Any makarov love out there
- Thread starter libiglou
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My CZ 82 - one of those Cold War surplus surprises.
Great DA/SA trigger; 12+1 capacity; uber-reliable. Couple of thousand rounds now, and not one failure to feed, fire, extract, or eject.
It's also proven to be very accurate with just about any 9mmMak fodder, surplus or commercial. I'm convinced most of that is due to the fixed barrel, complimented by the superb trigger, especially in SA mode.
I used to have a beautiful, pristine E.G. Mak, just as part of the collection, but sold it recently to help finance something else. Made decent money on it too, but I don't miss it.
Between the Mak and the CZ 82, I'd choose the latter pistol every time.
Great DA/SA trigger; 12+1 capacity; uber-reliable. Couple of thousand rounds now, and not one failure to feed, fire, extract, or eject.
It's also proven to be very accurate with just about any 9mmMak fodder, surplus or commercial. I'm convinced most of that is due to the fixed barrel, complimented by the superb trigger, especially in SA mode.
I used to have a beautiful, pristine E.G. Mak, just as part of the collection, but sold it recently to help finance something else. Made decent money on it too, but I don't miss it.
Between the Mak and the CZ 82, I'd choose the latter pistol every time.
The CZ82 has better sights than either a military or commercial Mak but has for me a bit of trigger slap. Not sure why this is so. The disconnect, I think, has something to do with it.
BUT, back in the day, I bought a "BEAST" slide for the Mak from Makarov.Com. Named after a guy named Jeff Beast (I know, sounds weird
) It has a high vis Heine front sight and a Novak 3 dot rear on a Bulgarian slide. At least I think it's a Bulgarian slide as it is unmarked and was matte finished. These are, IMO, better sights than the CZ82s.
I carried that pistol today in an Azula OWB pancake holster.
I can shoot the Mak a bit better, even the ones with the military sights, and it fits my hand better. Both are excellent shooters. It's all subjective.
Parts for the Mak were many and easily available at one time and are still easier to come by than the 82.
Due to the slimmer grip, the Mak is easier to conceal and this goes for magazines. 9 rounds vs 13 is not a big concern for me given the smaller sized grip frame....I like the stock military grips on either the EGs or Bulgarians.
IMO, the Makarov is a lot simpler and much easier to completely disassemble than the 82. The 82 I messed with was a complete b..ch to reassemble.
The time is past, but I have a considerable number of Mak magazines, grips, holsters, parts, lanyards, etc., etc. My favorite holster, IF i bring a Mak fishing or camping is the cloth EG rain pattern flap holster with extra mag pouch but I have leather holsters from all except Chinese, including the Russian with the strap to assist drawing the pistol and cleaning rod loops.
BUT, back in the day, I bought a "BEAST" slide for the Mak from Makarov.Com. Named after a guy named Jeff Beast (I know, sounds weird
) It has a high vis Heine front sight and a Novak 3 dot rear on a Bulgarian slide. At least I think it's a Bulgarian slide as it is unmarked and was matte finished. These are, IMO, better sights than the CZ82s.I carried that pistol today in an Azula OWB pancake holster.
I can shoot the Mak a bit better, even the ones with the military sights, and it fits my hand better. Both are excellent shooters. It's all subjective.
Parts for the Mak were many and easily available at one time and are still easier to come by than the 82.
Due to the slimmer grip, the Mak is easier to conceal and this goes for magazines. 9 rounds vs 13 is not a big concern for me given the smaller sized grip frame....I like the stock military grips on either the EGs or Bulgarians.
IMO, the Makarov is a lot simpler and much easier to completely disassemble than the 82. The 82 I messed with was a complete b..ch to reassemble.
The time is past, but I have a considerable number of Mak magazines, grips, holsters, parts, lanyards, etc., etc. My favorite holster, IF i bring a Mak fishing or camping is the cloth EG rain pattern flap holster with extra mag pouch but I have leather holsters from all except Chinese, including the Russian with the strap to assist drawing the pistol and cleaning rod loops.
lee n. field
New member
The CZ82 has better sights than either a military or commercial Mak but has for me a bit of trigger slap. Not sure why this is so. The disconnect, I think, has something to do with it.
BUT, back in the day, I bought a "BEAST" slide for the Mak from Makarov.Com. Named after a guy named Jeff Beast (I know, sounds weird
That was actually Geoff Beneze.
I think that's right.
Didn't ol' Geoff end up getting chased around by a lot of his customers? Supposedly for taking in their Maks for slide and Novak sight work, then holding on to the guns and never doing the work, or botching it.
