Advice for my house

Avizpls

New member
If you can help me, it'd be appreciated. Im trying to determine the best way to protect my self and others in the house in case of a *bump* in the night. Here's my situation:

I am 21. I live with both of my parents. They know I have guns (a PT140 and a "tactical" style shotgun) but I havent told them yet that they enter my mind when I hear a noise. And they do not have guns readily available. Even if they did, I would still feel it is up to me to perform this duty after hours. Anyways, this is two parts. which of these tools to you suggest I grab, and how do I go about seeing what is upstairs?

Picture my house as this:
[A][C]
[D][E][F]

and duplicated as it is two stories. I live in F in the basement. My parents are in A upstairs. (Upstairs is ground level, there is nothing higher than level)Sometimes (this really throws a wrench into the emotional factor) my neice is in B upstairs. The main enterence is E upstairs, with a second one D downstairs. I can see the inside portion of D from in my room, thru a window. I am not worried about that. My dilema is if I suspect an entry thru E upstairs...now what. I dont want to just go running up there with my shotgun pointed around, flicking its laser all about my father while he lets the dog out. but do I sit idley downstairs? I dont THINK so!

But thats my problem. I dont like either extreme. any suggestions for me? How to go about it, and which weapon to get? And I dont like the "call police first" thing, because what if its stupid and my blind dog ran into something?
 
One of the first things I would do is order some of those little 1st alert alarms.
(do google search) They are really tiny, and can be installed very discretely on ANY door, window. They install with a super strong sticky backing, and require no tools. You can get I think 8 of them for $20. Any opening that has one gets opened and they set off an ear splitting siren. At least it will let you know if a door or window was actually opened.

And it has been hashed over dozens of times here on TFL, investigating, room clearing in an occupied home is one of the most dangerous things you can do. To many variables, and too many chances for things to go wrong.
Another good thing to have in my opinion is a big, loud, noisy, biting, DOG.

The situation you are in requires some advance planning. Sit down with the others in your house and settle on a definate plan if that situation happens. That way everyone will know where everyone else is SUPPOSED to be, and it will minimize chances of 'friendly' encounters in the dark.

I worked for awhile when I was younger installing home security. We had this one guy that was really super paranoid. We installed locking 'saferoom'
doors on almost every room in the house, video monitors, the whole 9 yards.
He even had 'panic buttons' in several rooms that when pressed would activate audible alarms, turn on almost every single light inside and outside the house, and alert the LEO's. It was a sweet setup, but a little much. :)
 
And it has been hashed over dozens of times here on TFL, investigating, room clearing in an occupied home is one of the most dangerous things you can do.

I've seen that, and I agree. But on the nights my neice (3yo) is thrown into the mix, it really bothers me. Escpecialy since she is the closest room to the front door. And moving her room isnt very much of an option, because there is no other decent place for her that is any less close to a main door. And my parents are pretty trusting of neighbors. I talked to them last night about maybe starting to lock the doors at night. So I was happy to see that they were all ready locked when I walked upstairs to do so. Obviously, they arent particularly concerned.

What do you think of this for if my neice isnt in the equation: Call the house from my cell phone in an instance I think there is a real problem. It'll wake my parents, and startle the BG, if there is one. Good? Bad?

And what if the little one IS there? I think I HAVE to get ot her at the very least, but that means going past the side and front doors directly.
 
Possible starting places

1. All doors to the outside are always locked, even when people are home and feeling safe. Everyone has a key. No keys should be given to non-family members or people who do not belong in the house.

2. Put those little alarms on all windows.

3. Have a plan about what to do when:
a. one of the alarms goes off
b. a person THINKS they hear an intruder
c. add other scenarios appropriate to your situation

I live alone and have gone over many scenarios and have been able to come up with one plan that will always work for all possible scenarios. Until Mr. Murphy comes of course. :rolleyes:
 
We have two dogs. One is blind, and the other barks at me, but not at the ax wielding serial killer (not actually happened) So I dont think I can rely on them. I really feel there is no good answer because I dont want to hinder the style they have always had. Apperently, leaving a small lamp on in the nliving room is like a force shield against bad people?
 
