Administrative Reload

You'll probably go to slide lock.

Most civilans simply empty the gun in the direction of the bad guy. From most of the reports I've read about it (and I don't wanna come off like the toothless sooth on this- but do your own research) most gunfights don't go to a reload.

The things I've gleaned from my years shooting-

Use a charging mag, and "dirty it under" - i.e.- put it at the end of the line of your magazines.

Don't handle loose rounds under pressure unless it's absolutely necessary- use a magazine, stripper clip, speedloader, etc. If you *have to*- (winchester '94, 870, etc- then grab two rounds at a time and use the 2nd round to force the first one in. I liked to leave a gap between each two rounds on a belt slide with cartridge loops for that reason.

Magazines that have been used- even if you just used it as a charging mag- go into the pouch with the "toe" facing to the rear. Full, ready mags go to the front of the line, toe forward.

A defensive pistol is either fully charged and ready in condition 1, or it's empty with hammer down. No half measures. See Archie's post...

My experience with "Tac" reloads is that some guy who designed the course of fire thought it looked cool, not that it's a good idea. My only exception might be the "won't-drop-free-drill": You hit the mag release and the mag (spread lips, Glocks, slide release trapped the mag, etc) won't drop free. Using your fresh mag, strike down at the toe of the spent mag with the heel of the fresh mag, then insert the fresh mag. *My suspicion* is that the guys who came up with IDPA and those goofy reloads just wanted a competitive head start on all the other guys coming over from USPSA who couldn't win either ( ducks behind monitor...)

Press check? I like all of my fingers, especially the index ones. There's lots of alternatives.

Oh, and the watch pocket on jeans? That's for .30-30 ammo....
 
Bluestarlizzard said:
Well... I generally top off any auto for SD, so, yeah, I know I seated the mag and there's a round in the chamber for that.

I, personally, wouldn't be banking on being able to do a press check under a critical situation, so I think I'd rather spend a little extra time ensuring that I can seat a mag under pressure.

Sorry, but I just don't see the merits of press checks.
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No one is saying to press check in a gunfight.... That would be stupid. But it doesn't hurt to do it when you load your gun just to make sure. I'm a visual OCD person. If I don't see the round in there, then I may question it. No, it doesn't make sense when I top off my magazines anyways, but it is how I am.
 
simple fundamental shooting just isn't "kool" enough to some people. They simply must add a dozen ninja maneuvers so that they feel like they are doing something. in addition to that, there are trainers who have the idea that every student must walk away with the feeling that they have learned something more than they knew before - so they incorporate their own specific kabooki dance or maneuver so that you don't feel like your money is wasted. There are only so many ways to perform in a gunfight and all this over manipulations can be a bad thing.
 
I agree with you FireForged.

"What did you learn in self defense school?"

""I learned the 12 point tactical move and stop maneuver. The tap-rack-bang maneuver. The more advanced tap-rack-tilt-bang maneuver. The walking command-fire-admin reload while command maneuver...[blah blah]""

The descriptions I read of the class outline in most SD schools are more complex than the stuff I studied at two copper schools.

I've seen condition 1-2 and 3 referring to 1911 status. I've also seen it referred to holstered-unholstered but not on target-unholstered and on target.

I've seen jam clearing an auto called
slap-rack-tap
tap-rack-bang
tap-rack-tilt-bang
tap-rack-slide-bang
I imagine there's more.

I think we tend to want that. Since you can't really teach judgement. Schools, instead, teach "things with acronyms" or "Things with sayings" (like tap-rack bang or admin reload).

"I guess I got my money's worth. I learned a lot of 'sayings'". I'm quite sure the overwhelming majority of people that take those classes don't go practice them at all.


Sgt Lumpy
 
If you treat every firearm like it is loaded, then you dont need a press check, ever. Most slides lock back when empty, a press check verifies that there is one in the chamber, how many after that who knows?
 
Admin reload...I taught basic pistol courses for many years and still don't understand the purpose / intent of this idea. We only used:

Clearing / unloading
Loading
Reloading
Tactical reload

Regarding reloading vs tac reload, I see advantages to both. I don't favor the idea of ejecting a partially loaded magazine to the ground in the dark where it may go down a street drain, into bushes or whatever but I understand the logic behind the idea of getting the gun topped off as quickly as possible. I also understand the possibility of fumbling the tac reload as I try to juggle to mags in my hand at once. IMO, practicing these procedures gives one the best chance of success...whichever one you choose.
 
I check the condition of every weapon every time, at the moment I take control of it.

Drop the magazine, look at the number of rounds, re-insert it, press check.

Or empty the magazine well, double check that the magazine is empty, open the chamber and look at it.

Every time I take control of a weapon that has been out of my control.