Seems I recall a long thread over on THR many years ago where folks ranted about their dealings with the guy. Thing I recall was most posters complained about how long it took to get Beneze to return their Maks, whether the work was done, half-done, or not done at all.
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Guys thanks for the replies. I really like the cz82 but I'm limited to a 10 rnd mag in my goofy state and I dont see 10 rounders anywhere. The Bulgis are everywhere and probably will go that route. I'm shooting for a labor day purchase or if that dosent work out xmas. I'm debating seeing what some of my local LGS have in stock or just order one from classic. I really would like to see what I'm buying however I have bought a few things from classic and was never disappointed. Not sure if I'm going to reload this round at least in the beginning. Excited about this one . alright I'm excited with every new purchase.
Model12Win
Moderator
I wish you luck, but waiting often doesn't work out well in the world of surplus firearms.
lee n.field...Thanks,thought it was Beast, that was a while ago, but I think the slide was called a "Beast" slide, I could be wrong.
agtman, I ordered that slide for around 90 bucks and they sent me an IJ70 SLIDE WITH THE SMALL ADJUSTABLE REAR SIGHT!!....whether they were trying to pull a fast one on me I don't know....I sent it back and they sent me the correct slide with a brass colored blotch on the side that I couldn't remove with solvents etc. so I had to send it back and finally got the right one...
I don't know if I was dealing with Beneze but it was done through Makarov.com. They still have a web sight, I think, but I don't think they sell anything anymore.
I remember I also bought some SKS stripper clips from them and they were almost all rusty beyond being functional. But those were the Halcyon days of the Makarov when I think Mak mags were around $5.00. Now I see them for sometimes 10 times that...you know what I mean.
I also had a C&R license and can remember when SOG and AIM too, I think, had EG Maks on close out sale for $99.99. I bought a hand picked EG for around $130.00 shipped. So when I talk about the PM Makarov it's in the context of those good old days and it's difficult to explain that to someone when talking about Maks nowadays and their desirability, etc., today
agtman, I ordered that slide for around 90 bucks and they sent me an IJ70 SLIDE WITH THE SMALL ADJUSTABLE REAR SIGHT!!....whether they were trying to pull a fast one on me I don't know....I sent it back and they sent me the correct slide with a brass colored blotch on the side that I couldn't remove with solvents etc. so I had to send it back and finally got the right one...
I don't know if I was dealing with Beneze but it was done through Makarov.com. They still have a web sight, I think, but I don't think they sell anything anymore.
I remember I also bought some SKS stripper clips from them and they were almost all rusty beyond being functional. But those were the Halcyon days of the Makarov when I think Mak mags were around $5.00. Now I see them for sometimes 10 times that...you know what I mean.
I also had a C&R license and can remember when SOG and AIM too, I think, had EG Maks on close out sale for $99.99. I bought a hand picked EG for around $130.00 shipped. So when I talk about the PM Makarov it's in the context of those good old days and it's difficult to explain that to someone when talking about Maks nowadays and their desirability, etc., today
lee n. field
New member
I think that's right.
Didn't ol' Geoff end up getting chased around by a lot of his customers? Supposedly for taking in their Maks for slide and Novak sight work, then holding on to the guns and never doing the work, or botching it.
Seems I recall a long thread over on the THR many years ago where folks ranted about their dealings with the guy. Thing I recall was most posters complained about how long it took to get Beneze to return their Maks, whether the work was done, half-done, or not done at all.
My recollection is he ran into some health problems that forced him to give up gunsmithing.
lee n. field
New member
That was the name of the slide, made by Mr. Beneze.
There's a nice picture of one at Stephen Camp's website.
Makarov.com is back up. Yay! Karl Bloss (the original proprietor, later with a partner) moved overseas for a few years, and the website registration lapsed and it disappeared. My recollection from elsewhere is that they had to dig a bit for the website files.
And, BTW, Gun Parts Warehouse has some of the stuff that makarov.com used to sell.
I myself have a barrel press and .380 barrel (which does me no good, as my only remaining Mak is a Russian commercial .380), and one of the fixed rear sights Makarov.com designed to replace the Russian adjustable.
Those were the days. They're priced right now, right where a lot of other things are, and aren't nearly the deal.
Recoil spring
New member
My first was a Baikal Russian model bought in 1993. The finish was a bit rough, but reliable gun. Sold it and bought a much better Bulgarian new in the box in 1997, yes, the gun does have a kick to it, but not terrible. Got tired of the heavy steel of a smaller gun and sold it 3 years ago, 2 of the 3 gun shops I brought it to did not want to buy it, ammo was hard to get back then.