How about a cell phone and call the police first and report a break-in.

Also put things into perspective. Where do you live? Is it a high crime area? Are you in the city? What is the response time of your local PD? Is there a history of break-ins in your neighborhood?

A shotgun may be the ultimate self defense weapon, but can get unwieldy in dark tight situations where you may be overcome before you can get the muzzle pointed properly and then you have to worry about over penetration thru sheetrock walls.

I am not sure of a good solution for you. I am just posting all the issues I see that can be a BIG negative.

Last but not least, it is NOT your house. The owner or head of household is the decision maker in this instance. It is the HOH's responsibility to ensure the safety of the house...not you because of altruistic feelings. If you feel you MUST be the protector then you need to discuss this w/ your father.
 
To answer ninjas Q's

The cell phone is #1 once i confirm its an actual intruision.

I live outside of pittsburgh, about half mile from anyone, but right on a main route. Not high crime. PD response....20min? Not a very bad record of break ins.

The shotgun has a light on it, but I almost feel thats a negative. Gives away any sneak i might have.
 
The shotgun has a light on it, but I almost feel thats a negative. Gives away any sneak i might have.

The pump action of chambering a round in the shotgun will also give away any sneak you might have.
 
How about you getting a dog of your own?

It does not have to be huge, but it should be a dog known for attentive behavior. My wifes little jack russel is a great watch dog, not big but it WATCHES. A cat walking on snow in a blizzard will setting off his alarms.
I have a big Lab that is my hunting dog that will not care who is outside but woe be unto him who enters when I am not home. If i had to pick a watch dog I would pick my wifes dog.
Teach the dog his job and he will do it day in day out.

second get some outside lights. Motion detectors, mount them on the house and away from the house. Also get some low voltage landscape lights. Nothing keeps trash away like light.

Find a spot in your house where you can see what is going on and keep yourself in the dark and covered, where you can cover the house and be somewhat protected. use that spot to determine what is going on. just sit and see, let them come to you.

Our house looks like any other but a few simple mods make it hard to get into without making a hell of a lot of noise. A door kicker a simple block of wood dropped behind slider door keeps it shut. Most of the windows have little blocks that hang down and keep the window from opening more than a few inches, but can be flipped up to open window for escape if fire hits
Rose bushes planted outside the Lower level windows make it painful to be creeping around.

By now you should be able to get an idea that the last thing to do is go running around with a loaded shotgun. If it gets to that, playing ninja in the house with parents and a kid around is not how you want to play this game. Develop habits... the cell phone goes to the same place on your bed or on your night stand EVERY NIGHT. Get a cordless phone in the house. One that has an intercom and put that next to your bed and your parents bed. The shotty goes one place. every night. Same with the pistol, I bought a cheap fobus holster and screwed the paddle to the back of the nightstand, every night I put a pistol there and and a Streamlight under my pillow.
If you get a real intruder in the house call 911 on the cordless phone not the cell phone first. It will tell the cops where to go even if you drop the phone and DO NOT HANG UP let that puppy record every sound in the house.
 
You haven't talked to your parents about this? It's their house, and their right to say whether guns should be kept ready for defense or stored and inaccessible. In my opinion, that's number one, before tactics.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for shooting the heck out of bad guys, and am ready to do so if necessary. But this is my house, and I can do what I want.
 
Wayne, they know I have them, and how I have them, but not where. I am like Guntotin_fool in that I have a holster nailed to the wall beside my bed, behind some speakers. The shotgun lies in the same cubby hole. By no means am I thinking that grabbing the shotgun and running thru the house yelling "come out come out whereever you are" iis the best practice. Im pretty sure that I know all of the bad ideas (they come easiers :P ) but good ideas are hard to come by. The intercom comment gave me this idea: hit intercom on a phone (preferably one that wont ding and need to be answered) so I can hear whats upstairs from down here. And at the top of my steps I can see pretty well thru the house. except not my neices room. and if you havent seen by now, thats my biggest concern. I'll keep pondering
 
Avi...I live in Center City Philadelphia. I am not as "paranoid" as you are. I use paranoid due to a lack of a better word so don't take it the wrong way.

