Any solution to 1903 Springfield Early Serial Number?

Also, besides good eye protection, I would recommend only using ammo that duplicates what the rifle was made for. In other words, period correct military pressures. Or less.

I think modern commercial hunting ammo would be adding to the risk factors. RemchesterFederal 150gr SP isn't the same as USGI M2 ball. Why push it?
 
I want to continue to use it as a hunting and range rifle but want to know more about the risk of the 1903 year production rifles.

Best odds on risk that anyone will be able to give you is that it PROBABLY won't blow up and take out your eyes (but it might) the next time you pull the trigger.

Of course, you can say the same thing about playing Russian Roulette ....
 
I never worked on one for someone and never will. High or low number, why chance it. PO Ackley was mentioned here. If I remember correctly, he said the re-heat treated receivers did not withstand the blow up test any better than the single heat treated ones. I have not always agreed with slamfire, but I am 100% percent with him on this. Yes, I have re-heat treated parts and receivers of certain TYPES of material. I knew exactly what I was dealing with. I would not re-barrel a WWI era Mauser to anything really hot either just because of the variation in the testing of heat treated materials.
There was a '03 "PARTS" gun on GunsAmerica last week. Maybe it is still there. It got that way pulling the trigger.
 
FWIW, "light" loads may not be the answer, either. Like other brittle material (e.g., glass), it is not the pressure but the quickness of an impact that results in breakage. One single heat treat rifle came apart with a load of 9 grains of Bullseye and a round ball.

Some folks claim that those rifles stopped blowing up c. 1940. They didn't, but after that no one was tracking them, and no one does today.

Jim
 
Inload pulled 147 gr bullets and low pressure powder load equaling about 1700 fps. I have shot this load for years in all of my 03/03a3 rifles, low and high number, it is a extremely low recoil but fun load to fire in these grand old rifles. I would never dewat a low number because of fear it would be fired again, and have no concerns about firing service ammo in any of mine contrary to other opinions.
 
I don't have a problem reviving old threads, or updating them with knowledge gained since they were last written.

These old receivers have their own risks. Let me attempt to categorize some of the known issues.

It must be understood that between the wars, Government Arsenals were just as underfunded as the rest of the military. The parsimony of Congress, combined with a “kick the can down the road” attitude of military leadership meant that the Arsenals went through boom and bust cycles, with the bust cycles lasting decades. During the lean years, equipment became outdated, Arsenals would always be behind technological advancements. This is due to decisions made by Army leadership, no one else. However, Hatcher misdirects the blame on to the forge shop workers. This is from Hatcher’s Notebook.

The men though that they could tell when a piece had the right heat by looking into the furnace. They were proud of their experience, skill, and ability, and believed that it took years of practice to become expert in judging the forging temperature. They were highly paid craftsmen, who were jealous of their exclusive skill, and who both hated and feared these new fangled pyrometers which threatened to make useless their special knowledge

Let me throw out a couple of questions: Who was running this factory? Were the forge shop workers in charge of Springfield Armory? Did they decide the budget allocations? Did they have the budget authority to buy capital production equipment? Did they decide the production flow and processes? Just who was in charge of Springfield Armory?

Well it turns out, it was the Army who was in charge of Springfield Armory. If the workers had outdated production equipment, if the Arsenal had an out of control production flow, if the factory was shipping defective material, this is not the fault of the Forge Shop workers, it is due to the lack of management oversight and production insight by the appointed Army Army representatives who were in charge of Springfield Armory.

Hatcher uses a class envy stereotype to prejudice the reader against the forge shop workers. In this era of endless prosperity it is hard to understand the job insecurity created by technological advancements. (Sarcasm intended) However job obsolescence through technological advancements has always been an issue to workers ever since the beginning of the industrial revolution. It is not an issue to management as their costs go down when they reduce the number of people it takes to produce a product. However, back then, just as today, workers were being laid off because some machine did their job better and at less cost. Workers were not being asked their opinion in the matter, in fact workers have never been asked their opinion in this matter, management just goes down the path which brings the lowest cost. Therefore the fears, opinions, attitudes of the forge shop workers are irrelevant and intentionally misleading. If Springfield Armory was producing defective product, it was the responsibility of Army Officers to provide the leadership to surface problems and fix them. I am of the opinion that what Army leadership was actually doing was playing Polo on the parade ground and between chukkers, drinking mint julips handed to them by their toadies and sycophants.

