.45 Super
- Thread starter sgoeing
- Start date
There are several threads concerning this cartridge on http://www.glocktalk.com and http://www.1911forum.com and maybe even here so try a search. I assume you are talking about converting a 1911 to .45S and are referring to the Ace conversion. I have a Springfield longslide purchased in .45S and a Glock 21 that I shoot in this round. Most threads indicate that all you really need to shoot the round is a heavier recoil spring so spending tons of money is not a good idea. Also, this round is getting harder to find since Triton dropped it. However, they will be introing a new cartridge called the .45 SMC (short magnum cartridge) which will be a direct replacement as I understand it.
George Hill
Staff Alumnus
The .45 Super is great! With a heavier spring, you gan fire it from your current .45 with no further mods.
There is also the .45SMC (Short Magnum Cartridge) made by Triton that is actually a little hotter.
This is the best thing in handgunning for the 1911 fans.
It gives you the big bore that you like and it gives you speed aplenty like all the .355 bore fans are always yappin about.
I have been planning on getting a heavy spring for my Springfield and giving them a run. Only reason I have not done so yet is a total lack of Super or SMC loads from my local shops. Or at least there was the lack last time I looked for Super. I'ld have to order everything and I just keep putting it off... kinda like going to the dentist. I know I need to to it - it just gets bumped from my priority 1 list.
There is also the .45SMC (Short Magnum Cartridge) made by Triton that is actually a little hotter.
This is the best thing in handgunning for the 1911 fans.
It gives you the big bore that you like and it gives you speed aplenty like all the .355 bore fans are always yappin about.
I have been planning on getting a heavy spring for my Springfield and giving them a run. Only reason I have not done so yet is a total lack of Super or SMC loads from my local shops. Or at least there was the lack last time I looked for Super. I'ld have to order everything and I just keep putting it off... kinda like going to the dentist. I know I need to to it - it just gets bumped from my priority 1 list.
Alaska Roy
New member
Uhhhh Guys?
The poster failed to mention which model and make of .45acp he would use? For George Hill, do you have any first hand knowlege of the .45 Super? I noticed you owned? a Detonics, what about the .451 Detonics? IME the .45 Super needs more than a "spring" for a safe and successful conversion. IME the .45 Super borders on uncontrollable in a light weight gun like the Kimber Pro Carry or a Colt Lt. Wt. Commander, Clarks 460 Roland comes with a compensator for control, the .451 Detonics, .45 Super and 460 Roland are ballisically identical with the Roland and Detonics having a slightly longer case. Roy
The poster failed to mention which model and make of .45acp he would use? For George Hill, do you have any first hand knowlege of the .45 Super? I noticed you owned? a Detonics, what about the .451 Detonics? IME the .45 Super needs more than a "spring" for a safe and successful conversion. IME the .45 Super borders on uncontrollable in a light weight gun like the Kimber Pro Carry or a Colt Lt. Wt. Commander, Clarks 460 Roland comes with a compensator for control, the .451 Detonics, .45 Super and 460 Roland are ballisically identical with the Roland and Detonics having a slightly longer case. Roy
Alaska Roy
New member
Howdy! The .45 Super-
The .45 Super is a hand full of horsepower, 230s can run to 1350fps and the popular 185s can go 1500fps and better with enough barrel. The Glocks I've not tried with the Super but in the Kimber which has already had the port opened you could drop a 26LB recoil spring and a HD firing spring, a HD main spring and shorten the firing pin .030 and you'd be good to go! Brass can be made by trimming .45 WM if the Super stuff ain't around..Roy
The .45 Super is a hand full of horsepower, 230s can run to 1350fps and the popular 185s can go 1500fps and better with enough barrel. The Glocks I've not tried with the Super but in the Kimber which has already had the port opened you could drop a 26LB recoil spring and a HD firing spring, a HD main spring and shorten the firing pin .030 and you'd be good to go! Brass can be made by trimming .45 WM if the Super stuff ain't around..Roy
This round has to be hard on the guns. I don't think it's possible to just put a heavier spring in a gun and call it a day. That just doesn't seem right to me. Isn't the .45 super just going to beat the hell out of a 1911 just like the 10mm did? If it's not, why is everyone always warning about 9mm +p and +p+? Just throw a heavier spring in there and all will be fine, right? Is that the theory?
Hmmmmmmm......
I don't know what Alaska Roys preaching about, but all that's "needed" to shoot 45Super in a full size 45ACP handgun is a heavier recoil spring. It seems the "ace-custom-45" website has a few believers when it pushes the "mandatory" super heavy-duty parts. You don't need to buy heavy duty extractors, or super-duper firing pins and stops.
The recoil spring recommended for full size 1911's is 32#!!!!
Let's see, standard is 16# on a govn't model, and the conversion calls for doubling it to 32 pounds ?
