.44 Magnum effects on people?

E

Edmund Rowe

New member
Anyone ever seen what happened if a bad guy was actually shot with a .44 Magnum?

Details such as bullet type, handgun type
(or even carbine type), situation, and was the perp in "fight mode" are appreciated.

I know someone who's convinced his Desert Eagle .44 Mag is the ultimate in defensive hardware and he'll only need one shot to put a bad guy down. Now I know that attitude is BS and everyone else does, I'm sure. Any info on real shootings would maybe help bring this guy back to reality.

I personally think the Dirty Harry movies have created a great myth of the .44 magnum's effectiveness. While it IS a powerful handgun round, it isn't a magic death ray, either.

Please, no Marshall and Sanow stats.

Edmund
 
Like with any caliber a lot depends on shot placement.

For the 44 magnum, though, penetration should not be an issue, just whether the bullet hits a vital organ.
 
The .44 mag is a proven man-stopper with high foot-pounds of energy and stopping power. However, I'm a believer in the double-tap... I would never shoot once expecting 1 round to do it.

The PRIMARY issue is accuracy. Can your friend CONSISTENTLY hit where he needs to with the .44? If so, 'nuff said.

A .44 mag round hitting non-vital tissue isn't as good of a man-stopper as a .38 delivered where it counts.

The bottom line is that should you use a weapon that is you can shoot accuratly and consistently. I would recommend something bigger than a .38, but an adequate round delivered in the "X" ring of a "BG" is what is important

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Stand against evil, lest evil have its way...
 
A 44 mag is also overkill.. and over penetration and overwieghtand over flash and over over over everything. I carry my 44 when elk hunting with a 240 grain soft point bullet.. when I NEED to shoot through a foot and a half of elk I can... but really 24 inches is way too much penetration in a "defensive" round.

And I think the front sight of 44 magnums has injured more people than the lead flying out of the other end. ;)

Dr.Rob
 
I would really like to see what a 180gr round doing 1800fps would do though. I can't imagine a more destructive bullet.

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Don't trust anything that bleeds for 5 days and doesn't die.
 
corbon makes a defensive round for the 44 mag that is 165 gr at around 620 ft/lbs energy - essentially a loaded down round.
 
That's just silly, Robert. I guess rifles and shotguns are out then.


The .44 Mag is not the ultimate, I believe because it is SO slow and uncontrollable.
I think that bigger is better, and guns like the 10mm, .45 Super, 400 Corbon and such are very controllable and quick, but powerful. I just haven't seen a platform in a .44 Mag that is carryable, controllable and quick.


Anyway, to answer your question, Ed:
Chuck Taylor has a picture of a .44 Mag in his book "Combat Handgunnery". The exact bullet shown was recovered after it had shot through a man's chest. The large hollowpoint was not expanded, even at the tremendous velocity it was travelling at (lesson taught: hollowpoint expansion is NOT dependable, no matter how aggressive the hollowpoint, and no matter how fast the bullet.). The man shot merely complained loudly that he had been shot in the chest and requested an ambulance.

No, no handgun bullet is the ultimate, one must weigh controllabilty with power and get a round that they personally can shoot fast and accurate but deliver lots of power. For some, like me, the 10mm is a pussycat and I can shoot a .45 Super very fast and accurate, as well as carry it in a reasonably small platform.
 
Hey, Red Bull, you forgot one. :)

The 41 Magnum!

The ultimate defensive cartridge

There is no advantage shooting 10mm and 45 Super from a small platform. Both use slower burning powders that require longer barrel lengths in order to maximize the cartridges effectiveness. Example, high velocity 10mm (180gr) uses accurate #9 or IMR800X powders in order to get the 1250/1300fps required to attain the 600 foot lbs of energy out the barrel. Both powders burn slow. With a small popper, you are still sitting at about 500(+/-) foot lbs at the barrel.

Robert

[This message has been edited by Robert the41MagFan (edited November 24, 1999).]
 
An LFI instructor whose name escapes me (Might have been MR Ayoob himself) wrote of a 240gr/44mag fired close range at a BG's face. The BG still managed to crawl over 100feet before meeting his maker. Anyone else heard of this incident? It was supposed to be instructional news around LFI & elsewhere about the danger of counting on a "wonder bullet". Must they shatter all my illusions? I hope I don't hear about a BG taking six .44 MAG bullets COM and still whistling Dixie, like all the horror stories we're told at bedtime about 9mm being pea shooters or some PCP freak taking twenty plus rounds of .38 and laughing it off. Depressing...but I rather suspect those are the exceptions.
 
I recall reading an article in one of the gun rags about the .44mag for defense. I believe that the basic criticism, beyond the obvious recoil questions, was bullet design. Most of the bullets were thought to overpenetrate and not expand much in a human target.

