.451 or .454

Crisco and Toilet Cookies

Wog,

I mix up a one pound can of Crisco with two wax rings. It is far less runny than Thompson's (which I have really come to loath) in the heat of the summer. It is a little stiff when the weather is cold (Or if I happen to shoot in the freezer ;)) but at least it stays where I put it.

It has been a long time since wax rings were made with real beeswax. I think they are primarily parafin. Many think that anything with petroleum in it is sacrilige and I don't dispute that. I just have not seen the negative impact of using this concoction. It does what I want and seems to leave no nasty residue. I run a patch through the barrel about every third round (18 shots).

Up until this seaon I loaded exclusively with the loading lever. Loading levers work and have worked for about a hundred and eighty years. I didn't go to a press because, 1) I didn't see the need since all of my pistol have a loading lever. and 2) No loading press existed which would fit in my shooting box. (No room if I take along enough beer.............Just kidding, I never mix alcohol and gun powder, although I do drink several Guiness Stouts while posting on this forum)

Well, now.....

I came to consider the stress that is placed upon the pistol during the loading process if you use the loading lever. If I calculate the mechanical advantage of the lever and estimate correctly the force applied with the hand, it is about like suspending a 327 Chevy engine block from the arbor. I am not kidding here, I think this stress is quite high. One might be prompted to ask, "If the stress is too high, why do pistols survive thousands of rounds, all of which are loaded with the lever and still maintain a good gap?" To that I say, "I don't know." But not applying the force is better than applying it.

Then I got to work designing a collapsable loading press which was the subject of a thread some months ago. The design is far from perfect but I think it works pretty good. It fits inside a space much smaller than the "Triple P" and with some fidgeting I can load with it fairly quickly. As a footnote, I have developed a new design which is even smaller and works about three times better. I will be posting some photos tomorrow.

So now, I am convinced that a loading press is almost indispensible even if it does fly in the face of history.
 
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Welcome to the asylum, jerryv. Please pardon the other patients, they get excited when a new patient checks in. Read gatofeo's excellent sticky at the top of this forum. From there, you're on your own but it'll be fun!
 
Doc-step away from the Rochester and order a Holley 650 or maybe a Demon-unless you really like tinkering with lost causes.
 
Wog,

Nope,

Crisco shortening in the one pound can. So far this season has been un-naturally cool. No day yet over 80 degrees. I may have to add more Crisco to the mix to thin it down a bit. The recipe is stiff but my primary quarrel with Bore Butter is that is it too thin, too runny.

I also don't like that it smells like my Grandmother (rest her soul) on Sunday morning.

I also don't like that it is so expensive. (When I was shooting long arms low those many years ago, I felt that everything marketted by Thompson Center was more expensive than it needed to be. I developed a minor antipathy toward the company which I have not gotten over yet.)

I also don't like that it comes in tubes and needs to be squeezed out like mayo on a hoagie. Has anyone ever tried squeezing some Bore Butter out the tube only to discover that an air bubble has formed? Then when you squeeze thinking you have a tube solid with Bore Butter the air bubble reaches the nozzle of tube. You get a pop and little droplets of BB all over your shooting table.

I know my recipe does not match some recommendations for pure beeswax and such but it works for me.
 
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Thanks, one thing I'm learning as I get more into BP is to check exactly which "crisco" is being referred to when the name is used!:eek:

As a side note I was in a craft store this weekend & found a block of "substitute beeswax" in the art candles section. Supposedly (according to the label) it is stiffer than candle wax to support forming better. (I guess for those sculptured candles where slices are peeled & sliced like flower petals?) I wonder if that might be handy as a beeswax sub for "other purposes":D
 
WP,

I think the reason most folks like beeswax is that it is not a petroleum based product. I would not assume that is true of this beeswax substitute.

As I said I don't see the detrimental affects from using my recipe but then I don't shoot a lot and I clean often and thoroughly.