As for heat treatment, I have read Crossman, Sharpe, and others, and it is clear to me, all they know is heat treatment. They carp about heat treatment this and heat treatment that, but they are totally clueless as to the real problem in the Arsenals: lack of temperature instrumentation. Every time a metal part was exposed to heat there was no temperature gage to determine the temperature. Pyrometic cones go back to the 1780's, but there is no evidence that Springfield Armory was even using that simple temperature technology. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrometric_cone Instead, Springfield Armory was using medieval process controls: human eyeballs. There is a short article in my 1914 Machinery Handbook about the unreliability of human eyes in determining steel temperatures, but I guess no one within the Ordnance Department paid any attention to that issue. It was inevitable that steel parts were being made brittle because humans can't accurately judge steel temperatures with their eyeballs. At least not within the forging temperature limits of the steels they used.

Currently there is an interesting program on the history channel: Forged in Fire. Four knife/sword makers are given three hours to forge a knife blade from some blob of steel. It is worth watching this part, as even though the contestants are highly skilled, they forge by eyeball and there are a surprising number of burnt knife blanks created in the rush. The steel gets a little too hot, and the blade either breaks on the anvil, or there are visible cracks in the blade. I saw one episode where the tester refused to test one blade with multiple cracks as it was highly likely the blade would fail and the tester would be injured in the test. I have seen a number of episodes where knives that looked OK proved to be too brittle by losing big half moon chunks out of the edge during a chopping test, or the blade simply breaks. Of course the tape is moved in slow motion when a blade breaks and there is the sound effect of a something heavy falling. Quite entertaining, and instructive as it turns out, to this debate.

Production technology was moving so fast, that this Jan 1926 book review, from the Transactions of the American Society for Steel Treating, is germane to the issue of forging, and the process controls for forge temperatures.

Making Springs for Motor Vehicles

Canadian Machinery, 12 Nov 1925, page 15

The author of this paper discusses the benefits that have come to the manufacture of springs in the motor car industry from metallurgical research. Springs today stand four or five times the work of those a few year ago because the “skill” and “guessing” of the forger has been replaced by heat treating furnaces with temperatures maintained at the proper degree by pyrometers. The Dowsley Spring and Axle Co., Chatham, Ont., a subsidiary of the Ontario Products Co., is taken as an example of a thoroughly modern plant, and its work discussed. There are 145 men employed in the plant and production averages about 55 tons of springs a day, a single spring weighing anywhere from 17 to 44 pounds.

The plant is so arranged that material follows a straight path from storage to shipping room. Until a few years ago all springs were heat treated in small oil-fired furnaces. Today this method had been discarded. A continuous heat treating, forming, and quenching process has been evolved, which is practically automatic and eliminates the human element. As an example of what careful- heat treatment has done toward prolonging the life of springs, the results of test of springs made by the hand method and those by the continuous heat treatment method are interesting. Some years ago 40,000 deflections were about the average before failure, now 120,000 is a low figure.

(If anyone has the complete Canadian Machinery article I would be grateful to get an electronic copy)

So the first and foremost risk associated with low number receivers is a lack of material property consistency due to non existing temperature controls. A burnt billet of steel cannot be improved through heat treatment or any process. Burnt is burnt. Steels forged and heat treated as inconsistently as the low number Springfield’s are going to vary widely in hardness and structural integrity. As Hatcher says, in Hatcher’s Notebook page 222: In one of the experiments at Springfield Armory, 48 receivers were carefully re-heat treated, after which 16, or one-third, failed on high pressure test. Some people may consider a 33 1/3% failure rate acceptable, but I don't think so.

Another issue with these old receivers is the single heat treatment as practiced by Springfield Armory was just a heat and a quench, which is actually a very poor heat treatment. Even period books, my first edition Machinery’s Handbook shows they should have done a heat, quench, and temper, to relive stresses. As primitive the heat treatment of these early receivers, so was the process technology at the steel factories that produced the plain carbon steels used in these rifles. People without a historical understanding of technology just don’t know how little the people back then knew, and how primitive the process controls of the period. Primary instrumentation was often a human’s sense of sight, smell, taste, touch. The end result was that the steels of that period had a lot of slag and impurities. The exact same steel made today would be cleaner and have better material properties. And these same steels are being made today, and used as rebar, or rail road ties, applications that are not high stress and where ultra low cost is the most desired property.