This spells trouble for any frame other than carbon steel. Aluminum will show the battering rather quickly, and stainless steel, with it being softer than carbon due to the inability to properly heat treat it, won't be far behind.
The heaviest recoil spring I would put into a 1911 is 24#, ala 10mm.
But,..I sure would like to have a cheap, beater gun to convert to this high powered cartridge. Although, I'd use a comp to tame recoil in order to use a lower power recoil spring.
What would be nice is a "street-comped" 1911 in 45Super.
I don't know what Alaska Roys preaching about, but all that's "needed" to shoot 45Super in a full size 45ACP handgun is a heavier recoil spring. It seems the "ace-custom-45" website has a few believers when it pushes the "mandatory" super heavy-duty parts. You don't need to buy heavy duty extractors, or super-duper firing pins and stops.
The recoil spring recommended for full size 1911's is 32#!!!!
Let's see, standard is 16# on a govn't model, and the conversion calls for doubling it to 32 pounds ?
This spells trouble for any frame other than carbon steel. Aluminum will show the battering rather quickly, and stainless steel, with it being softer than carbon due to the inability to properly heat treat it, won't be far behind.
The heaviest recoil spring I would put into a 1911 is 24#, ala 10mm.
But,..I sure would like to have a cheap, beater gun to convert to this high powered cartridge. Although, I'd use a comp to tame recoil in order to use a lower power recoil spring.
What would be nice is a "street-comped" 1911 in 45Super.
Alaska Roy
New member
Preaching???????
Just passing along my personal experience here guys, hadn't intended a pissing contest here at all. Where to start here, if you fail to modify the firing pin and use the HD firing pin spring a very real possibility of inertia fire arises. Second, the heavier main spring/hammer spring will help slow slide speed without the 32 lb spring? Hmm, new one one me, thought they just went to 30 on the big LARs? Maybe I learned sumpin? As far a stainless being soft? Ruger now has some special breed for the 454 casull and the 17-4 used in the legendary Freedom Arms is awful tough! That said, I've been running hand loaded Supers through an 80s Colt Combat Elite since it was new using Dean Grennels old hot loads until AA-7 came out. BTW Dean, what is that gun pictured? I'd like to find a high effecincy short comp. for the Pro Carry? Thanks, Roy
Just passing along my personal experience here guys, hadn't intended a pissing contest here at all. Where to start here, if you fail to modify the firing pin and use the HD firing pin spring a very real possibility of inertia fire arises. Second, the heavier main spring/hammer spring will help slow slide speed without the 32 lb spring? Hmm, new one one me, thought they just went to 30 on the big LARs? Maybe I learned sumpin? As far a stainless being soft? Ruger now has some special breed for the 454 casull and the 17-4 used in the legendary Freedom Arms is awful tough! That said, I've been running hand loaded Supers through an 80s Colt Combat Elite since it was new using Dean Grennels old hot loads until AA-7 came out. BTW Dean, what is that gun pictured? I'd like to find a high effecincy short comp. for the Pro Carry? Thanks, Roy
A couple of questions for y'all if you don't mind.
"...if you fail to modify the firing pin and use the HD firing pin spring a very real possibility of inertia fire arises."
Could you elaborate on this? I hate to show my ignorance, but I don't really understand this.
If a person were going to convert a Colt 1991A1 to SMC or Rowland would either the blue or stainless be a better choice? Or does it really matter? Opinions?
I have no personal experience with the Super, SMC or Rowland, but from the claimed ballistic info that is available it appears that Cor-Bons +P's put the 45 ACP in the same catagory (energy wise) as a .357, the SMC bumps this up to .41 mag territory and the .460 Rowland on up to .44 Mag territory. The Rowland looks like quite a thumper.
"...if you fail to modify the firing pin and use the HD firing pin spring a very real possibility of inertia fire arises."
Could you elaborate on this? I hate to show my ignorance, but I don't really understand this.
If a person were going to convert a Colt 1991A1 to SMC or Rowland would either the blue or stainless be a better choice? Or does it really matter? Opinions?
I have no personal experience with the Super, SMC or Rowland, but from the claimed ballistic info that is available it appears that Cor-Bons +P's put the 45 ACP in the same catagory (energy wise) as a .357, the SMC bumps this up to .41 mag territory and the .460 Rowland on up to .44 Mag territory. The Rowland looks like quite a thumper.
45 Super in a Ruger P90
I've been shooting 45 Super in a Ruger P90 for about 6 months. I worked up slowly from +P loads (230 g. 950 fps) to full power (230 g. 1150 fps). I've changed the recoil spring, firing pin spring and mag springs. The recoil is a bit stout. I've backed off to 230 g at 1050 fps until my SPRINCO recoil reducer comes. No signs of frame wear or battering yet, and when the recoil reducer comes in the round should be no more punishing to the gun than standard hardball. Of course the Ruger was originally designed around the 10 mm....
