A bit of historical consideration: .32 acp - eventually outdated?

A whole lot of .32s have been made here in the last 100 years! Savage, Remington, Colt, and S&W made them. Recently, Keltec, Seecamp, Beretta, Taurus, North American Arms make them.
Where have you been?
 
Beretta Tomcat love...

I'm another fan of the Beretta Tomcat/Alleycat wideslide 3032 pistols. With Winchester silvertip ammo it's a viable pocket gun you can carry nearly year 'round.

Just MHO, but I don't think the .32 ACP is going anywhere real soon...

As a BUG or a pocket gun its reliable and useful.

YMMV.
 
.32 was the issue weapon to Generals until 1974. All those old Bogart movies, he was pointing a .32 Colt at the bad guys. It is "Automatic Colt Pistol". Not much more American than that.
 
The Colt, Remington and Savage were all pre-WWII, the others seem to be fairly low production, most of the 32ACPs I have seen for sale have been GI bringbacks. IMHO the 32ACP is like the 41 Magnum-enjoys enough a following as to make it profitable to make ammunition for, not so much as to make new guns and ammo types that worthwhile.
 
The Colt, Remington and Savage were all pre-WWII,
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That is true. The .32 ACP was far more popular in Europe where pistols were carried more as a badge of authority. Europeans in general had more respect for "authority" than Americans, and large calibre handguns were reserved for the military.

Since WWII, Europeans have become more "westernized" (read: "Americanized") and thus have less respect for the law and authority, necessitating the drift to larger calibre weapons for police.
 
"......RX-79G .......
However, .32 ACP is a semi-rimmed case, which causes far more problems than it solves. We could use a better cartridge, like .32 Super or 7.62x17 to offer a hair more power and better feed characteristics....."

RX-79G, great post. The rim lock problem only occurred with hp 32 ACP ammo since these rounds are generally shorter than standard ball ammo. Kel-Tec has an excellent fix with their "Rim Lock" eliminator kit that really works. Prior to getting these for my P-32, I carried it for several years with a Silvertip in the barrel and top magazine round. The rest of the rounds were ball or fmj.

Seecamp addressed this problem a different way by making their magazines short enough to only accept hp (shorter) rounds. Their are a number of hp rounds that work in the Seecamp, not only Silvertip.

The"better cartridges" that you mentioned have been addressed by NAA with their 25 NAA round (a sort of 32 ACP case without the rim and slightly longer than a stock 32 ACP case/you cannot neck one down) and the 32 NAA which is actually a necked down 380 ACP case. My .25 NAA, Guardian is really a hoot to shoot.

As I mentioned in other posts, I buy these premier guns (Seecamp, Guardian and others) and in a few days finding my self going back to my beloved 6 oz., P-32 Kel-Tec (4 years old and has never failed).

I also have a Beretta model 70 32 ACP as well as a Sig 230 in 32 ACP made for the Japanese police. Really great guns.

Great topic and thanks for all your input.

Trooper Joe
 
Trooper,

What I was getting at was that it would be great to have a cartridge with the size efficiency of .32ACP, but without any feed issues and maybe more power.

With the possible exception of 5.7x28, I think bottle neck rounds for pistols make no sense at all. Pistol velocities are too low to waste mag capacity on fat cases and skinny bullets. For instance, .357 Sig lacks the wounding diameter or .40 or the magazine capacity of 9x23.

Just as 9x23 modernized .38 Super, .32 could use a makeover and some .25ACP sized guns to go with it.
 
"The only reason the .32ACP became dated, prior to the recent development of personal defense ammo, was because modern medicine made it so."

Somehow I doubt anyone ever shot anybody at pistol distances with the expectation of killing them slowly through sepsis (long after their own demise ;))

I suspect its decline was more due to NATO adoption of 9mm post war, coupled with massive subsidy of police/military forces through nation-level spending during the Cold War. Namely, the adoption of the Hi Power by many police units. 9mm was needed in the first place because only cast/FMJ bullets were available at the time and to military-users, so the caliber increase was a distinct advantage. If hollowpoints can be made to reliably expand at 32acp velocities (or if 32acp +P can be explored) I'll bet a portion of that advantage vanishes considering the reduced size/weight/recoil of a 32cal.

But it's also true that we're generally bigger/stronger than previously (or bigger, at least :p) so it's quite possible that "the largest caliber you can manage" has also increased on average.

TCB
 
My KT P32 is a nice, reliable little shooter, but haven't carried it since I bought an LCP.
Another neat little .32 is my North American Guardian - made like a Swiss watch like this one:

32acp_1.jpg
 
Trooper,

What I was getting at was that it would be great to have a cartridge with the size efficiency of .32ACP, but without any feed issues and maybe more power.
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In other words, the 7.65mm French long.
 
Any opposite views?
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My guess is that the smaller calibers are carried much more often and by many more people than gun lore has us believe. The .32 cal in particular is, IMHO, a very popular caliber as judged by the number of guns sold in the caliber and the difficulty in finding ammo.

I suspect the Berettas and Seecamps and Keltecs, etc., will be popular for a long time. Especially as us baby boomers age and seek convenience as we recede from contact with the public due to retirement and lessened activity.
 
I had never given much thought to a 32, other than a wishing for a Smith & Wesson K-32, until I saw a Walther PP in 7.65 at my LGS. My wife was wanting something with less recoil than a small frame 38 due to her arthritus, but in about the same size package.

So the Walther seems to fill the order.



Maybe it's not a powerhouse, but it's better than nothing, or a really nice 38 back home in the safe. Heck, I'm a revolver guy and I really like this thing. I might have to look for another one, or try to convince my wife she really wants something else.
 
Cajun bass, I have a 7.65 Walther also and it sports the same lanyard loop. I have never before seen the square loop so perhaps they were special order for police or military. My pistol does not have anything other than factory markings. Sorry for hijacking the thread.
 
My PP has the same lanyard loop. It shows a NDS cartouche, (German Police), just behind the trigger. Beautifully designed pistol IMHO.

 
Not outdated, just out of fashion, at least in some circles. I would say the 38 S&W is outdated in terms of new production, loads available, etc.
 
My Tomcat spends a lot of time in my back pocket too. It's convenient around the house, especially if I'm working out in the yard or I'm on the tractor. As far as the .32 acp becoming outdated or obsolete when one shows up at any of the pawn shops I frequent it doesn't last long, usually sold within a day or two of being put in the display case.
 
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