I don't shoot with folks who don't.
 
I do pretty much what Jammer does.

When I take my carry weapon (walther pps) out of the safe, I drop the mag "yep, 7 rounds in the mag", reinsert the mag, press check "yep, round in the chamber), put the weapon in the holster, take the spare mag out of the safe "yep, 7 rounds", put it in my pocket, lock the safe. Every day, every time.

With the PPS it is not necessary to press check, it has a small hole near the breach that allows you to see the brass cartridge in the chamber. but I usually press check anyway out of habbit. Many of my other guns do not have a loaded chamber indicator.
 
I have never lost track of how many rounds I have in a magazine, does that come with practice and training? I don't know how I do it, but I always seem to know exactly how many rounds I have remaining without having to count, or maybe I count without realizing it.

I only press check on initial load or final unload of the weapon, then I don't do it again until I do another initial load or final unload.
 
Every time, because I believe in the Bullet Fairy.
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LOL, I have to get me one of those (LOL.)

I have mixed feels on press checks, the only time I press check is to make sure I have a snap cap in the chamber before dry firing a pistol as well as making sure there is not a loaded round in it. (every time.)

I have had only one AD and that was 45 years ago when cleaning and recharging a Walther PPK. (finger on the trigger problem) Since then I do not keep a loaded round (only a snap cap) in a pistol that goes into the safe and have had no AD's.

When the pistol is taken out it is recharged with a fresh round and a full mag placed in the pistol. All my pistols have loaded chamber indicators so there is never a question of whether it is loaded or not. (and they do work)

Every time you do a press check is an opportunity for an accident to occur. Placing your hand in front of the barrel is not a good thing. That is why I have mixed feelings on doing them when they are not required to make sure the gun is UNLOADED. You are better off to fully rack the slide with the mag out to insure that there is NO round in the chamber and visually check.

If you have mags that are not feeding properly or you are failing to properly seat your mags, then you need to take care of those problems FIRST than to press check your firearm every time.

Stay safe and know your firearm and how it is functioning.
Jim
 
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Every time you do a press check is an opportunity for an accident to occur. Placing your hand in front of the barrel is not a good thing. That is why I have mixed feelings on doing them when they are not required to make sure the gun is UNLOADED. You are better off to fully rack the slide with the mag out to insure that there is NO round in the chamber and visually check.
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Why would you put your and in front of the barrel to do a press check? There are safer ways.
 
Striker1 said:
Every time you do a press check is an opportunity for an accident to occur. Placing your hand in front of the barrel is not a good thing. ...
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Why would you put your and in front of the barrel to do a press check? There are safer ways.
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See post 9, for example.
 
With the weak hand, grasps the slide with the thumb and middle finger on the REAR serrations and the index finger resting on the barrel hood.
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Ah, now we are doing PULL and CHECK otherwise it is impossible to see anything with the hand over the ejector port.

You are better off to fully rack the slide with the mag out to insure that there is NO round in the chamber and visually check
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If you have doubts about if there is a round in your chamber, then I would have doubts about the person caring the weapon! Most people are better than that. Although I can see that happening but that's not really responsible carry. And any time you push or pull the slide, it IS an opportunity for an accident.

Jim
 
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Jim243 said:
Ah, now we are doing PULL and CHECK otherwise it is impossible to see anything with the hand over the ejector port...
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If you carefully read the full description of the process you'll notice that when performing this type of press check the presence of a cartridge in the chamber is confirmed by feel, rather than visually. Various forms of this type of tactile press check are now taught at many schools, including Gunsite. So one can do that type of press check in low light and without diverting one's eyes.
 
I don't press check my Glock. I just lean it to the left and I can SEE the brass cartridge case between the barrel and slide (just a small sliver but that is enough.)

And my J .357 I can see the rims quite clearly. And if need be just open the cylinder and check.

Deaf
 
I have never lost track of how many rounds I have in a magazine, does that come with practice and training? I don't know how I do it, but I always seem to know exactly how many rounds I have remaining without having to count, or maybe I count without realizing it.
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You may well find that laser sharp memory disappearing on you when folks are slinging lead your way.
 
I press check my nightstand gun every couple nights. I do not want to have the night when it goes click and the bad guy does his maniacal laugh and says, "you couldn't tell it had no round in the chamber when you picked it up?" Or that may only happen in the movies. :D I see no reason not to check when it has not been in my possession.
 
You may well find that laser sharp memory disappearing on you when folks are slinging lead your way.
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That is very possible, I have been training and practicing for years, but have yet to get in a gun battle..knock wood. I am accustom to high stress but i am sure it's not gun battle level stress.
 
I've wondered about that since 1975. I've always thought that low light is no time to be wondering about the condition of your weapon.
 
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