litenite99
New member
Im looking for some data on 9mm 147gr berrys rn bullets if any of you have it. Vihta vuori website doesnt list n320 for any sort of plated bullets just hornady xtp.
9mm N320 load data help?
- Thread starter litenite99
- Start date
litenite99
New member
i have a chrono so thats probably the way im going to have to go with this. I just figured it would be worth a shot to see if anyone had any data that they didnt mind sharing.
Absolutely ^^
You're not going to drive a plated 147 in 9mm hard enough to concern yourself with plating breakdown. Just treat it like it's jacketed.
Especially with N320. Simply put, it just burns too darn fast to push a 147 to plating breakdown. By the time you got to that point, you would have much bigger problems than a little copper being laid down in your barrel.
BTW, I like your bullet/powder combo. You should be able to make some really consistent shooters.
Compelled to add on . . .
Thinking about this post got my curiosity going . . .
The reason why you're having trouble finding data is that your bullet/powder combination is awkward. You have a heavy bullet over a fast propellant.
Now I'm not opposed to this. On the contrary. I am no stranger to loading heavy slugs over fast powders. I do it all the time. (Mostly 38 Special)
I don't know what your level of handloading experience is. So pardon me if I'm covering ground you already know. The concern with combining heavy bullets and fast powders is that your pressure curve will be steep. i.e. a small increase powder charge may result in a large increase in pressure. Your "sweet spot" will be narrow.
Furthermore, don't expect to set any velocity records. I went snooping around in some load manuals just to get a feel for velocity vs powder speed for 9mm. I would say that you're probably looking for velocities in about the 800 f/s (and not much more) neighborhood if your gun is a concealable compact; maybe 850-ish if it's a full size. I'm glad you have a chronograph as it will make the process smoother; rather than guessing.
I don't mean to over-state this. But I do want to make sure your approach to this project is with the respect that it's due. I'm on Vihtavuori's site. I see it runs 3.1 to 3.9 grains. Start low and work up - you'll be fine.
The good side of heavy bullets over fast powders is that once you find where they run good, they tend to run really good. Meaning, they'll likely shoot clean, consistent, and accurate.
Thinking about this post got my curiosity going . . .
The reason why you're having trouble finding data is that your bullet/powder combination is awkward. You have a heavy bullet over a fast propellant.
Now I'm not opposed to this. On the contrary. I am no stranger to loading heavy slugs over fast powders. I do it all the time. (Mostly 38 Special)
I don't know what your level of handloading experience is. So pardon me if I'm covering ground you already know. The concern with combining heavy bullets and fast powders is that your pressure curve will be steep. i.e. a small increase powder charge may result in a large increase in pressure. Your "sweet spot" will be narrow.
Furthermore, don't expect to set any velocity records. I went snooping around in some load manuals just to get a feel for velocity vs powder speed for 9mm. I would say that you're probably looking for velocities in about the 800 f/s (and not much more) neighborhood if your gun is a concealable compact; maybe 850-ish if it's a full size. I'm glad you have a chronograph as it will make the process smoother; rather than guessing.
I don't mean to over-state this. But I do want to make sure your approach to this project is with the respect that it's due. I'm on Vihtavuori's site. I see it runs 3.1 to 3.9 grains. Start low and work up - you'll be fine.
The good side of heavy bullets over fast powders is that once you find where they run good, they tend to run really good. Meaning, they'll likely shoot clean, consistent, and accurate.
litenite99
New member
Nick_C_S to clarify my situation i recently started shooting IDPA competitions and i have to load for 125 power factor so thats what this experiment is all about. I started off with n320 and 115gr berrys and moved to 124 now im wanting to try 147s. Im looking for the best (smallest) recoil impulse i can get out of my springfield xd 4" bbl. Last night i loaded up 5 rounds of n320 at 3.1grs. and 5 more at 3.3grs, five more at 3.5grs, five more at 3.7grs, and five at 3.9grs. i just want to be around 880fps which gets me about 129 power factor. the first group that gets me to that velocity with full function of my action i plan to stop right there. Azshooter thanks for the info ill compare to what i get today.
litenite99, Thanks for the clear explanation. You should just make PF with your 4" XD. Of course, do your safety work-up.
Actually, I think your approach is right on target - pun intended. Power Factor requirements for the various shooting sports disciplines, favor heavy bullets, mostly due to the math. It's simply weight x velocity. Rather than actual muzzle energy, which is weight x velocity-squared. Muzzle energy more closely parallels felt recoil (over-simplified, yes, I know) than just straight PF. So yes, let the bullet's weight acquire as much of the factorization as possible. Hope that made sense.
And, you want to use a propellant that is as fast as you can safely make PF - because all else being equal, a slower propellant will yield more "thrust recoil" than a faster one.
So you're right on track. Well played.
Load safe.
Actually, I think your approach is right on target - pun intended. Power Factor requirements for the various shooting sports disciplines, favor heavy bullets, mostly due to the math. It's simply weight x velocity. Rather than actual muzzle energy, which is weight x velocity-squared. Muzzle energy more closely parallels felt recoil (over-simplified, yes, I know) than just straight PF. So yes, let the bullet's weight acquire as much of the factorization as possible. Hope that made sense.
And, you want to use a propellant that is as fast as you can safely make PF - because all else being equal, a slower propellant will yield more "thrust recoil" than a faster one.
So you're right on track. Well played.
