Any one using Titegroup with 44 magnum?

You don't use magnum primers unless you need them over standard primers. One can make do, but it won't be the right primer.
 
But in this case, a magnum primer may be appropriate. I say this because of all the irregularity mentioned by Road Clam. As former CCI employee Alan Jones points out, a magnum primer can improve ignition consistency when you have a lot of empty space in a case, and that is what this kind of load has. It's not that the powder won't light with a standard primer but rather that it needs a bit more starting pressure from the primer to do it with the same timing every shot. I know Tightgroup is supposed to be position-insensitive, but this is relative to other powders. If you put a pinch of it in a 45-160 case you are not reasonably going to get the exact same performance with it back over the flash hole that you will get with it up at the bullet base. You won't see the variation in Hodgdon's load data because the ballistic tech performs "the SAAMI twist" manipulation of the case to get the powder over the primer every time. That makes for the worst case highest pressure, which is why it is done.

In the 44 Magnum, you can see the effect for yourself if you shoot at a range that allows loaded guns to be pointed into the air. Mine does not, owing to another nearby range that had some rounds go over its berm and strike a silo a farmer was standing near. But if yours does allow it, it's a great way to test your load for powder position sensitivity. Tilt the gun up, then level it slowly to fire over your chronograph for every shot and see what the mean velocity and SD are. Then repeat, but tilting the muzzle down and slowly bringing it up to level with every shot.
 
Concerning leading ... no I did not see any significant leading while testing TiteGroup using 240g SWC bullets from Rimrock.
I didn't check for position sensitivity because with a CCI-300 primer I was getting 18 to 35 ES over the loads I tested (15 shots per load)... which I feel is pretty good. Higher the load the lower the ES.
 
I know Tightgroup is supposed to be position-insensitive, but this is relative to other powders.
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That's right.

I've done this test myself (using the method just as Unclenick describes) and there is some position sensitivity with TiteGroup. I'll spare the details as it is outside the scope of this thread. And I am not trying to dispute Hodgdon's claims. I'm just saying that it does have some position sensitivity.

. . . And now back you your regularly scheduled programming :p . . .
 
I have done informal testing also. I will definitely argue that is isn't outside the scope of this thread -- if he wants to make .44 with Titegroup, he's going to have a football field and a half of extra, open space inside the cartridge case and your experiences there are definitely relevant.

I can say that while it likely does react a bit differently depending on a test the way that Unclenick describes... it's far better than most other powders that don't take up much space... at least in my experience.
 
In my experience with Titegroup it burns too hot for lead bullets and there are better powders for just about every application including this one. If your looking for a great plinking load for the 44 magnum, look no further than a 240 SWC with 7.3 grains of TrailBoss and whatever primer you want.

If your set on using the Titegroup, avoid lead bullets and stick with the plated ones but I really find the Lead SWC the best for this application.

Take your time and be careful with those charges and you will be fine.
 
I'd say that it depends on the bullets and it depends on the load. I'm using cast LSWC by Falcon Bullet, 240gr and lead with no gas check. At a consistent chronograph'd 870 fps from my 7.5" barreled Redhawk, I get no leading. None. None as in, I keep waiting for the other shoe to fall, after some 700 rounds of this load and I still haven't dealt with lead in this particular revolver. (the only .44 I currently own)

Yes, I'll agree 100% that Titegroup and it's high nitro content make this stuff run -HOT-, so hot to the touch that I suspended all use of this powder in .38 Special because it makes my K-frame cylinders too hot to handle and I don't like the burning sensation in the palm of my hand when ejecting empties.
 
Hmm... I use TG and 44 magnum all the time....For magnum loads. It works fine for me and I have loaded and shot a couple thousand of them.
 
I have to disagree on the 'avoid lead'. As said above, I experienced no leading during my tests with this powder. Also, in one of my .44 Mags I shot some 2400 powered, standard 240g SWC loads up to 1333fps with no significant leading. Leading of course is whole subject in it self and how to prevent it.

