Any modern snub revolvers that aren't a bad idea to even try wit CAR point shooting?

G

Gunnut17

Moderator
For a defensive situation, I'm told a reliable revolver is a safer bet than a modern semi auto if I get too stressed and short stroke the action by limp wristing, but double taps are a bad idea if you get scared and pull twice, with a guy not wanting to see if it's a hangfire.

That being said, CAR is also good for clearing a home where there are wide corners to pie safely. Weaver made to be more like isosceles. Look up Center Axis Relock if you can't figure what it looks like.

The haters of one of the major grip types will find the idea of using a revolver to be bad given the way CAR is used normally.

But by avoiding the gas run off from the cylinder with a modified weaver grip canted slightly, what is to make it a terrible idea to find a gas-seal revolver with a non milsurp ammo required?

Obviously a weaver grip is safest if I'm just using a high kicking revolver. (I think, a .45 hurt me with the beavertail the first time I shot one, even if I liked the shooting, but I've never used a .45 Colt, just ACP.) But if I wanted to make sure the gun was retained in a struggle, would using CAR low ready until shooting be a bad idea, or would just using a reliable Semi-auto in a low but jumpy caliber like .357 SIG or .40 be a safer bet than risking the gun not cycling properly?
 
For a defensive situation, I'm told a reliable revolver is a safer bet than a modern semi auto if I get too stressed and short stroke the action by limp wristing, but double taps are a bad idea if you get scared and pull twice, with a guy not wanting to see if it's a hangfire.
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You're overthinking it. IMHO & YMMV.
 
As Lee stated you are making this WAY to hard. Use whatever handgun you feel best and shoot the best with. Then practice with that handgun. If it ever gets real you will run on reflex and your past training will kick in.

As I'm a died in the wool revolver guy, I use one of several Smith and Wesson Model 19'S loaded with HOT 38 special ammo.
 
For a defensive situation, I'm told a reliable revolver is a safer bet than a modern semi auto if I get too stressed and short stroke the action by limp wristing, but double taps are a bad idea if you get scared and pull twice, with a guy not wanting to see if it's a hangfire.
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You were told wrong. Not that a good revolver doesn't make an excellent choice though because they do. It's just that a modern semiauto can be just as reliable and offers double to triple the capacity. Don't worry about limp wristing, that's a problem easily worked out through training and if you don't train then you'll have a problem no matter what you carry.
 
CAR wasn't really developed with wheelguns in mind. You can experiment with it and it can work but needs some modifications for revolvers.

One issue will be muzzle flash, hot gases and debris from the b/c gap from any position close to the eyes and face. This will be a factor in darkness as well especially inches from the face.

The other will be the damage to clothing while practicing from positions where the gun is held close to the body. Fast draw competitors often have reinforced panels sewn into their clothing to protect the body from the gases and debris escaping from b/c gap during extended sessions.

You can modify things a bit, or adapt things to revolvers though. It can be made to work.

tipoc
 
Excuse my ignorance but what the hell is CAR? I know it can't be the thing that gets me to work in the morning.:confused:
 
Center Axis Relock (CAR) System developed by Paul Castle some years back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBBt0d_umXg

One of a number of "systems" or methods developed by trainers as gunfighting techniques for whoever needs them. Elements of some of these are useful for law enforcement or the military, sometimes, sometimes just gimmicky.

This one has some useful elements IMHO. Also it's limits.

tipoc
 
It was answered.

He's worried about a number of things (too much time on the internet) and needs to slow down and begin to shoot. Avoid the esoteric and get some basic training if he really wants to move forward.

tipoc
 
Not a problem

I had the honor and pleasure of training CAR with the late Paul Castle, and did numerous evolutions with an S&W 342 snubbie. Although that wasn't my primary training weapon (H&K P7 and GLOCK 19), when I told Paul that I typically pocket carry the snubbie he made me run the drills with it, too.

The only caution I have is that shooting from the "high" position may scorch your shirt. Remember though, the CAR shines as a CQB technique with weapon ALREADY in hand ("looking for work"). It does not address the draw. For this reason, if your snubbie is holstered or in pocket carry (as opposed to in-hand in the CAR Interview Stance - HIGH position), there will be faster ways to get off first shots.
 
