scooby,
Please rank your four 9 Makarovs in order of preference with your rationale.
Thanks.
Limnophile, technically I have 5, but one is a commercial, a doublestack Russian. I didn't throw it into the surplus category to avoid confusion, but I'll put it in this group.
I'll try to do a thorough eval of them, I think I had done one a few years back somewhere.
To shoot:
- CZ 82
- East German makarov
- IJ-70 AH18 (the doublestack Russian)
- P-64
- PA-63
The CZ and the 2 true Makarovs are solid guns with some heft, and control the recoil best. The CZ and the EG have the best triggers, but the Russian is close behind. The CZ has ambidextrous controls (I'm a lefty), and a magazine release at the trigger guard, which I prefer over the European heel release of the Maks. The Maks have a decocker on the slide, vs the cocked/locked frame safety on the CZ. I like frame safeties, but on a gun this compact it's no big deal, and I kind of prefer the decock option vs lowering the hammer, or clicking it to cocked locked. For range use, the mag release wins out.
The P-64 is the smallest, but with a steel frame, recoil isn't too bad. It is a small gun, I definitely need the pinky rest on the magazine to get a good grip, and I don't have big hands by any stretch of the imagination. Good bit of muzzle flip compared to the above guns, takes a second to get back on target. Sights are tiny, but accurate, and I barely see them. It will shoot where you point it, and this groups well inside of 10 yds for me. The heel release is a little hard to get to.
A note here- the DA trigger is very heavy, you won't have good accuracy, unless you can crack pecans and walnuts just by squeezing them in your fist! It's got to be the heaviest trigger I have found, I've seen people say it might be near 20 lbs. Conversely, the SA trigger is very light, so that a flinch or twitch will fire a round. The two are tied together, so if you lighten the DA, you WILL make the SA into literally a hair trigger. It seems kind of bizarre, but my understanding is the design was to decock, and then then take off safe. The profoundly heavy DA pull is meant to be a safety, and the very light SA makes up a lot for the small size in terms of accuracy. Just hold onto the grip, or that SA will surprise you the first time.
The PA 63 has an aluminum frame, and the recoil is harsh. I've described it before, it feels like you're holding a piece of metal, and striking an anvil. There is a jolt that goes into your hand and wrist, and this can become painful quickly. I've had large friends who shoot bigger guns, such as the 1911 in .45 acp, who will fire off 1 mag and then set it down with a "no thanks". My ex, a small woman who owns a CZ 82 from when we were married, shot 1 rd and set it down. If you're curious what carpal tunnel syndrome feels like, shoot this gun; it will leave your thumb and wrist tingling for awhile afterwards. It has a mag release on the trigger guard.
Appearances and feel, not shooting:
- East German Makarov
- PA 63
- CZ 82
- Russian IJ-70 18H
- P-64
This gets to be complex. Start at the top, the EG Mak. Very nicely blued, smooth, satin, no roughness. A very pretty gun, with a good feel to it. It just oozes craftsmanship and quality.
Next is the beastly PA 63; it has a blued slide and in my case, a black anodized aluminum frame, a very sleek appearance and it fits wonderfully into the hand. I got a replacement flat panel grip so my left grip mirrors my right one (Tillander sells these, and it's worth it). If all you wanted to do was hold one, this is the gun you would choose.
My CZ 82 is next, it's got a good solid feel to it. In a lot of ways, it feels like a Beretta 92, but shrunk down just a bit to make it smaller. The grip is full, but not huge, and it fills my hand perfectly. The length is in proportion to the grip, to where it doesn't seem either stubby, narrow or long. The lines are attractive and the controls are precise and good, and it's a great gun. Where it falls back is the finish, it's the CZ polycoat, and not as pretty as blued. Mine has the inevitable chip on the grip, but since it's parkerized under the polycoat, this isn't a problem; but it doesn't match the EG in finish.
The Russian doublestack has a blued slide and a parkerized frame, and that's factory. Everything the EG has on a scale of 10, this has on a 7 or 8, in terms of appearance and feel. The mismatched frame/slide just doesn't quite match up to the EG, and the factory grips are comfortable but look a little weird, they have some odd, sharp lines, that you don't feel. In all, it is solid, just not as well-made as the EG. Things are the same, but not quite; the clicks aren't quite as precise.
The P 64 is last, but not because it's awful. It's well made and solid, precise fitting, and nicely blued (mine has a rough spot on the slide from the importer, but I'm not counting that for this review). It's just a smaller gun, and not particularly attractive. It doesn't fill the hand, it leaves the pinky out, something odd for a duty issue (but if you want a subcompact that's fine). It SEEMS smaller than it is, because it's still almost as wide as the others; the grip is still as fat as the PA 63, and the slide is almost as long. The mag release is recessed inside the grip and magwell, so you have to fiddle a little to release it. The overall lines are snubby and rounded; it probably makes an ideal form for a small pistol, but it just isn't pretty to look at or hold. But as said, the workmanship is there, from the factory everything is very well made, and a lot of gun for the price (and size).
Cost (for me)
- East German Mak, 2 mags, cleaning rod, holster- $299
- P-64, 2 mags $240
- CZ 82, 2 mags, holster, rod $229 (I went in on a group of 4 buy with friends and family)
- Russian IJ-70 18AH and 1 mag, $199
- PA 63, 2 mags, rod, holster $159
This was at purchase, I've since added stuff. I found a seller on ebay who had surplus flap holsters (stiff and unissued) for $4 apiece, so I got a few. All seem to fit, the doublestack is just a little tight, but is wearing into it.
The mags for the doublestack are rare and pricey, but I found some ProMags that work (just need to tune the lips), for suggested cost... this was a good deal, as even these are usu over $50 when you can find them. The mag that came with the gun is 100% reliable, I'm still fiddling with the 2 others, but for range use, it's acceptable.
I got some additional mags for the P-64 from a seller in Poland off gunbroker, if you check on the P64 Forum, the seller is recommended. I think the mags were around $55 for 2. He gets factory OEM stuff.
For the CZ 82, I got the boxy issue holster, but later picked up a leather police holster and magazine holder from CDNN, these are not pricey and well worth it. The Makarov fits in it too, as do the doublestack mak mags into the holder.
I bought the PA 63 years ago, it was my first of this caliber. Maybe 10 yrs back now... I got the military flap holster for it, but did a straight trade with a friend for a lefthanded Walther PP holster from Bianchi. It's a perfect fit. I found a couple of extra mags, so I now have 4 or 5; forgot the price. Not cheap, not expensive. Probably around $20 apiece back then. I think they are more, now.
Pics- on left, clockwise from top left: P-64, PA 63 (with old grip), EG Makarov on bottom right, CZ 82 in center.
Right pic- Russian IJ 70 18AH, you can see the parkerized frame and the weird looking grip.
