Ammo problem with new ammo

D

Davecota

Inactive
So I recently ordered about 15 boxes of 45ACP from Outdoor Limited and I bought brand new Blazer Brass 230gr FMJ. I went to the range today and pulled out the first box I threw in the bag and noticed that the height of the rounds was not uniform. I pulled out a short round and noticed that the bullet was really recessed inside the case. There were a handful of rounds in the box that looks to be off. I checked the 2nd box I took with me and it all looked normal.

Should I just throw this box out? Should I contact the vendor or the manufacturer and let them know whats up? Never had this problem before with factory new ammo. I am going to include some pics to show you what I mean. I also need to inspect all the other boxes I bought now.


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In the top pic you can see that the box of ammo was dropped (edge of the box facing the pic, front left from the box's point of view). It hit hard enough to drive the bullets back into the case. This is also clear from where the rounds sat in the box...think it through and take it from there.

This could have happened in shipping or anywhere from the factory to you.

You could send this pic on to OUtdoor Limited and see what they say for you to do. Till they reply shoot nothing from the box and hold on to it. They may want you to send the box of ammo back to them in order to get a new box.

In no case should you fire the damaged rounds.

tipoc
 
Yeah I just found a 2nd box that also looked like it was dropped on the corner and also has the same problem with some of the rounds have been pushed into the case.
 
Pushing the bullet deeper into the case raises the discharge pressure compared to normal length rounds. How much? It can be a lot, depending on a number of variables.

I don't have any specific information for how a given amount of setback affects the discharge pressure in .45ACP. I would be disinclined to shoot any of the rounds that are obviously shorter than the rest of the rounds in the box.
 
If you were desperate for ammo, you could always use an impact bullet puller to get them back to normal.
As long as there weren't other loading errors, of course.
Just a thought.
 
Yeah, I wouldn't want to fire any of those shorter rounds. The .45 ACP has very little case volume as it is; reducing it that much could increase pressures more than I'd be comfortable with.

Another issue comes to mind. If the bullets got set back into the casings that much just from being dropped, I'd be mighty concerned they could do the same thing when feeding in your gun. I'd try letting the slide slingshot closed several times on a handful of the other rounds, and check to see if the bullets have moved in the casing. Maybe that batch didn't get enough crimp at the factory.
 
Good thought possum. But it's the case with any semi-auto round I've played with, that chambering a round repeatedly will drive the bullet back into the case some. As you explained this can become an issue. It why many shooters rotate their carry ammo and avoid chambering that same round over and over. It doesn't mean that there is a problem with the ammo, it just means it's a fact of life with semis and the ammo for them.

You can check tis on your own and see that it is the case. (no pun intended)

tipoc
 
But it's the case with any semi-auto round I've played with, that chambering a round repeatedly will drive the bullet back into the case some.
Click to expand...

it's a fact that this can, and does happen, but it doesn't HAVE to happen. You can, and factories used to build their ammo the "right" way so setback wasn't much of an issue. Today, that isn't the case. Ammo makers build their ammo to be "good enough" for a few chamberings, as this is all most people will do.

One fellow I know bought two boxes of Federal 185gr JHP in 1980. He kept the last 7 rounds (one mag) for home defense, factory to avoid any legal issues with handloads. He kept that mag of factory ammo for 20 years!!!!

Those rounds were chambered hundreds, if not thousands of times over the years, to the point where the nickel cases had brass stripes showing through the nickel plating. Rounds were repeatedly measured for setback. NONE ever setback. He did, eventually fire them and every one functioned perfectly.

Based on this, I believe that ammo CAN be made that won't set back during normal use. The fact that most ammo isn't made to do that anymore, doesn't mean it cannot be done. At least one maker used to cannelure their cases, right below the bullet base, which prevented any setback. They don't do that, nowdays...You also see it on some old GI .45acp ammo....

Setback CAN be prevented. Its just ammo makers today (usually) no longer bother with the added effort & expense.

The ammo you have was "damaged during shipping", the retailer should not have sold it in that condition. Contact them, FIRST, for replacement. DO NOT SHOOT ANY OF IT!!! Do not shoot the "good" rounds, keep them all intact, AND the boxes and turn them in for replacement. Turn them back in to the retailer for replacement, and let the retailer get their money back from the shipper/distributor they got the ammo from. If possible. If the retailer won't act, go to the manufacturer, and ask for help. Being able to send the maker all the rounds and in the damaged boxes (if they ask for them) would be a plus.

To be fair, a slightly damaged box USUALLY doesn't mean damaged ammo, but in this case, you have clear evidence of the ammo being damged (bullets shoved deeper into the cases), and I believe you are due a replacement or refund.
 
And make a note of the lot number which should appear on the box somewhere.

It took a heck of a lick to deep seat those bullets. Or should have, as AMP says.
 
So I contacted outdoor limited. They were great. The owner sent me an email the next day and he already has replacement boxes shipped no questions. I'll see if a reloader wants these boxes to fix and shoot.
 
It i hard to tell whether that ammo is factory new or reloads, but it would take a lot of drop to drive bullets that deep in well made factory ammo. There can always be a goof with any company, but I suspect the ammo is "re-manufactured" (or whatever term the reloaders are using today) and I would not buy any more of it.

Jim
 
it would take a lot of drop to drive bullets that deep in well made factory ammo.
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That occurred to me as well. But then I thought maybe there was a whole big stack of ammo boxes on a pallet or something. It wouldn't take as much drop to shove the bullets in if there was a lot of weight sitting on top of 'em.
 
That ammo was subjected to abuse that was completely insane. Someone threw an upside down case onto a floor. They obviously don't care about handing it properly, and now they've been rumbled.

I wouldn't pick up a piece of ammo from that dealer EVER, Lord knows if they've smacked other stuff around badly enough to set your hunting rounds askew.

That said,even throwing a case on the ground, crushing it with maybe 100 flb of force psi, should that cause setback? Let the maker decide. Contact Speer and inform them of this.
 
If it was me, I'd dispose of the two worst ones (on the left) and shoot the others. It's not worth the hassle to send it back or whatever.
 
That ammo was subjected to abuse that was completely insane. Someone threw an upside down case onto a floor. They obviously don't care about handing it properly, and now they've been rumbled.

I wouldn't pick up a piece of ammo from that dealer EVER...
Click to expand...

I'd guess the damage happened during shipping. The weight of the package might have ticked someone off so he slammed it. Some people are funny like that.
 
You need to safely discard any .45ACP 230gr FMJ rounds which do not fall within a 1.250" to 1.255" OAL range, it's not worth it to mess with rounds that are either too short or too long based on this range.
 
I once ran a bunch of tests on several brands of 9mm ammo to test the idea that rechambering a round can cause the bullet to be driven into the case and raise pressure. It takes a LOT of pressure to push a bullet as deep as shown with factory ammo, which is why I suspect it is reloaded rather than factory new.

FWIW, I never got pressures anywhere near "blow up" point. I fired that ammo first in a Ruger convertible, and when it showed no real high pressure went to several different auto pistols. I never blew up any guns and even bullets seated so deeply that the case bulged produced only moderate pressure signs. (No blow ups, sorry.)

Jim
 
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