The plain carbon steels used in the single heat treat and double heat treat receivers were technologically obsolescent in 1918. If you remember, the British used nickle steel in the P1914, and so did we in the P1917 rifle. In a few short years plain carbon steels were being replaced with alloy steels for a number of very good reasons. Metal technology advanced quickly in the first and second decade of the 20 century, and even more rapidly after 1920. Maybe steel technology moved as rapidly as did the transistor revolution from the 1960’s to the end of the millennium. I listened to vacuum tube radios and I remember the “6 transistor” radios of the early 1960’s. Dick Tracey had a mobile phone on his wrist, but he was a comic book character and I was listening to a crystal radio at the time.

Post WW1 it was painfully obvious that the use of plain carbon steels in safety critical or stressing environments was not technically justifiable. The American metallurgist Edgar Bain, http://www.nasonline.org/publications/biographical-memoirs/memoir-pdfs/bain-edgar-c.pdf in 1932 published conclusive experiments on carbons steels. Bain heat treated identical plain carbon steel coupons under identical conditions and examined the coupons afterwards for hardness depth. The black chemical etching, which I assume is the unhardened steel, show that plain carbon steels have erratic hardening depths, given that all else is equal. These steels were called in WW2 era text books as “shallow hardening”. This was meant not as praise but as a pejorative. As is shown on the right of the diagram, the hardness of these coupons varies by depth. This is not good as inconsistent hardening depths provide inconsistent material properties. It is undesirable to create parts some of which will be hard through and through but others soft below the surface even though the heating processes are the same for all parts. But use plain carbon steels, and you will create such inconsistent parts, just by the nature of the material.






Therefore, you would expect even properly forged, properly heat treated single heat treat and double heat treat receivers to vary considerable in hardness depth, which then affects the properties of the end part.
Yield is an extremely important material property, for above yield, the part deforms. Once a steel part yields it is no longer safe to use. What happens after yield is unpredictable, often it takes less load to cause more deformation, ultimate load is the load it takes to break the part. In this early 1920’s chart, for the same essential heat treatment, the nickel alloy steel always has a higher yield, a significantly higher yield in all cases, than the plain carbon steel. I am of the opinion that the 3.5% nickle steel in this chart is 2340, which is the nickle steel used in the nickle steel 03's.

Nickel steel versus plain carbon steel




What is not shown in these charts is a material property called toughness. For a device, such as a receiver, which is going to be subjected to impact loading, toughness is a highly desirable property. Toughness is directly related to fatigue lifetime, which is the number of loading cycles to failure. Assuming the yield is sufficient for the load, the tougher material will have a longer service life. Alloy steels have a greater toughness than plain carbon steels. Alloy steels take more energy to shear, Charpy impact tests are a direct predictor of a steel’s fatigue lifetime. It is a revelation to see just how shear energy decreases with temperature, and at low temperature, alloy steels take several times the energy to shear as do plain carbon steels.

Therefore, old single heat treat receivers are a very significant unknown quantity. We know they were made in a factory that did not have temperature controls, we know that the material varies considerably in properties after heat treatment, and that the service life of the part will always be less to one made out of a good alloy steel. Just how many service lives have these old receivers been though? How many more load cycles will they take before failure? How will they react in an overpressure situation?

Therefore, regardless of the hoopla around double heat treat receivers, or “old world craftsmanship” these old plain carbon steels are inferior in all aspects to alloy steels. As a class, low number receivers have a number of identified risks. The process control technology they were made under produced a number of structurally deficient parts, and a number of people were severely injured when their rifles blew up. The steels of the era were inconsistent in composition and inherently inconsistent in final properties after heat treatment. Also, these steels were rather primitive, by WW2, called low grade, due to their lack of strength and ductility. All of these receivers have been around a long time. Some have been through a number of service lives, at some point they will fail through structural fatigue, just when, I don’t know.

However assessing risk on a large population is a lot easier than assessing risk on an individual receiver. I am not going to say, sight unseen, and untested, that any low number receiver is safe or defective. I can’t. But I can say, as a population, there is a lot of risk in the group.

A simple test of a low number receiver, to determine brittleness, is to do what the Marine Corp did. Take the action out of the stock, take the bolt out, and hit it sharply with a heavy steel hammer a number of times. Make it ring, make it ring loudly. Whack it on the receiver ring, the right rail, and the rear bridge. If it shatters, you had a defective low number receiver, and you saved yourself from potential injury.