Did something recently happen to cause such a concern about household safety? Are you expecting something to happen because you pissed somebody off? Has someone made a threat concerning your niece?

Wayne, they know I have them, and how I have them, but not where.

I really think you need to discuss this w/ your father first before going any further. His word is final. When you get your house, you do what YOU want.

I seems (may not be true) to me that regardless what your father says, you don't want to hear him say no.
 
I would say if they don’t mind you owning guns then get your own dog, my dog is my first line of defense, he is a German Shepherd, has excellent hearing and if someone so much as walks up to the front door that he does not recognize I hear about it, and if given the chance I can let him deal with it, however as soon as he tells me I get a gun, it is not hard to train a German Shepherd to do this as it is in their nature. He makes a great family dog and loves other small dogs and children, however I live alone. Luckily he never has had to tell me of a situation of where I would have to get a gun.
 
It sounds like you live in an almost semi-rural environment. I can not say statistically that such dwellings are more, or less, targets than very isolated or urban homes. But being on a main route means that you have more traffic than the very isolated rural homes, and more people - good and bad - "just passing through". This means more exposure, and anyone with the wrong intentions has a main thoroughfare to make an escape.

The first thing to do is establish what additions or modification you can make to the house. Ideally, a home should be such that anyone can not break in with causing enough noise to wake up everyone at home, and sufficient enough that even with some substantial tools it will take them a minute or more to actually get inside. This is a tall order for some people, and in any case is a matter that can only be decided by those in charge of the household. In this case your parents.

Window and door alarms can be fitted quite cheaply, but can be a nuisance if everyone isn't familiar with their operation and consistant in their use of them.

Lighting is very important, and might be your way to break the opening subject with your parents, seeing as they see some significance in leaving the lamp on in the living room.

The exterior lighting of a house is very important. Floodlighting that faces away from but lights up all areas around the house right up to the walls will enable those inside to see what's going on outside. They can be left on at night to discourage intruders, or they can be activated if there is something going on outside that causes suspicion, or they can be sensor activated.

Inside lighting can be installed that can be used to light up common areas inside the house from remote switches in the bedrooms. These flood or wide spotlight should face away from your bedrooms so that they illuminate the common areas, making it difficult for any intruder to see you, and making them clearly identifiable and easy targets.

I think lights mounted on long guns or handguns are a bad idea. For one thing, like all electronic gadgets they rely on batteries, bulbs and switches which although very reliable when put together and maintained by the right people, can and do fail at the worst of times. I have a pile of lighting devices both cheap and expensive for various purposes; if I am investigating something potentially unpleasant at night I certainly have one with me, but I may not always want it switched on. And I certainly do not want to rely on one to defend myself even in near darkness. If it happens to switch on accidently - because of some unforseen activity, or a faulty switch - I want to be able to toss it immediately. Any lighting device is going to reveal your presence and location to all and everyone for a considerable distance. To use a gunmounted light to identify a person as friend or foe you must point the weapon at them, which violates Rule Two. Of course you can point it off to one side, but to gain the advantage of some spotbeams one has to pretty much point the muzzle at what you want to ID.

I disagree with those who say to just call the police and wait. For one thing, the police are going to, at some stage, ask you to come out and meet them. Few peace officers are going to attempt to enter a house on a call from an unidentified person (regardless of what is said over the phone) of a break-in. You can by all means call them, but at some stage you are going to be faced with the same practical problems. And on their arrival the now additional factor of making sure they do not mistake you for a badguy attempting to leave the scene, or in the event any shooting starts you may find yourself in the line of fire from both the goodguys and the badguys.

First you need a plan.

For all likely occurences. You can not plan for everything that might possibly happen, but those that commly and might reasonably occur. As you learn more, this knowledge, and your planning etc can be expanded.

In your circumstances, depending on who is at home at the time, your plan should run something like; make ready, pick a vantage point where you can see and hear as much as possible (but a defendable position) and listen, look and evaluate for at least long enough to know whether it is in fact a person inside the house, or something else. Be ready at all times just in case an intruder appears suddenly, and maintain a cool fighting mindset. Many people have a problem maintaining "cool"; but it is imperative in making accurate judgements - you do not want to shoot a member of your own family who has arrived home early from a "vacation", or who got up to make some hot chocolate and dropped a porcelain mug on the kitchen floor.