I actually never thought of using Crisco oil. Perhaps a paradigm shift is in the offing.
 
thanks for your suggestions and comments.
i have thaken both guns apart cleaned and lubed them. i got 150 .451 lead balls a brass flask with powder in it and about 100 caps with the guns but have not shot them yet. i think its black powder but no idea how old it is.
i have ordered the .454 mold, repair kit, r.h holster(they came with 1 l. h holster), the 1858 new army 5 1/2 barrel .44 cal. revolver and spare cylinder. from Cabelas.

wow!! cap prices! i been reloading and casting for hand guns for several years and thought that sp and lp primers had gotten high at $30 per k. the caps i find are $6.50 - $8.50 per 100. midway shows $47 per k but with a $25 hazmat fee thats no bargin. oh well i guess if you gona dance you gota pay the band.

im a little confused about loading the cyls. first powder then greased wad then greased ball then more grease? powder -ball greased wad? powder- ball then grease? i guess i need a step by step on how much of what and in what order... thanks again.
 
Grease or wad is more of an either-or situation than a belt & suspenders one.
Either: powder, wad, ball, ram repeat. Cap the nipples as a totally separate last step. Or: powder, ball, ram, grease, repeat then cap the nipples.
If you dos both I don't think anything horrible would happen, but it would cost a lot of time & be really messy.:D

A tip I found on here.
Load each chamber completely (except the cap) before going on to the next one. Leave the rammer down when going to the next step in that chamber, it stops the chamber rotating during loading.
 
Load each chamber completely (except the cap) before going on to the next one.
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For me it is much faster to use a BP Revolver Stand. That frees up both my hands to measure and pour powder. I don't pour directly from a flask like some folks do. My routine:

Measure powder, pour in first chamber, push in lubricated wad, rotate cylinder and repeat for remaining chambers. When all chamber have powder and a wad I take the revolver out of the stand and use the revolver's rammer to seat all the balls one right after the other. This way, when you pick up the revolver to put the balls in the powder will not spill out regardless of the angle you hold the revolver. The wad holds the powder in. And, seating the balls is fast because you are doing all 6 one right after the other while the rammer is in your hand. Also, with the revolver in your hands you have maximum leverage based on positioning most comfortable to you.
 
Jerry

a brass flask with powder in it
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Many here will tell you not to load directly from the flask to the chamber. Too much danger of detonation of the flask because of burning embers remaining in the cylinder from the previous shot. Some here have personal knowledge of it happening and apparently (I never saw it) it is not a pretty sight.


I think its black powder but no idea how old it is.
Click to expand...

I recommend not using that powder on strength of the lack of information. It is probably okay but on the odd chance that the previous shooter put smokeless powder in the flask and you then load it into the pistol your addiction could come to a hasty and unpleasent end.

The .451s will probably load easy but IMHO you will be thankful you bought a mold for larger rounds. I find it interesting to measure the diameter of the balls with micrometer or caliper. My guess is that you will see some variation in the size in a run of bullets.
 
I think the reason most folks like beeswax is that it is not a petroleum based product. I would not assume that is true of this beeswax substitute.

As I said I don't see the detrimental affects from using my recipe but then I don't shoot a lot and I clean often and thoroughly.
Click to expand...

Paraffin and vaseline are two petro products that apparently defy the rules. Doc the problem would mostly appear during cleanup. Water has no affect on petroleum lubes and petro solvents don't work on bp fouling. What you end up with is a tarry mess that makes cleaning twice the chore.
 
Hawg

I believe I remember someone talking about a whitish film. Seems like this might be a residual of parafin.

Have you seen this?
 
Never really used it Doc. Just going on hearsay but from several different people. I did try mixing some up once but it didn't mix well for me so I discarded it.
 
I think its black powder but no idea how old it is.
Click to expand...
I recommend not using that powder on strength of the lack of information. It is probably okay but on the odd chance that the previous shooter put smokeless powder in the flask and you then load it into the pistol your addiction could come to a hasty and unpleasent end.
Click to expand...

Very, very good advice. Use the stuff in the flask for fertilizer in the wife's spring flowers (you'll get lots of points) and put some stuff in the flask that is a known pedigree.
 
Jerry - I have absolutely nothing constructive to add t this thread . . . but that's not unusual. :D

Welcome to the board . . . . you'll love it here. The longer you're on . . . the more "certifiable" you'll be as far as going insane like the rest of us! :)
 
thank you very much.
forums like this provide a wealth of information from those that can speak from experience. their advice and suggestions can prevent a lot of mistakes save time and expense. ill be a student here for a while and sure ill have more questions.
oops here is one now. home made wads. someone said they use wool felt but i havent found any thats wool. will anything else work? greased cotton balls?
 
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