Before selling it I had a box of ammo left and blew it all off at the range, ironically, Maks have never jammed on me before, but that last box of ammo had some jamming issues, not sure why that was happening, have only used FMJ ammo in the past. It was not the easiest gun to field strip either, taking it apart was easy, but had to fight with the slide to get it to sit right to reassemble, at least with the Bulgarian.
Accuracy was fair. With the all steel you could have used it as a club if necessary.
Before selling it I had a box of ammo left and blew it all off at the range, ironically, Maks have never jammed on me before, but that last box of ammo had some jamming issues, not sure why that was happening, have only used FMJ ammo in the past. It was not the easiest gun to field strip either, taking it apart was easy, but had to fight with the slide to get it to sit right to reassemble, at least with the Bulgarian.
Accuracy was fair. With the all steel you could have used it as a club if necessary.
HisSoldier
New member
I have a Russian Mak in .380, chromed or possibly nickle. The gun is nice as an example of Russian design, the pins in the sear and hammer are molded into the sear and hammer themselves, so that they cannot be lost.
It's the only gun I've ever seen in which the built in "pins" are shaped so that they will pull away from their respective holes when at a specific angle of rotation, a clever idea.
The "holes" that the "Pins" fit into have cut outs that are just wide enough to accept the pins when at that angle, as they also have flats to fit those cut outs, you can see what I'm talking about by a simple field strip.
As a carry gun either .380 or the 9MM mak cartridge is under powered for such a heavy gun in my simple minded opinion, I mean, there are lighter steel framed guns that chamber 9 X 19 parabellum. Even so, for such a heavy pistol recoil is substantial because it's a blowback.
It's the only gun I've ever seen in which the built in "pins" are shaped so that they will pull away from their respective holes when at a specific angle of rotation, a clever idea.
The "holes" that the "Pins" fit into have cut outs that are just wide enough to accept the pins when at that angle, as they also have flats to fit those cut outs, you can see what I'm talking about by a simple field strip.
As a carry gun either .380 or the 9MM mak cartridge is under powered for such a heavy gun in my simple minded opinion, I mean, there are lighter steel framed guns that chamber 9 X 19 parabellum. Even so, for such a heavy pistol recoil is substantial because it's a blowback.
Military deisgn so built "over" tough. Had to function in the frozen wastes of Siberia as well as the arid south Asia, Kazakstan, etc. Did not have Western CCW in mind when it was designed. Lot of death in the Soviet sphere in the last century and they designed or adapted weapons to work PPsh, AK, SKS, Mosin, (not a Russian design originally), etc
Cash strapped Soviets, a nation in extremis after WWII, needed a reliable pistol that wouldn't be overly expensive to produce. Hence the 9X18 blowback, Supposed to be the most powerful cartridge that a blowback action can handle. Also small enough and the blow back is less likely to malfunction when fired from or into the vision slit of an armored vehicle. The Russians had factors like this in mind when adopting the pistol.
Similar in appearance to a Walther PP on steroids, but appearance is as far as it goes. Has half the parts that a PP has.
Like any machine, it can fail. Ive had very few malfunctions in the 20 or so years Ive been shooting these pistols. Have had to sometimes change worn parts like the trigger bar to get it back to normal. Also, the safety has a pin that rides between it and the slide, This pin can break...the sear and hammer pin can possibly break too, although Ive never heard of this ever happening..
When stripping a mag for cleaning don't set the feed lips against a hard surface while compressing the spring to free up the base plate, in time, and I mean a lot of time, you can bend the lips which can cause missfeeds. I set the mag against my stomach or do it in thin air to avoid this.
I only have military issue PM Makarovs so I can't speak for any others.
Cash strapped Soviets, a nation in extremis after WWII, needed a reliable pistol that wouldn't be overly expensive to produce. Hence the 9X18 blowback, Supposed to be the most powerful cartridge that a blowback action can handle. Also small enough and the blow back is less likely to malfunction when fired from or into the vision slit of an armored vehicle. The Russians had factors like this in mind when adopting the pistol.
Similar in appearance to a Walther PP on steroids, but appearance is as far as it goes. Has half the parts that a PP has.
Like any machine, it can fail. Ive had very few malfunctions in the 20 or so years Ive been shooting these pistols. Have had to sometimes change worn parts like the trigger bar to get it back to normal. Also, the safety has a pin that rides between it and the slide, This pin can break...the sear and hammer pin can possibly break too, although Ive never heard of this ever happening..
When stripping a mag for cleaning don't set the feed lips against a hard surface while compressing the spring to free up the base plate, in time, and I mean a lot of time, you can bend the lips which can cause missfeeds. I set the mag against my stomach or do it in thin air to avoid this.
I only have military issue PM Makarovs so I can't speak for any others.