Load safe.
litenite99
New member
NICK_C_S that made perfect sense to me. Im still pretty new at handloading i have only been doing it for about a year. I have probably only loaded about 2000 rounds of ammo between my rifles and pistols but i love it. Those 147s had alot better recoil impulse compared to a 115gr. my average with 3.3grs of n320 was 891.6fps with a stdDev of 9.24 and a spread of 25. min was 880fps and max was 905fps, so im happy with that part of it. I guess i need to load up about 100 rounds and check for any accuracy issues.
So you already shot them - great! You're velocities are pleasing (and higher than I expected). I think you've created a winner. Well done.
When you load that batch of 100, I recommend loading them as you would any "regular production" round. i.e. don't hand-weigh every charge. Just load 'em like you've been producing them for years. Then chrono 20 or 30 of them - just to make sure you really are where you think you are.
Gotta love it when your efforts are rewarded.
When you load that batch of 100, I recommend loading them as you would any "regular production" round. i.e. don't hand-weigh every charge. Just load 'em like you've been producing them for years. Then chrono 20 or 30 of them - just to make sure you really are where you think you are.
Gotta love it when your efforts are rewarded.
Here ya go, link to Vitavuori (VV powders) reload data:
http://www.vihtavuori.com/en/handgun-reloading-data
JD
http://www.vihtavuori.com/en/handgun-reloading-data
JD
Just curious, why would you go with a heavy bullet instead of the lighter 115 gn and load to power factor? The 115 would give you less recoil and power factor of 125, which in turn, would give you better second,third, etc shots..
I run IDPA also, and my loads are running 126 PF with 115 gn bullets. SSP class.. 4.5" barrel CZ 9mm
I run IDPA also, and my loads are running 126 PF with 115 gn bullets. SSP class.. 4.5" barrel CZ 9mm
litenite99
New member
xracer98 i originally started out with 115grain berrys bullets. i shot them for my first couple matches obviously people were throwing all kinds of advice around for me, some of which i listened to and some of which i ignored lol. i was told by several guys to try 124 grain bullets that the recoil wasnt so "snappy". so that is what i have been shooting but as is my personality i must experiment a little. as i posted before i loaded up some 147s the other day and took them to the range. they seem to ME like i had more of a push than a snap, but that was only me shooting the 5 test rounds i loaded just to check the velocity. I actually loaded 100 rounds last night and i have several hundred loaded of 115 grain and 124 grain, so i will have a side by side comparison this weekend after i shoot my idpa match. also comparing 115 to 124grain i do seem to be a little more accurate with the 124s im not sure why....
Litenite99, You could also increase your recoil spring to further reduce excessive recoil. Hollow points, tend to be a tad bit more accurate, but for IDPA, your not out for tight grouping so to speak. Just need to maintain "zeros". Speed will come over time.
I can run just fine with factory loads or my loads. The difference is the recoil, and getting a better second shot to stay in the zero. Just need to hit within the 8" circle for zeros, or head shots. If one can control factory ammo, or "hot" ammo consistent, going to a lighter min PF load, you will pick up on speed.
I run Titegroup for my loads, and have been pleased with the results. My chrono numbers do not vary much, even with a lee loader... lol
I can run just fine with factory loads or my loads. The difference is the recoil, and getting a better second shot to stay in the zero. Just need to hit within the 8" circle for zeros, or head shots. If one can control factory ammo, or "hot" ammo consistent, going to a lighter min PF load, you will pick up on speed.
I run Titegroup for my loads, and have been pleased with the results. My chrono numbers do not vary much, even with a lee loader... lol
litenite99
New member
xracer98 i recently picked up some titegroup i have heard alot of good things about it but until recently it has been pretty hard to find locally here. I havent had a chance to mess with it at all yet. If you dont mind sharing your load data i wouldnt mind trying it out.
I'm running 4.2 gn of TG with 115 RN Xtreme bullets with a COL of 1.130"
Attached are my chrono results. From my crimp, I adjust my crimp so that I reduce the diameter 0.0015" after the bullet has been seated. This is measures right at the edge...
** My chrono values are with my CZ-P09 with a 4.5" barrel. The velocity will be lower with a shorter barrel..******
I choose to stick with Titegroup as I also load for 45 ACP and TG works well for me. I have also used Bullseye, Power Pistol, 231 and WST powders, and found, TG to smoke less and be more accurate...
Power Pistol is a good "night time" powder... Lol .. People at the indoor range ask" what was that". when I'm shooting Power Pistol. I call it the flame thrower .
Attached are my chrono results. From my crimp, I adjust my crimp so that I reduce the diameter 0.0015" after the bullet has been seated. This is measures right at the edge...
** My chrono values are with my CZ-P09 with a 4.5" barrel. The velocity will be lower with a shorter barrel..******
I choose to stick with Titegroup as I also load for 45 ACP and TG works well for me. I have also used Bullseye, Power Pistol, 231 and WST powders, and found, TG to smoke less and be more accurate...
Power Pistol is a good "night time" powder... Lol .. People at the indoor range ask" what was that". when I'm shooting Power Pistol. I call it the flame thrower .
Attachments
Last edited:
litenite99
New member
well xracer ill give titegroup a try but that data is barely fast enough to make power factor so i dont how it will do with a 4" barrel but its worth a shot at least. Jmorris i just loaded 100 rounds of n320 at 3.3 grains seated to 1.142 on a winchester primer with a 147gr berrys rn bullet. The 5 test rounds i loaded felt pretty good now its time to verify that i guess.