This low number came cracked from the CMP



I don't remember why this low number came apart.





 
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I thought I would add these pictures. The owner of these CMP low number receiver decided to sharply whack his receivers to see what would happen.

They broke.











 
When this comes up I recommend doing the following experiment:

Take a large caliber revolver.
Load a full power cartridge into a chamber, spin the cylinder, close it and cock the hammer.
Put the muzzle against the side of your head and pull the trigger.

Now take an early number 1903 Springfield.
Load a 30-06 cartridge into the chamber and close the bolt.
(The 30-06 was the most powerful service rifle cartridge ever used).
Put the rifle to your shoulder and lay your face on the stock RIGHT behind the receiver and pull the trigger.

Note how similar the two experiments are?

If you just insist on tempting fate, please follow these steps:

1. Make sure your medical insurance is paid up to date.
2. Were GOOD eye protection.
3. Make sure 9-1-1 is on speed dial.
4. Be a gentleman. Make sure no innocent bystanders are anywhere near.
 
Springfield armory produced numerous models of rifles before 1903. Did they use a brand new technique or process in 1903? The methodologies they used for those older models could not possibly be more advanced. But why only 1903 blew up, but not the older models?

Perhaps 1903 was the first to shoot the potent 30-06 cartridge. But it didn't matter, does it? Light loads may not be any safer when it comes to brittleness, some say.

I read even the later double heat treated 03s were still blowing up. It is confusing.

I have one low number, and I have decided to keep shooting it, after for a while being scared silly by what I had read on the internet. Thousand of rounds have gone through this rifle. The barrel has been replaced at least once. After I bought it, I have shot hundreds of rounds, military surplus cartridges included. Now I will only shoot light loads with cast bullets. Mainly because I don't want stress it any more.

Oh, I won't allow any body but myself to shoot it, and I shoot it when I am alone in the range. Just in case.

-TL
 
"Well it turns out, it was the Army who was in charge of Springfield Armory. If the workers had outdated production equipment, if the Arsenal had an out of control production flow, if the factory was shipping defective material, this is not the fault of the Forge Shop workers, it is due to the lack of management oversight and production insight by the appointed Army Army representatives who were in charge of Springfield Armory."

Actually, who commands the Army? The PRESIDENT, that's right, the Commander in Chief! He was responsbile for this, and yet he skated by untouched! Cronyism!


Pyrometers were in place at Springifield in the forging houses. In many cases the "master craftsmen whose -CENSORED--CENSORED--CENSORED--CENSORED- stinketh not in all of their experienced glory" simply refused to use them.


The last failure of a low-number Springfield I know about happened sometime in the 1950s.
 
Slamfire-some more information please.

I’ve actually read Hatcher’s notebook and was tremendously impressed with all the information there. His description of heat treating in chapter 9 went something like this:

After machining was finished the receivers were heated in bone, four in a pot to 1500 degrees and kept at this temperature for four hours.
What does he mean when he says ‘heated in bone’?

He goes on to say:
The receivers were packed in charred leather in pots. Heat to 1475 and hold this temperature for four hours. Quench in oil. This made the receivers fairly hard all the way through. The surface, into which the carbon from the charred leather had penetrated were harder than the interior so that the piece was actually case hardened.

This might amuse you:
Even in 1900 I always imaged that there would be engineers in white lab coats checking out the receivers in their laboratories.

One of them might think more carbon was needed in the process and then I envisioned the line workers going down to the materials department and with a request for ‘carbon’ and upon receiving it would somehow incorporate it into the receivers they were making.

Guess it didn’t work that way.

Anyway in addition to ‘heated in bone’ could you explain the ‘heated in charred leather pots’? Do they still do this?

And in no way shape or form am I denigrating the work done at Springfield Arsenal in the early 1900’s. They had a heck of a job to do and I’m sure they did it to the best of their abilities and they don’t deserve to have me second guessing the work they did a hundred years later. I’m just interested in a further explanation of their process.
 
"What does he mean when he says ‘heated in bone’?"

Carburized (burned) bone dust.

The bone is ground, heated to drive off organics, and then packed around the part item to be "soaked."

The carbon from the bone moves into the top layer of steel, imparting what is essentially case hardening.

Heating in carburized bone or leather scraps has been common for hundreds of years.