I also recall Colonel Askins story of hunting in VietNam and stumbling onto a VietCong. He said the .44mag knocked the man off his feet but that since he only had time to fire one handed if he'd missed he would have been eating AK bullets.

My opinion would be that a properly designed bullet launched from a .44mag should be very effective on a human target.
Does anyone make defensive ammo specifically for the .44mag?
 
44 mag. is deadly. No need for special "defensive" ammo. Hard cast bullet will kill w/o second thought. Whatever was shown in previous posts in regard to some cases of "failing", is an exception.

Of course, it's a must to practice with
44 mag. gun in order to shoot it with
confidence and accuracy.

I shot 44 mag. revolver a few times but do not own one. Too noisy and kicky...But it
got real power.
 
A point on the 44 mag.Recoil is too much for fast recovery and fast double taps.
The only shooting I know of was in the Prescott AZ area about 10 years ago.I know a couple of the people involved so I know this is not bull.5 people in a shootout.One hot with a 44 mag.The slug hit him in the ribs followed them around to his back and exited.He wasn't happy but not that badly hurt.By the way one killed(22 rifle by a lady at about 75 yards)and one very badly hurt.A 380 in the stomack.I draw no conclusions from all this,I will let all of you do that.Have fun
Bob
 
The .44 is not practical for carry. The guns, especialy the Desert Eagle are too heavy and bulky. I consider my .44 Desert Eagle excellent for plinking, target shooting, or hunting, but not suitable for carry or defense. The only gun that came close was the Smith & Wesson mountaineer- which was a slimmed down short barrel model 29 (if I recall correctly).

Perhaps the "perfect" .44 magnum self-defense round would be the MagSafe 115gr. Defender loading or Glaser 135 gr. loading.
In theory, these rounds should be devastating. Unfortunately, both of these rounds are unproven except for the Strasboug testing, which the validity is being questioned. Anybody done their own informal testing on these rounds?

Hmmm, I may have to consider spending $20.00 a 6-pack for testing purposes.....Anyone want to provide funding? One MILLION dollars should cover the cost of ammo!


[This message has been edited by RCH (edited November 24, 1999).]
 
Standing "NEXT" to a .44 mag at the shooting range almost kills me. I couldnt imagine being shot by 1.

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TIM : )
 
I tried the Glaser Blue tips in my M629 Mountain Gun a few years back. The bullets impacted the target sideways. Recoil was nil, but muzzle blast had to be felt to be believed.

I do routinely keep/carry my Mountain Gun for serious purposes. I carry the 200 grain Speer GD loads. (44 Special)

Giz
 
Shooting the 44mag at high noon on a sunny day can produce pretty good muzzle flash. I would imagine shooting it at night would leave one blind for about ten minutes. But I guess the BG would be blind too, plus he would probably have his eyebrows singed off. :)
 
I've no experience shooting people with a .44 or anything else, THANK GOD! (And it is Thanksgiving.)

I have shot a couple of mountain lions, some coyotes, a fox, and I don't remember what else.

A great deal of the effect depends on the load used (DUH!, I know). The .44 Mag is regularly loaded in 300 gr. bullets on down the line to the very light frangibles with all kinds of velocities imaginable.

A 180 gr. JHP, such as the Sierra or Federal is a screamer at around 1600 fps (as I understand the specs call for in Fed's factory loading). It should "open up" real well ,especially before the relatively light bullet starts shedding velocity, as it will rapidly. It should do that. But I shot a very hungry fox when coyote calling a few years back which ignored my arm waving and verbal orders to "back off!" It even advanced a step or two after a "warning shot" was fired over its head (okay, I missed his noggin!). I shot the fox in the chest at about 10 feet. Complete penetration end-to-end and no expansion apparent from the exit hole.

A fox isn't a human, but, at that velocity and with a lightly constructed bullet, and by that I mean designed to expand, I'd have expected more of an exit hole. The fox wasn't blown backward off his feet and neither will anything else be--Shoot an object which will "absorb all the energy" of the bullet by stopping it inside the target to test this for yourself. A target of a couple of pounds won't be blown into the next county, as it should be if the round is capable of "blowing a man off his feet." It defies both testing and logic to say that. All animals and humans are more or less reactive to stimuli from without. It's very probable that some live thing "knocked backward" was reacting to being hit as a tense or "high-strung" living thing might.

I once put in a finishing shot on a downed but alert whitetail doe with a .243 and a 100 gr. bullet from very close range. I hit her in the brain, the bullet didn't exit. Her head instantly dropped to the ground and she then began to flop like a fish, though very dead as far as I could tell. Very interesting. There were about five complete flops, end over end, as I recall.

I won't bore you with other hunting stories, but the .44 Mag, like any other handgun (or rifle) round isn't a "death ray." If the load is tailored to the job expected, it can be very efficient, but there are many variables.

P.S. The penetration of some of the non-expanding bullets at high velocity has to be seen to be believed.
 
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