I watched the linked video, and for me, the words of Artie Johnson from Laugh In apply...

(peering though a plant, smoking a cigarette, wearing a German helmet..)

"Very interesting, ...but Schtupid!"

Ok, I'm not a gunfighter, don't want to be, and am not going to train to be..so for me, the system is... not well suited.

Tilting the gun half sideways, using the opposite hand and eye for opposite side shots, not for me, thanks.

Also looks like if I were to shoot a magnum that way, it would smack me in the face!

Also a little curious about his math, how does closing one eye rob you of 60% of your vision? 50%, I could understand...

Not for me, thanks, I'm too old to be changing now, thanks.
 
Would it be just too nasty to wonder if, while you are thinking and worrying about stance and grip and sight picture, etc.,etc., the BG is shooting your precious bod full of holes? Not, I would think, a positive outcome.

Jim
 
A. Pick any defensive shooting school, attend, learn, practice and repeat. Gunsite, thunder ranch, frontsite and a host of smaller local opportunities.

B. Many, many semi-autos are if not immune to limp wristing are close to it, many an instructor have shot them with 2 finger grip to prove this point.

C. Double taps are something of a keyboard commando concept --- being able to quickly deliver, accurate fire is the goal of any defensive shooter --- maybe that is 2 maybe that is 4, 8 or 10. Most training focuses on shoot till the threat is neutralized. No one factors a hangfire into this for in a defensive situation you sure as heck will not want to, or even have the presence of mind to do so even if for some bizarre reason you wanted to. Hangfire with modern ammo quality ammo is very, very rare. You are correct on static range practice one is warned of the possibility, however this consideration goes out the window with defensive training, otherwise everyone in defensive training would be counting to 15 before their immediate action drills.

D. Why are you worried about clearing a home? A gun is a defensive tool for saving your life, house clearing is in 99.9% of the time best left to the pros -- they are better trained and have better lawyers for what follows the use of deadly force. Again some very basic defensive training will help with a real world grounding of what is likely, what is not and how to address these issues.

E. None of the best and most reliable revolver designs are gas seal. No gas seal revolver is going to take modern defensive ammo. This is like looking for a diesel racing motorcycle.

F. Nothing will make sure the gun is retained in a struggle. Hope it does not get there, practice your defensive tactics and shoot no shoot to help make sure and then practice hands on defense and weapons retention to hopefully come out on top if it does. It sounds like you are looking for certainty in a world where there is none -- study the costs and benefits, practice and make informed choices for yourself.

G. Not sure what you mean by a high kicking revolver or low but jumpy caliper--- if you are using a revolver that kicks that high it might be too much gun as being in control and able to effect follow up shots is way more important than having X caliber gun at your disposal. Yes 40 / 357 sig are snappy but fine for many folks --- 9 and 45 are fine too, your biggest challenge will be to deliver the ordinace where it needs to go, reliably, under stress from various positions, once there the difference in caliber is very small so again, it goes back to training, trigger time and weapon selection and then more training.
 
Nothing will make sure the gun is retained in a struggle.
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This is most certainly true. There is a valid reason so many of the old military pistols were worn with a lanyard.

A lanyard won't keep the gun in your hands, (or in a holster) but it does give you something to yank it back with!

REAL men may have spurned the use of the saber knot as beneath them, but smart men did not, and often lived much, much longer...
;)
 
http://www.thefullwiki.org/Center_Axis_Relock
CAR is a radical approach to weapons handling which will benefit the patrol officer as well as the soldier and SWAT operator. CAR is a step in the evolution of weapons handling; a change away from a range mindset towards a tactical one. The mechanics are solid, the movements simple and easily learned, and the advantages worth a close look. CAR is versatile, undeniably fast, and here to stay.
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It's also a great way to make money if you can convince the Tacti-cool Ninja's they will look cool while doing it.

For the overwhelming majority, it's a solution to a non-existent problem.
 
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