An interesting ruling and a good lesson for us all.

An important note about this case:

My understanding is that it is NOT precedent-setting (meaning it doesn't 'control' anyone or anything else but the person or people directly involved), because it's a trial court case. If it is appealed to the circuit court, THAT court's decision would be precedent-setting.
 
That is my understanding as well. Still, a ruling by a federal judge that is allowed to stand is likely to have at least some effect on future similar cases, even if it isn't really binding in the way a precedent would be.
 
While not binding precedent, unless overturned by appeal could still be cited as persuasive authority.

Personally, I'd prefer not to be a test case. I'll continue to leave my guns off USPS property.
 
Well I go deer hunting on the National Forests as well as wood cutting, concurrently. Now I am alarmed that, in the past, I might have innocently been in violation somehow.... I can't remember for sure, because I would have thought nothing of it at the time....
Is this what America has come to, where the right to choose which brand of beer you will drink, while watching whatever football team you prefer, is some of the very few freedoms left? Everything else can be criminalized? So weird....
 
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As far as I know, it is still perfectly legal for most people to ship a long gun by US mail. How can it be shipped if it is not legal to carry it into the Post Office?
 
cjwils said:
As far as I know, it is still perfectly legal for most people to ship a long gun by US mail. How can it be shipped if it is not legal to carry it into the Post Office?
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The law: https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/39/232.1

§ 232.1 Conduct on postal property.

(a) Applicability. This section applies to all real property under the charge and control of the Postal Service, to all tenant agencies, and to all persons entering in or on such property. This section shall be posted and kept posted at a conspicuous place on all such property. This section shall not apply to—

(i) Any portions of real property, owned or leased by the Postal Service, that are leased or subleased by the Postal Service to private tenants for their exclusive use;

(ii) With respect to sections 232.1(h)(1) and 232.1(o), sidewalks along the street frontage of postal property falling within the property lines of the Postal Service that are not physically distinguishable from adjacent municipal or other public sidewalks, and any paved areas adjacent to such sidewalks that are not physically distinguishable from such sidewalks.

(b) Inspection, recording presence.

(1) Purses, briefcases, and other containers brought into, while on, or being removed from the property are subject to inspection. However, items brought directly to a postal facility's customer mailing acceptance area and deposited in the mail are not subject to inspection, except as provided by section 274 of the Administrative Support Manual. A person arrested for violation of this section may be searched incident to that arrest.
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(l) Weapons and explosives. Notwithstanding the provisions of any other law, rule or regulation, no person while on postal property may carry firearms, other dangerous or deadly weapons, or explosives, either openly or concealed, or store the same on postal property, except for official purposes.
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I think it's clear from the context that "carry" means to carry as we normally think about "carrying" firearms, not to transporting an unloaded firearm packed up in a mailing box. Further, mailing a package is an official purpose. Carrying a loaded pistol in your pocket for self-defense is not an official purpose.
 
Ever heard the phrase " going postal?" It's doubtful that restricting guns decrease work place violence. In the '80s and 90's department managers where I worked were required to attend several forums about work place violence. The water district where I worked also operated and maintained dams and canals owned by the Fed. Our lawyers got really draconian with prohibitions on firearms. After I retired the restrictions were relaxed.
 
You go in someplace and complete your business in a thoughtful correct manner there is little to worry about with the usual small pocket pistol and concealed carry.
Make a scene...draw attention to yourself hollering at somebody..etc etc.Your .45 hangin on your hip...that never works, even at a gun range. Now if you see a metal detector its time for plan B...about face,
 
When you see the signs on the entrances that say no firearms (or weapons) allowed, its time to about face if you're carrying, RIGHT THEN. Don't go in and decide to back out when there is a metal detector, you've already broken the law by then. Also, backing out to avoid the metal detector might, on its own, be considered suspicious behavior and provide grounds for you to be stopped and searched, and if you're packin', you're busted, right there!

Don't, don't be that idiot, you make the rest of us look bad, and it WILL wreck your day (and likely a lot more than that)

If you are armed, and do have to go into one of those buildings, check the parking lot entrances CLOSELY, to see if they have signs prohibiting weapons there, also, and if they do, park somewhere else, no matter how inconvenient it is, and secure your arms in your car. Yes, there's an element of risk, your car might be burgled, your weapon stolen.

Balance that against the risk of being caught and found guilty of violating state and possibly Federal law, and the penalties of doing so. Up to and including prison time, hefty fines, and loss of firearms rights for the rest of your life.
 
44 AMP said:
When you see the signs on the entrances that say no firearms (or weapons) allowed, its time to about face if you're carrying, RIGHT THEN. Don't go in and decide to back out when there is a metal detector, you've already broken the law by then. Also, backing out to avoid the metal detector might, on its own, be considered suspicious behavior and provide grounds for you to be stopped and searched, and if you're packin', you're busted, right there!
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Of course, at the post office if you have parked in their parking lot you have already broken the law if you're carrying. On the other hand, the law says the facility must be posted, and I have never seen a No Guns sign at the entrance to a USPS parking lot. Catch 22.

The entrances to the property ARE posted at the VA hospital I go to, but the signs specifically cite 18 USC 930 as authority, and 18 USC 930 only applies inside the buildings. There's another federal regulation that does apply, which is why I regard those signs as a trap.
 
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