I use TG and 44 magnum all the time....For magnum loads
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You can't get to magnum velocities with Titegroup. To fast a burning powder. At least what I consider magnum velocities. With 10g (max in my manual) under 240g SWC, you might push 1200fps depending on barrel length. The Lyman cast bullets manual says ~1115fps I think for 39.3K CUP. 1200fps is on the very bottom edge of true .44 'magnum loads' in my mind. You have to use H110/296 or 2400 (or other slow powders in this class) to get 'real' magnum velocities. That said, nothing wrong with using Titegroup in the .44Mag, just like nothing wrong using Unique (my choice), or Red Dot, or Trail Boss... depending on the purpose at hand. You just can't expect magnum velocities with your choice!
 
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IMO leading is a function of the gun + bullet, not the powder. A slight variance in bore diameter will result in no leading at all or terrible leading, depending on the gun. A hot powder or cold powder wont influence it in my experience. I use J&M powder coated bullets from MBC rather than pure lead, and many other outfits sell coated lead, and that can really help in sensitive barrels.

I have fired bare lead rarely and I prefer to avoid it because bullet lube and powder temperature are poorly understood. Hi-tek coating is well understood, and reliable to 1,800 FPS.

I happen to have some CCI magnum primers and Titegroup powder, as well as FMJ, Plated, and coated lead bullets. I'm going to do some tests at the range with all these components and post back for y'all so we can get some field data (as far as you can trust me, anyways). My interest is piqued by this thread...
 
IMO leading is a function of the gun + bullet, not the powder.
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I was having trouble with leading when getting into heavy load range with Unique. That was much improved when going to IMR4227. I concluded that the pressure peak from too fast a powder in too strong a load with a heavy bullet was distorting the bullet. I had the same problem with a coated bullet from MO only there I had the impression that I was cleaning coating from the barrel as much as lead.
 
As mrdaputer mentioned in the original post, he has a lot of Titegroup. Therefore, he needs to use that and be happy with it. Not a hard thing to do, either, as it makes for excellent accuracy in lighter practice/target loads. Of course, there are better powders he should use for full power loads. Nevertheless, having a lot of Titegroup is a fun problem to deal with. I suggest 5 or 6 grains of powder and shoot all day for many, many days.
 
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Get a copy of Lee's Modern Reloading second edition. He covers how to measure the hardness and how much you need for a given peak pressure.
 
I'd say that it depends on the bullets and it depends on the load. I'm using cast LSWC by Falcon Bullet, 240gr and lead with no gas check. At a consistent chronograph'd 870 fps from my 7.5" barreled Redhawk, I get no leading. None. None as in, I keep waiting for the other shoe to fall, after some 700 rounds of this load and I still haven't dealt with lead in this particular revolver. (the only .44 I currently own)
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IME with TiteGroup I have noticed, especially in my 357 MAG but the 44 as well early on, that the Titegroup loads produce a vaporized blast of lead which follows the bullet out of the barrel. There is no "leading" of the barrel itself, but I do not like this dust and I have only had this happen with TiteGroup.

Maybe I just had a few bad combo's but with the TrailBoss there is no issue at all.

YMMV.
 
That's gas cutting of the lead. It comes from the pressure peaking so fast the bullet hasn't got clear of the case before it happens, so as soon as the case mouth expands, a high-pressure gas jet starts blasting the edges of the bullet base away as it finds its way around the bullet to the barrel and barrel/cylinder gap. It helps to size your bullet to the diameter of the throat so the bypass path is eliminated, but you'll still have some when the bullet base clears the cylinder face, though pressure will already be dropping by then. Gas checks stop it completely but add cost that many find unacceptable.
 
As it turns out it was Bullseye powder not Tightgroup. The powders are close. It was a 8lb container in a Tightgroup box. Anyway I loaded up 7 rounds with 6 grains of bullseye and took them to the range. I wanted to just make sure they cycled ok. They all worked well, I noticed there was very little recoil. I seated and crimp in one operation. I did the bullet push to make sure there was no movement. Next i will make up 10 rounds at 6 grains and stepladder it up to 7 grains. I will bring my chronograph and caliper to check speed and bullet jump. I might buy a separate seating and crimp die just in case i have problems.

Again you guys have been very helpful
 
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