7.62 x 54r Rifles

The Russians had a healthy respect for Winchester lever action rifles having got cut to pieces by Turkish troops armed with them in the late 1870's. Although the sheer weight of Russian manpower eventually won the Russian casualties were something like 20 to 1.
 
"There were a few Winchester model 1895 rifles built under contract to Czarist Russia in that chambering."

A few? More like most...

Over 300,000 Winchester 95s were made for Imperial Russia between 1915 and 1917, or about 70% of total Model 95 production.

Virtually all save for a few thousand were delivered, making the 7.62x54R probably the least common of all chamberings to find in the West.
 
"I wonder why the Russians didn't use the M1895 in WW2? Seems like the rate of fire would have been much higher than with the bolt action Mosin."

They did use some.

The Soviets even manufactured some new Model 95 clones and supplied them to the Republicans during the Spanish Civil War.

But...

The 95 was time consuming and expensive to make, and the Soviets already had several arsenals set up to manufacture the Moisin-Nagant.

Additionally, the Model 95 was a lot more tedious to care for, and the average Russian conscript (during either war) wasn't known for doing that, and in a lot of cases probably didn't know how to do it.

By the time World War II rolled around, a lot of the Winchester 95s from the first war had either been bled off (apparently a lot were in Finland when the Finns decided to declare independence), and many others were simply unserviceable.
 
"I just checked Gunbroker, SVT-40s have SOARED in price over the years. They are now bringing close to $1800 at auction."

Tell me about it. In the mid 1990s when the last big shipment of them came in they were selling for $300-$400.

I wanted to buy one, but I didn't have a steady job at the time...
 
What is the difference between the VEPR and DRAGUNOV? I have never had the chance to compare them side by side. From what I can see the Drag is a milled receiver and the Vep looks more like a stamped AK thats stretched.
 
The thing that's always hung me up on the Vepr imports is the plastic mags.
Eventually, the rifle will no longer be manufactured- and I've always been leery about the longevity of the plastic mags. I suppose one could stock up on them, but they're not cheap.

The Izhevsk arsenal also made/makes? the Tigr- which is a commercial knock-off of the Dragunov- but I haven't seen new ones for sale commercially. I suspect subject to the import ban?

I'm of the opinion that the 54R ammo isn't going away anytime soon.
We saw the prices up 50% and more during the last "scare"- and guess what- they came back down to under $100 per tin.

It's not a chambering like other milsurps that have gone by the wayside. It's still manufactured by Novosibirsk, and still VERY much in use in around the world by about a dozen countries in MG's like the PKM and it's variants. It is NOT obsolete...
 
For the difference in price to find and buy one of the oddball, imported freaks, you can buy a modern 30/06 and more ammo than the average person will shoot in several years.
 
The difference between the vepr and the svd os a stronger, beefier bolt type, and Molot is known to make fine quality barrels. If you poke around the forums, you'll see folks with stock Molot VEPR's pulling 1.5-2moa, but, it is the internet, but I don't see why not. Ad for stamped or milled, not sure, looks stamped.

If your a collector and want something that's going to a very desired piece one day in your lifetime, find a druganov. But for a shooter, I can only imagaine that a company with a good rep for accurate quality barrels will be a better choice for the range, at about half the price. If only an svd shot as good as they do on call of duty.....

Never thought about the plastic mags, something to think about though. I would probably buy a couple that never got opened, but still as you said, they prob wouldn't be worth a dang a hundred years from now. But I suspect if you really really needed a mag 20 years from now,youll likely be able to quickly scan an original and print one out....unless they ban those evil printers.
 
The main difference between the VEPR and the Dragunov...is that the VEPR has a long piston like the Romanian PSL, and the Dragunov has a shorter piston; that is supposed to contribute too better accuracy for the SVD.

I own a PSL...and it is a beast at the range, but always stick with the light ball 147 grain bullets, which puts less strain on the receiver; and keep that thin barrel from getting to hot or your groups will spread out.

You might be better off buying a Hungarian AES-10 A or B sniper rifle in 7.62x39, because it is less recoiling, and you can get a better cheek weld with the offset Russian rangefinder scope; compared to the wider receiver PSL. I was lucky enough to buy the Iraqi TABUK version before the AK rifle ban came here in Maryland.

The supplied Russian rangefinder scope has no focus adjustment, but I have perfect focus and cheek weld shooting the PSL right handed while aiming with my left eye thru the scope; but I use my right eye while shooting with the irons.
With my AES-10...I shoot right handed and aim with my right eye thru the offset scope, including the irons; while still getting a good cheek weld.
 
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ou might be better off buying a Hungarian AES-10 A or B sniper rifle in 7.62x39, because it is less recoiling, and you can get a better cheek weld with the offset Russian rangefinder scope; compared to the wider receiver PSL. I was lucky enough to buy the Iraqi TABUK version before the AK rifle ban came here in Maryland.
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Not exactly what I was looking for. But, I am trying to gather a healthy collection of Hungarian (My family is from Hungary) made guns. I have never heard of the AES-10 until now. I looked on Gunbroker and found a Romanian. If you know of any please post link or PM link. As I mentioned I have a soft spot for all guns made in Hungary.
 
Our range has a Hungarian diplomat that shoots black powder rifles & pistols. I believe he is a member of the Hungarian black powder team. He is an excellent offhand/standing shooter.

I bought my PSL new for $1,000 --- that came supplied with the standard 4x Russian rangefinder scope and 4 PSL mags. Once you sight-in the irons --- it will be a field check for the zero of the scope --- in case the turret adjustment knobs are accidently moved or the turret screws come loose.
 
I'm sorry, my bad...but it is a Romanian AES-10 A, RPK, not of Hungarian make.

I bought it used for $1,300. You'll find that the MAS 49/56 recoil pad fits perfectly on the RPK's clubfoot stock.
 
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I have read that the 7.62x54R round was a little much for the Winchester M1895, led to action stretching and headspace problems.
 
One of these days I'll get the Winchester 1894 and the Marlin 1895 straight in my mind...
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Actually it was the Winchester 1895 which features a box magazine we were discussing in this thread. The Winchester 1894 utilizes a tubular magazine under the barrel.
 
I have read that the 7.62x54R round was a little much for the Winchester M1895, led to action stretching and headspace problems.
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The Win 95 was also chambered for the .30-06, .405 Win, .30-40Krag, and I think .30-03.

Never heard about any issues, other than expensive, fragile (too much for a military arm), and complex, but then, I'm no expert on the 95.
 
Mike Weber said:
Actually it was the Winchester 1895 which features a box magazine we were discussing in this thread. The Winchester 1894 utilizes a tubular magazine under the barrel.
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I know, but they got mixed up in my addled brain. After 10pm and before 8am brain not work so good. :p
 
Nice rifle, but from my experience they had too many feeding problems. You have to remember, a dollar went a long way years ago. $125 dollars was a weeks pay for a lot of guys. I bought my first deer rifle (Hex receiver M/N) through the mail for about $15 dollars with shipping. Then as others pointed out, the only ammunition available cost as much or more a box than the gun did. I don't know. what did a new Winchester model 70 go for in the mid-60s?
 
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