This wikipedia article has some good information on different methods of carburizing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carburizing

Around the time the Springfield was developed, other processes using chemicals such as sodium cyanide, various carbonates, and one process that flooded the chamber continuously with either carbon monoxide or carbon dioxide gas.

IIRC, the gas method was first developed in Germany and used extensively in production of armor plate for their naval ships, while the Americans and British used the British-developed Harvey process.
 
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The other term for "low number" or "single heat treat" is "case hardened", which is what you get by heating in bone and or charred leather and quenching.

That is the same process as was used to manufacture the Krag Jorgensen .30 Army. We don't hear of these blowing up. Is it because the chamber pressure of the .30-40 is lower? Or is it because they are built for the superior rimmed cartridge? Even so, we don't see pictures of them broken from being dropped.
 
"Is it because the chamber pressure of the .30-40 is lower?"

Oh no, not at all, at least not in the earliest iterations of the cartridge. Smokeless powder was new, and not well understood, and pressure testing methods suitable for use with smokeless were also new and not well understood.

The result was early ammo that is estimated to match, or even exceed, the chamber pressures of later .30-06 production ammunition.

The arsenals did eventually get everything sorted out and lowered down to levels that would safely work in the Krag action long term.



My guess on why the Krags aren't know for deconstructing, and I repeat, this is just a GUESS, is also related to smokeless powder...

Because of smokeless' greater power, the military (and civilian companies, too) were having to totally revamp their manufacturing techniques and also the raw and finished materials they used.

I'm guessing that in the early days of Krag production everything was done by the book, inspected 6 ways from Sunday, and done by the book again.

I'm also guessing that many of the men who did everything by the book when making Krags were the same men who were employed at the arsenals when the 1903 came online.

By that time some of them had almost 20 years working with the new materials and processes needed to produce quality firearms.

And, by God, they were experienced men, so they KNEW, they KNEW what they were doing and they didn't have to resort to any of that fiddly silly thermometer reading BS. "I'VE GOT EYES! I KNOW WHAT I'M LOOKING AT! I CAN TELL, BECAUSE I KNOW."

Anyway, that's my guess. Personal and professional hubris.
 
Why?
The rimmed cartridge seats all the way into the chamber. Extractor notches can be narrow and shallow. Case support is much better than the headless cartridge commonly chambered with its hind end hanging out in the air.

The only reason to omit the rim from rifle cartridges was to support the Mauser staggered box magazine. I don't understand why the Germans went rimless in the 1888, the Mannlicher clip was used for all manner of rimmed rounds in other armies.
 
Thinking the old folks should have known all we know now is not limited to guns. One writer, learning that the steel in the Titanic was not up to modern standards, wrote a whole book about a supposed conspiracy theory in which White Star ordered the captain to ram his ship into an iceberg and sink it to cover up the defects. (He is not quite clear how Ismay, the villain, got the iceberg to keep the appointment - e-mail maybe?)

Jim
 
"The only reason to omit the rim from rifle cartridges was to support the Mauser staggered box magazine."

Uhm... no.

It was to allow for fewer potential feeding issues through all magazine types, including the Mannlicher-style, not just the Mauser staggered box. The fact that both rimmed and rimless cartridges have been very effectively used in staggered magazines, from the Mauser to the Lee Enfield to the Winchester Model 70 indicates that proper design and attention to charging largely mitigates issues with rimlock and the like.

It also allowed a far more compact, convenient and handy shape to the magazine body, especially in automatic weapons, where the combination rim and body taper could result in a highly curved magazine, such as the half-moon magazine found on the 8mm Lebel-chambered Chauchat machine rifle, or the banana shaped magazine found on the Bren gun.

The greater case head support of SOME, but certainly not all, firearms chambered for rimmed cartridges was never truly an issue that made the rimmed cartridge superior. Depending on overall design, it was possible to get a much head support with a rimless cartridge as with a rimmed one, and case head failures, even from the early days of drawn-brass cartridges, have been distinctly uncommon, and became even more so as the technology progressed.

A rimmed cartridge also consumed more case material than a rimless round of comparable size.

Not really that big of an issue, until you get into a war requiring billons of rounds a year and start having to deal with material shortages such as those faced by the United States in 1942 through 1944.

A rimmed rifle round really has few, if any, true advantages over a rimless round, but has some distinct disadvantages (potential and functional).

The opposite is true, though, when talking about rimmed pistol rounds for use in semi-automatics.
 
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