I've been shooting 45 Super in a Ruger P90 for about 6 months. I worked up slowly from +P loads (230 g. 950 fps) to full power (230 g. 1150 fps). I've changed the recoil spring, firing pin spring and mag springs. The recoil is a bit stout. I've backed off to 230 g at 1050 fps until my SPRINCO recoil reducer comes. No signs of frame wear or battering yet, and when the recoil reducer comes in the round should be no more punishing to the gun than standard hardball. Of course the Ruger was originally designed around the 10 mm....
I've done a fair amount of work with the .45 Super in my Stainless GM. The GM had all the usual mods done BEFORE I tried the .45 Super. The only specific .45 Super modification that I did were a 32# recoil spring, (Which Wolff recommends.) the included HD firing pin spring, and a recoil buffer. Other than load development, I don't make a regular practice of firing full house .45 Super loads in the gun. Any more than I fire only full house magnum loads, exclusively, in my revolvers. I carry it as backup while hunting wild boar here in the green hills of East Tennessee. The gun, which is used weekly for IDPA/USPSA shooting, is none the worse for the ware.
Yr. Obt. Svnt.
Yr. Obt. Svnt.
Sorry for my abrasiveness....
I don't understand the "inertial fire" thing either. Why would you have to modify the firing pin when using a HD spring?
Heck, the heavier spring is what keeps the firing pin in place when the slide slams home using heavier recoil springs.
I do agree with the heavier mainspring lessening the duty of the recoilspring, alowing a less than 32# spring. I asked about this before, the concensous was that it wouldn't do that much. Maybe allowing the use of a 28-30# recoil spring.
Another mod I considered was the EGW square profile firing pin stop. Instead of the stock rounded stop, the square stop will contact the face of the hammer lower on the slides rearward travel. The lower the contact on the face of the hammer the less leverage to overcome the mainspring, thus the slide slows down, or doesn't "unlock" as fast, allowing those high (28,000psi) 45Super pressures to subside.
Or you could just throw a 32# recoil spring in and boom some rounds off.
Like Pampers said, I wouldn't shoot a lot of these in your Govn't model, even with the added mods.
Alaska, the gun is a Bul Transmark. http://www.bultransmark.com/
I don't understand the "inertial fire" thing either. Why would you have to modify the firing pin when using a HD spring?
Heck, the heavier spring is what keeps the firing pin in place when the slide slams home using heavier recoil springs.
I do agree with the heavier mainspring lessening the duty of the recoilspring, alowing a less than 32# spring. I asked about this before, the concensous was that it wouldn't do that much. Maybe allowing the use of a 28-30# recoil spring.
Another mod I considered was the EGW square profile firing pin stop. Instead of the stock rounded stop, the square stop will contact the face of the hammer lower on the slides rearward travel. The lower the contact on the face of the hammer the less leverage to overcome the mainspring, thus the slide slows down, or doesn't "unlock" as fast, allowing those high (28,000psi) 45Super pressures to subside.
Or you could just throw a 32# recoil spring in and boom some rounds off.
Like Pampers said, I wouldn't shoot a lot of these in your Govn't model, even with the added mods.
Alaska, the gun is a Bul Transmark. http://www.bultransmark.com/
WalterGAII
Moderator
A friend of mine and I are shooting .45 Supers out of threaded, compensated, Accu-Match barrels through G21's. No big deal, with a 22# spring. I'm about to load up some this afternoon. (Of course, you don't have to worry about an inertia slamfire with the Glock)
Calcitanium
New member
As has already been hinted at (and I'm not an expert by any means, have never even seen a .45 Super cartridge) this is not for compact handguns.
I've heard that a full-size USP is the only .45 which can handle the Super w/o modifications. But don't try this with a USP Compact.
I've heard that a full-size USP is the only .45 which can handle the Super w/o modifications. But don't try this with a USP Compact.
I think that the USPf would still need a heavier recoil spring to fire the Super or SMC. That is from the info I gathered on hkpro.com. A spring on the order of 23-25# was said to do the trick. I love my USP, but have no idea how to get that #%$#!@% recoil spring out without damaging the c-clip.
Calcitanium
New member
Ok, well I was just going on what I read on HKpro and elsewhere. I did a quick search over there now and I found one recent comment saying the manufacturer recommended not using .45 Super in a stock USP full size, because it beats up the gun. There are a number of people saying it's ok -- as least one quoting the mfgr, from 5 months ago.
I see a recommendation for changing the USPf spring every 3,000 rounds w/.45 Super.
I see a recommendation for changing the USPf spring every 3,000 rounds w/.45 Super.