Badgerstate
New member
A buddy of mine has a Makarov and he loves it. He kind of has an obsession with Russian guns though.
No idea where it was made but he loves it. Ive shot it before and its a nice gun, I prefer a PPK though. (To be fair though, Im kind of obsessed with German guns, so I may not be exactly what you might call, "impartial".)
No idea where it was made but he loves it. Ive shot it before and its a nice gun, I prefer a PPK though. (To be fair though, Im kind of obsessed with German guns, so I may not be exactly what you might call, "impartial".)
The MAKAROV is a interesting cool gun to own, but I consider it more of a collector's item since mine is an original military issue EAST GERMAN model , it's dated 1962 and came with original records of use with the dates and names of the soldiers that were issued with this pistol during it's lifetime in the DDR.
magazines are not cheap anymore and not so easy to get, ammunition is also very limited, I only know one gun store that stocks it
I didnt fire mine for 20 years because ammunition was never available at the local gun shops, they always said they dont carry 9x18 MAK
so my only choice was mail order or over priced gun show prices for $20 - $25 a box , the prices have come down now but I keep mine more for collecting, and seldom fire it
I have plenty of standard 9mm luger caliber pistols to use, much easier to get ammo for regular 9mm.
If I could only have one I would get the EAST GERMAN MAK , but make sure the import markings arent too severe! some have very small light importer's stamps and some have very unsightly over done import markings, try not to get one with the over done import markings.
something about the EG MAKs is they just FEEL so much nicer & smoother than any other MAK available, the quality of machining, fitting, finish is so nice, feels like the quality & craftmanship of a German Walther in my opinion
but if you just want a shooter they have other lower priced variants on the market.
If you enjoy collecting combloc small arms, no collection would be complete without a Makarov or Tokarev pistol.
magazines are not cheap anymore and not so easy to get, ammunition is also very limited, I only know one gun store that stocks it
I didnt fire mine for 20 years because ammunition was never available at the local gun shops, they always said they dont carry 9x18 MAK
so my only choice was mail order or over priced gun show prices for $20 - $25 a box , the prices have come down now but I keep mine more for collecting, and seldom fire it
I have plenty of standard 9mm luger caliber pistols to use, much easier to get ammo for regular 9mm.
If I could only have one I would get the EAST GERMAN MAK , but make sure the import markings arent too severe! some have very small light importer's stamps and some have very unsightly over done import markings, try not to get one with the over done import markings.
something about the EG MAKs is they just FEEL so much nicer & smoother than any other MAK available, the quality of machining, fitting, finish is so nice, feels like the quality & craftmanship of a German Walther in my opinion
but if you just want a shooter they have other lower priced variants on the market.
If you enjoy collecting combloc small arms, no collection would be complete without a Makarov or Tokarev pistol.
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Mrbolo, I agree for the most part. I too shoot other pistols, including 9mms. I also shoot and reload 45ACP, 45 Colt and .357 Magnum.
I have two military issue EG Maks, both were near new when acquired. One was in cosmoline at a local GS and the owner of the shop thought it was a Bulgarian...I played dumb and got it for what Bulgarians were going for at the time..... I could sell it (which I ain't) for four times what I paid for it.
The other, and the first one I acquired, is a Century Arms import I got from SOG and the gorillas at Century did not do what I would consider a good job of stamping the import mark. It's not too bad but with a little care, it could have been a lot better.
When I cleaned all the cosmoline off the second EG, it appeared brand new, the import mark was fairly unobtrusive and unusual as it was imported BY PW Arms of Redmond Wa....
I also have two military issue Bulgarians.
I shoot all four pistols, opinions will vary, but IMO, although the East Germans have a better exterior finish, better polish, with less tool marks, etc. I can tell no difference in the operation, accuracy or functional reliability between the Bulgarian and EG pistols..
I have two military issue EG Maks, both were near new when acquired. One was in cosmoline at a local GS and the owner of the shop thought it was a Bulgarian...I played dumb
and got it for what Bulgarians were going for at the time..... I could sell it (which I ain't) for four times what I paid for it.The other, and the first one I acquired, is a Century Arms import I got from SOG and the gorillas at Century did not do what I would consider a good job of stamping the import mark. It's not too bad but with a little care, it could have been a lot better.
When I cleaned all the cosmoline off the second EG, it appeared brand new, the import mark was fairly unobtrusive and unusual as it was imported BY PW Arms of Redmond Wa....
I also have two military issue Bulgarians.
I shoot all four pistols, opinions will vary, but IMO, although the East Germans have a better exterior finish, better polish, with less tool marks, etc. I can tell no difference in the operation, accuracy or functional reliability between the Bulgarian and EG pistols..