Advice for my house

Post shooting drill is; call 911 (if you have not already) and be prepared to meet them when they arrive, unarmed and hands up. But do not disarm yourself - nor drop your guard until the police do arrive, in case there are more badguys around and attempt a second visit or appear from a hiding place. When calling 911 give a physical description of yourself and how you are dressed; this will aid first arriving police in clearly identifying you as the caller.

As for the legalities, research this and other forums and you will find this topic well trampled. The bottom line is to make sure that any use of deadly force is justified under your state law and in accordance with it.

But in an antagonistic encounter, do not worry about anything else except your own survival first (and that of your family), and that any shooting is a justifiable shooting under the law. If you keep that in order, the rest is secondary and can be worried about later. I believe there are various types of prepaid legal services or insurance you can take out if you can afford them, and that topic too is no doubt searchable on this forum as well.
 
Virginia is one of 'those' states. You can't shoot an intruder in your house unless he is threatening your life directly, and forget drawing a weapon on someone stealing your property.

Basically someone can crack open a window, ruffle through your granddaddy's priceless artifacts and waltz out the front door while you watch.

Damn lawyers. :barf:
 
chris in va wrote:

Virginia is one of 'those' states. You can't shoot an intruder in your house unless he is threatening your life directly, and forget drawing a weapon on someone stealing your property.
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I think thats basically any state. (someone correct me if i'm wrong) I don't think there are very many states that allow deadly force to protect property.

That doesn't mean you can't bash his face in tho............. ;)
 
I had the good fortune of being able to choose the floorplan for our house. It is exactly because of such stupid, ambiguous laws about when you are legally able to use deadly force within your home to defend yourself that one of my requirements was that all bedrooms be located UPstairs, and to get to the kids' rooms you have to get past my door.

Anyone breaks into the house can go to town downstairs. Good luck getting out with my stuff before the sheriff shows up! It's all engraved with my ID and I'm insured. Meanwhile I'm upstairs with the SureFire-lighted Mossberg 12 gauge trained on the top of the stairs where I have a nightlight positioned to cast a bit of light at the top of the stairs. If I see anyone appear there, I blast them with 120 lumens of light and, if they are confirmed to be a bad guy who doesn't immediately retreat back downstairs, the light is followed up with a load of #1 buckshot.

The "stuff" is all downstairs. Nothing upstairs but sleeping people. The top of the stairs is my legal/moral Line of Distinction for the use of deadly force. I'm sorry that Avizpls does not have such a clear Line. It sure is nice to have and I recommend doing whatever you can to create one.

One would like to think that, even in whacky Washington state, no jury would convict me of unlawful use of force in such a situation. One never knows, though.....
 
I think Timulator brings up a good, nay, essential point.

One of the things sure to slow down a response to a threat is making a decision, and the bigger and more important the decision, the longer it will take.

Having as many decisions 'pre-made' in the manner of "The top of the stairs is my legal/moral Line of Distinction for the use of deadly force." will greatly improve the timely response to an intruder.

Another thing I'd suggest is (go ahead and laugh...) 'Burglar Drills.' Let the family participate in what the plan will be when an intruder is suspected. Just like a fire drill, it lets you make the jump from knowing what to do to being able to do it without hesitation.

Larry
 
I hadn't thought of it in terms of decision-making time, DT Guy, but that's exactly what my plan has done.

And we do have burglar drills. More often, in fact, than fire drills!

We have two scenarios, one in which I'm home and my wife mans the phone and the other when I'm on a business trip and she's alone.

In a nutshell, when I'm home, wife calls 911 and I cover the top of the stairs with the 12 gauge from around a corner in the hallway just outside my bedroom door.

When I'm not home and wife's reasonably sure there's someone in the house, she dials 911 and drops the phone so the dispatcher can hear what's going on. As wife covers the top of the stairs from the corner in the hallway, she yells (for the kids and the 911 dispatcher) that there is a burglar in the house and the boys are to run to our room behind her while she covers the stairs. Then she retreats to the bedroom, closes and locks our door, picks up the phone to speak with the dispatcher while covering the locked bedroom door from the bed. Anyone kicking the door in is shot. The boys meanwhile hide in the master bathroom, well clear of the bedroom door.

In either scenario, when the police arrive, we have a house key on a keyring with a light stick on it, which we would throw out the bedroom window. We would coordinate with the dispatcher to identify the responding officers and so they know who and where we are.

Practice is key, for it has pointed out flaws in the system we hadn't thought of until we went through the drill. And by practicing, everyone knows what to do and it would very likely all go much smoother in an emergency. Besides, the boys, 3-1/2 and 6-1/2, absolutely LOVE the burglar drills! :D
 
Sounds like a good plan.

Ever think of attaching a map of your house to the key, along with the room you're going to be holed up in?


Larry
 
Ever think of attaching a map of your house to the key, along with the room you're going to be holed up in?
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Hey.... Hadn't thought of that. Great idea! Thanks! Maybe a picture of me and my wife also, to confirm identification.
 
My response from the "Bump...do you investigate?" thread also located in the Tactics and Training forum.

Interesting Thread.

My plan is much like RKs, but has some more parts to it

My house was purchased with a home break-in scenario as a consideration. All sleeping areas are on second floor. Master bedroom has clear sight line of to stairway. One child still in the house, has bedroom next to master, 3 feet away from master br door.

