Advantages of flechette loads?

A

akfedor7

New member
I just remembered hearing about these years ago. Seemed kinda neat, but never could figure out the real advantages of them. Anybody here know?
 
They work well in a M203, however, I believe the canister doesn't open until it exits the bore. They are made of steel.
 
I guess in a shotshell they would have better sectional density and velocity retention than round pellets.

Single flechettes in sabots can also make some screaming-fast rifle loads with really low recoil.
 
This site has some performance data and historical info...interesting read.
http://www.antipersonnel.net/sdllc/index.html



COMBAT COMPARISON

During the United States Vietnam War of 1965-1972 shotguns played an active role with ground forces and buckshot and flechette ammunition were actively evaluated for combat effectiveness. Combat evaluations from May 1967 to February 1968 were made with flechettes, M162 00 buckshot, and XM257 #4 buckshot. Flechette ammunition indicated a high lethality at all ranges with several one shot kills at engagement ranges to 100 yards, flechettes were prefered by combatants equally to 00 buckshot during this test phase. Flechette ammunition and 00 buckshot were also equally prefered over the issued XM257 #4 buckshot, which proved ineffective under combat conditions, lacking the penitration and terminal performance of either flechettes or 00 buckshot. Adoption of a standardized flechette cartridge was hindered by the United States govenment decision to begin disengaging from the Vietnam War. Flechette superiority to buckshot has proven manifest for all aspects of performance in velocity, grouping, and terminal effects.
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I'm behind on my physics, so not sure... would the flechette travel farther than a round shot of the same diameter? Seems like it would have more drag and slow down quicker. But perhaps flechettes might pattern better?
 
It seems like it would be the difference between a football and a basket ball as to how the flechette and the BB travel through the air.

I am not that good a physics either, but it seems like if the canister opens later then the group could achieve higher velocity.
 
The x-ray I saw of someone hit with flechettes showed that the flechettes bent when they went in.The ones I handled were aluminum .Delivery was by rocket with colored powder to mark impact. IIRC the Brits experimented with rifle cartridges containing just one flechette !
Flechette rounds are not recommended for HD - they don't do well in court !!!
 
buy a few boxes of them and shoot some junk with it. old coffee cans,plastic soda bottles,drywall. i would'nt want get shot with or shoot anyone with them. might not kill you,but it'll definetly get your attention. very effective in 105mm artillery and 40mm grenade rounds.
 
Flechettes are far superior to round balls in regards to maintaining energy once they leave the barrel. Energy loss in flight if related to cross sectional density, and a long thin projectile has the highest cross sectional density. The reverse is true for the acceleration phase, which is why we use sabots to get the cross sectional density down.
 
Interesting. Everything I've heard about flechette use in Vietnam says that they were largely a failure in that they punched numerous small holes through someone that did very little damage whereas buckshot did significantly greater physical damage, caused greater shock, loss of blood, and far faster incapacitation.
 
I bought some of the cheap fletchette shotgun shells from the Dragsonsbreath people and thought them a terrible flop. Surplus fletchettes nested in opposite directions, most of them hit a 15 yard target sideways.

Maybe this outfit does them better.
 
There is nothing to keep flechettes stable in flight. There is nothing to keep them directional (point first) in flight. They have no advantage whatsoever, and lots of drawbacks.
 
There is nothing to keep flechettes stable in flight. There is nothing to keep them directional (point first) in flight. They have no advantage whatsoever, and lots of drawbacks.
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Well a flechette, by definition, is drag stabilized. Assuming they are designed properly, they will point straight.
Think of fletching on a bow and arrow...

No experience in commercial or milsup flechettes though...
 
Surplus fletchettes nested in opposite directions
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That alone will screw up the flight of all of them. The ones pointing rearward, are going to naturally try turning forward, thus disrupting the whole bunch...if they are loaded all facing in the right direction, performance is much better.
 
flecaette loads

depending on whose your useing, their is going to be a lot of screaming until the slug follows.
 
I never spoke with anyone who actually used shotgun flechettes in combat, but I have read enough about them that it sounds like a good idea on paper, but the execution of the idea was poor. The idea was high velocity with small frontal area would make them good for anti-personnel in areas with lots of leaf cover. Artillery flechettes are awesomely effective, but they are relatively heavy and propelled by high explosive in the shell. Shotgun flechettes at shotgun velocities did not have enough mass to either penetrate well or retain velocity well, and a shotgun could not get them going fast enough to overcome this shortcoming.

BTW, the British and French experiment with flechette rifle rounds was designed to overcome assailants in flak vests or light vehicles common at the time, but they were tremendously inaccurate. Regular ball ammo was more effective due to increased accuracy of delivery on target.
 
Flechette shafts frequently get bent by ignition forces.

Never heard anything good about them when fired from a 12 guage shotshell. I question the validity of the report posted by SilentHitz.

If they fly and penetrate true then the surface area of a flechette is very small - poking a small hole.

Cheers!
 
i don,t know about shotgun shells,but a 75mm pack howitzer round at 75-100 yds, takes the worry out of being close.eastbank.
 
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