In general, it is clearly an intruder, your best tactic is to let them come to you. This gives you the advantage in almost any likely circumstance. If you hear no further noise after being initially alerted, and a substantial period of time elapses - say three to five minutes - then it is probably time to move. One short slow step at a time, as noiselessly as possible. Use your peripheral vision, especially when entering opening areas of the house.

In your planning, go through the house at night, and make notes on every reflective object and surface that gives you otherwise obstructed views of each room and area. Write them down, memorize them, keep track of changes. Maybe hang a few extra pictures (parents permitting), buy them a shiny brass vase, maybe an antique mirror, whatever fits where, and you can afford, that will assist in viewing critical areas from concealed positions.

Equipment.

I usually prefer a long gun to any handgun even inside a dwelling. The reason is that handgun cartridges are very poor stoppers - regardless of caliber or bullet type. However, a handgun is ideal for wearing around home (not all break-ins happen when everyone is tucked in bed - or even at night), and they are a back-up weapon in the event of a long gun malfunction. Ammunition is a deep subject that is well-addressed in other threads.

I do recommend clear wraparound type shooting glasses. many injuries in armed confrontations are eye injuries. Any time bullets are flying in an indoor enviroment the potential for flying glass fragments, wood splinters etc is quite high. Good ones are not expensive, and there is really no reason not to wear them.

While I generally encourage people not to rely on gadgets, one potentially beneficial item is the electronic hearing protection that amplifies normal sound, but suppresses damaging levels (like gunshots indoors). I do not have these, but the idea has great merit. The worse thing that can happen is that they "fail" - you shed them on the spot - and carry on. The sound amplification would aid greatly in evaluating and tracking any intruder inside a home, and possibly save some hearing damage if shots happen to be fired.

These points are just a start. As you read more material and opinions it will feed your own intellect and you will develope ideas and refine plans of your own.
 
Thanks Lak, Wayne and everyone else. I developed two sets of plans, one for if the little one is around, and one for if not. Not clearing the house by anymeans, but Ill look out my window in my room into the other room, make sure all is fine there and in the garage. Then Ill go upstairs, wait at the top for a few minutes, and either go back downstaris, or proceed to my neices room if she's around.

Ninjato, as far as discussing it with my father, we did. What I meant with that comment is that he knows I have them, he knows they are loaded, but he isnt aware of exactly where in my room they are.
 
Ninjato, as far as discussing it with my father, we did. What I meant with that comment is that he knows I have them, he knows they are loaded, but he isnt aware of exactly where in my room they are.

Cool!!!! :cool:
 
Avi,

Spend some time and think thru what happens AFTER you clear the house, with two bad guys on the run and one guy one the floor bleeding away.

Don't stop your strategic planning at where you did, follow thru and see where the court system may take you, and/or visualise life with a debilitating injury.

Dedicate some of your energies in making your home SAFER and less of a target. If you think your crib is gonna get hit, see what you can do to slow down an undeterred home invasion.

Also, you really should spell things out more for your dad. You can protect 5 lives with two guns, but those same two guns can ruin you financially.

NYC Drew
 
I don't see how those 2 guns are going to ruin him financially. I don't know what the laws are in Pa., but in most states I'm familiar with a home invasion is the absolute, one, iron clad time you have the right to use deadly force in defending your and your family's life with the fewest questions asked and the least possibility of having to seriously defend yourself in a wrongful death civil suit. If it gets to the point where you can't defend yourself in your own home.....I'm moving somewhere where you can.

U.F.O.
 
I dont think my house is any more of a target than any. Probably even less than most. But its a possibility, even if not probable. and you are right, I do need to discuss with pops some more.

As far as what happens afterwards, god. I just hope I dont have to worry about it. Please dont get the idea that I am looking to go gunz-a-blazin if i hear a crackle. What CAN I do in the situation where I was made to use force, be it incapacitating, or deadly. I dont know what to even think about.

and by the way, its THREE guns now :) got a Kel-Tec p3AT.
 
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