but his property adjoins probably 300 acres of deep woods in which I had permission to hunt. Just my luck that buck ran on his property and when I started tracking I ran into the anti's heavily posted fence line. I stopped, called the property owner that I had permission to hunt on and explained the situation. He told me how anti-hunting the guy was and strongly suggested I either call DNR or forget about the deer. Game warden came out, knocked on their door , talked to a lady and retrieved my deer for me. I never hunted within 300-400yds of that property again.
 
I have to agree with most of the posters, it would be a miracle for an arrow to drop a deer on the spot. A rifle you can call 100%. There is no argument about that. I actually lived in a shotgun area for a while and shot quite a few deer there. Some of the neighbors were dead set against bows, and with good reason. * Note previous post of deer running around with an arrow through it's neck.* The place was a hotbed for lyme disease and even the people that did not hunt were O.K. with me sitting closer to their house with a shotgun than the law allowed (Legal with permission from owners). I laid out a fire zone and explained it to them. I also only hunted during the day and during the week when no one was around. It is amazing the way deer move around during the day in populated areas because the neighborhood is quiet. I think if you never made an effort to know your neighbors and approach them only when you want something, you are going to have trouble. Good luck with that.
 
A friend lived in the city limits but had a large lot and several acres of undeveloped property behind it. He routinely fed deer up til the legal limit before hunting season and arrowed them during hunting season. Had a hook to hang them from in his garage to dress them while in out of the cold wind.

He did not lose any, but he was not burdened by unpleasant neighbors.
 
Guess nobody caught the Rambo reference....:o

It really sounds like you need to get permission in advance from your neighbors or beg off trying to hunt there. I definitely recommend against ticking them off just for a hunting opportunity. Remember, you have to live next to those people. They could make your life difficult. If they are anti-hunting, and your deer drops on their property, even the LEO or Game Warden knocking to take care of the problem still won't bode well for friendly relations...
 
Originally posted by Brian Pfleuger:

Notice that I say "often". No guarantees, ever.

In any case, you're hunting legally. Come what may. If you know the folks nearby and are on good terms with them, let them know what you'll be doing and ask permission to recover/track deer before it happens. If not, or they refuse, and the deer goes onto and does not leave their property, contact Environmental Conservation or local LE and let them deal with it.
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You are correct......No Guarantees. While calling the warden or local LEO and having them knock on the door instead of you, MAY get you your deer, in my state it is not a guarantee. The land owner is not legally obligated to allow a warden onto their property to retrieve a dead animal unless it is evidence in a crime. The property owner is not bound to retrieve the animal because of wanton waste because he did not shoot it in the first place. If the land owner wants your deer to lay there and rot he has that right.....or he can allow the warden to retrieve it and donate it to someone on the "in need" list.....or he can ask the warden for a carcass tag and use the meat himself or tag it and donate it to the local food pantry. The landowner can legally tag the animal himself if he has a legal hunting license, even tho he did not shoot it. I know this because this subject comes up on "Warden Night" in nearly everyone of the hunter safety classes I help teach. That's why we also teach.....get permission first!
 
Absolutely true, but a good many folks bow to the authority of the warden, real or perceived and, if they don't, such is life. Go shoot another one. The anti-hunter can rest on his principles and enjoy the bloating deer in his yard.

Sometimes there is no getting permission and no hope of "good relations". Do your best, live with the chances or don't hunt there.

I lost one the year before last. I assume I made a bad shot but we'll never be sure. Followed the trail to the edge of Anti-Hunter Fantasy Land and walked away. Called LE and told them, asked them to call me if anyone reported anything. I never heard back.
 