Bump in the night drill is as follows. Upon alert, (dog, alarm, etc) wife and I make sure each is awake. I secure Glock and mag light, move to daughter's room and move her to master bedroom (she is instructed to remain in room until either of us get her). While doing so, wife makes 911 call and secures Scattergun Tech 870 from closet. I return with daughter, shut door, turn on bedroom light and all move both to master bath, which has clear sight line to bedroom door. (Contact maintained with LE dispatch throughout situation).

At this point wait. If intruder(s) is in house, he/she/they can have anything in it outside the master bedroom (that's what insurance is for!) If BG(s) comes thru bedroom door, I'm ready and prepared to engage. Upon arrival of LE, front door key on big hunter orange boat float key chain out the bathroom window to front lawn for LE folks. Further action depends on how LE folks want to proceed.


Too paranoid, Too cautious? Perhaps, but some key things to consider.


1. I have made the determination at this point in my life not to do any house clearing if I don't have to, and if allowed the option, will wait the situation out from a defensive position of my choosing. My thinking is also greatly influenced by a home invasion situation when I was 17. (Worked out OK, but upon much review as I've gotten older (I'm 50), was based on luck since my mom and I didn't have a clue!)

2. There is a plan, and we practice it, including communication between ourselves during the drill, redundent comms (cordless/cell phones), switching roles, and one parent options. (Ayoob's thoughts and recommendations had a great influence on the decision/planning process). Is the plan perfect? Nope, no plan survives first contact with BG/enemy. There are always variations/contingencies to consider/execute as the situation develops.

3. Having done actual, hostiles involved house clearing ops (military, not LE situations) I don't really want to ever do another, especially since I don't have access to the personnel/gear/weapons mix available in those ops. (teammates, NVGs & frag grenades are wonderful things!)

4. I know my limitations and would much rather leverage tactical and personal advantages, rather then mitigate weaknesses. (The older you get, the better you was!)


My considerations and decisions in this regard may not be yours, but this works for me.

Pretty verbose I know, but just my opinion. All comments encouraged and welcome!
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safety first

Dogs are easy to bypass. As any BG will tell you.
If the BG wants in he will get in.
Get yourself to a training facility. I'm sure there is one near you. If not, the internet is an amazing tool, as we can all see.
There are many hazards in clearing room to room (death being one of them).
Remember the BG hears you approaching and can hide himself.
You know your house and that's good, but he stays put, waiting for you.
Do you know the ways to clear a room? Do you know what in your house is concealment vs cover? Do you know the difference between the two? Do you have a phone downstairs?= Police!
The alarm idea is good, but when the alarm is tripped and you're downstairs
which one was it?
How often do you train w/ your firearm? Not just target practice.
The one thing I will say is anyone in their right mind will get the heck out of your home if they hear the pump action of a shot gun.
But then alot of BG are not in their right minds.
Sounds to me you need to get training.
In the mean time the Police are your best bet if you truly hear a "bump" in the night. Thats what they train for.
Just the ramblings of an old man ;-)
 
Dogs are easy to bypass. As any BG will tell you.
If the BG wants in he will get in.
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I've been a policeman for almost 20 years, many of those in a large ghetto-area department, and have never taken a burglary report where the house was occupied at the time of the burglary, and there was a barking dog present......ever.......On the other hand, I've taken numerous burglary reports where multiple guns were stolen while the occupants were away.....I don't think I've ever taken a burglary report where the guns kept anyone out of the house while the occupant was away. Dogs have a far better record than guns or burglar alarms.
 
Starting point........

I have read a few other informative ideas but let me change gears for a second.

1. This is your Mom and Dad's home... They should be sat down and you and them have a meeting about safety - security - and what to do in both these as well as fire and medical emergency.

2. I can tell you that if you don't speak to them about your concerns they will not have any idea of your desire to make the home safer and more secure. If you try to do this with out their knowing it or approval you can bet they will be a little pissed that your leaving them out of the big plan... and they are right to be pissed with you if you go that route....

3. The dog - Is he a watch/security dog or a little lap pup that doesn't sound the alarm? In my house our Shep. mix is the alarm system and he would react to a break in likely before it took place..... great ears and instincts. I am sure he would fight to his death if that were to defend his home and family.
4. I get a little nervous about you defending home from a basement.... this could turn into a bad sack of worms..... numbers of tacticle reasons....
5. I would look into an alarm system if you feel that this is an advantage for your family. Many types and kinds and numbers of applications are available. The more you pay the more you get. I guess it depends on your area you live too?
6. Motion detection lights on exterior walls - up high so BG can't get at them. Constant area lighting isn't bad either. If your exterior is lite well your semi - normal BG might shy away cause he knows somebody might seem him and call about his activity.

It would be a good idea to sit down and have that talk with the owner's (Mom + Dad) and express your concerns and your solutions.... that's just how I would get the ball rolling............ Good luck.......... :D
 
Interesting question. Having all the good guys upstairs and guarding the narrow stairway would be my choice. Having some family members upstairs and others in the basement with intruders in between is a frightening thought. I like the dog idea, and I like the idea of creating a safe room for family members to retreat to in such an emergency while someone calls the police (cell phone--intruders cut phone lines). Another person stands guard and protects the door to the safe room. Even then, Murphy says things won't work as planned.
 
:rolleyes: Go to the foot of the stairs and yell at the top of your lungs: 'Hey mom, hey dad, is everything all right?' 'There's not a burglar in the house, or anything, is there?' 'Mr. Burglar, if you're there, I've already called the police; and they're on the way!' 'Leave now; I've got a gun and I'm ready to use it!' ;)
 
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