Few years back when I preferred a bow. Well more than a few years really. But when I did hunt with one I discovered something unusual. It appeared to me when a deer was completely relaxed in his/her surroundings. Chance's were if I made a good un-noticable shot on it. (lung &/or top of its heart.) under 30 yards. I took notice the way they behaved. I doubt they knew they were hit even. Just totally confused. By the time they realized something was wrong. It was to late for them to go more than a few feet before piling up. More than not they fell within a few feet where they were originally hit. But those few I shot that were very alert. You could bet I was going to do some walking to find them. Regardless of how good my shot placement was. Seems like they were just set to take off if they felt threatened by anything. Even a pesky deer fly.
Those days I bow hunted the woods. I carried a Browning 70-lb Mirage w/ 4" overdraw. Shooting 28" 2213s aluminum shafts with NAP Thunderhead 100 Broadheads w/carbon inserts and 3" 3-feathered shaft. Very fast for its time. And probably still faster than many bows seen today. My advice OP. Shoot the one's that seem very relaxed and moping along. Those that appear skiddish and very alert. No matter how big or small. Give them a pass. Remember left unmolested. Perhaps your next encounter with that same animal will be under much better circumstances.

S/S
 
Originally posted by Brian Pfleuger:

I lost one the year before last. I assume I made a bad shot but we'll never be sure. Followed the trail to the edge of Anti-Hunter Fantasy Land and walked away. Called LE and told them, asked them to call me if anyone reported anything. I never heard back
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Happens more than folks care to admit......especially on the internet where so many folks "never miss'' or have never had to blood trail a deer, much less lose one. :rolleyes:

But for most of us folks that it has happened to, it wasn't because we were hunting such a small parcel that it was inevitable. If one is hunting a 1-1 1/2 acre parcel with a house and a yard on it, odds are, even a completely relaxed deer, double lung hit will make it next door to the neighbors. Remember....a acre is smaller than the football field next to the high school.
 
In my case, the situation is forced on us by the Anti loons. The deer population of the small village is about 10x the maximum healthy, sustainable herd and the vocal minority won't allow any functional solution inside the village limits. So, we (through a program run by Cornell University) hunt the edges. Obviously, we'd prefer to be back away from those properties but sometimes you just have to be in a certain place if you want to hunt certain deer.

Speaking of the Cornell program, I have to go back to a statement made in the OP...

You speak of "smallish deer, 125-150 pounds".... well, part of the Cornell program is that every deer killed has to be weighed at an official check station. There have been hundreds of deer killed, I think the program is over the 600 mark now but it might be 400, in any case, a lot. As of previous to last season, as I haven't heard the numbers from that season yet, the largest doe taken in the program was 149 pounds field dressed and the largest buck just over 200 pounds. These are NY deer, which while not the biggest in America are certainly bigger than most. The average adult doe is almost exactly 100 pounds, dressed. Ours have ranged from 95-109 pounds and the average buck (not your big daddy 6 year old 12-pt) is about 125 pounds dressed.

Most people dramatically over-estimate deer weights. I'm pretty sure they do it because "Jo" shot a buck that he SAID was 200 pounds and "Bob" shot one that was bigger, so Bob's deer must have been 250, when the truth is that neither of them ever saw a scale and "Jo's" deer was 125 and Bob's was 150.

Long story short, few places are going to have "smallish" deer in the 125-150 average live weight range. That would be average to high-average for NY and on the high side for most of American Whitetail deer.
 
Brian is 100% spot on as to deer weight. I've been saying this for years. I have to laugh when someone tells me they "shot a small doe, about 150 pounds" or "a small buck, about 150 pounds". I've seen a LOT of them go on the scales and they are grossly over estimated. Just like all the 140 class deer that get shot that are actually 90-120 gross score.
 
I have to agree with the weight estimates being wrong most of the time. I guess the farther you drag a deer, the heavier it gets. As to why there are real weight differences, that is up in the air. I hunt West Virginia every year and the weight of deer in the area we hunt makes no sense. Sometimes the DNR will check the weight/age of the first couple hundred at a check station. I took a spike down that weighed 140 dressed out and was 2 1/2 years old. I have taken 8 pointers that weighed 130+. Recently I got a 6 point that I picked up by the feet and set in my truck. I doubt it was over 80 pounds. My buddy shot a 4 point the year before that was the same way. We do still see heavy deer in the area. A genetic influence?
 
You are correct......No Guarantees. While calling the warden or local LEO and having them knock on the door instead of you, MAY get you your deer, in my state it is not a guarantee
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Here in Ohio, a shot but untagged deer still belongs to the state so LE can go on private property to retrieve it.

These are the kind of scenario's/laws hunters need to research in the state in which they hunt BEFORE they find themselves in the situation. Things are often very different from state to state.
 
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