44 mag shot loads
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FrankenMauser
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In my experience, it is more dependent upon the components being used.
In my .444 Marlins, for example, #7.2 to #9 shot does best with a standard .410 plastic wad with a thin over-shot card. But, #4 to #6 shot does best with 3/4" of fiber cushion wads and a thick over-shot card.
Both loads perform far better (in 19.5" and 22" barrels) than anything I've been able to put together in .44 Mag. The loads are predictable enough and remain tight enough that I have even taken the 19.5" (Marlin) and 22" (H&R) to clay pigeon shoots. On clays, they were good to about 30 yards (amazingly).
However, there were some definite "failures" in the testing phase, where the rifle barrel (22" used for testing) produced horrendous patterns - sometimes five to six foot diameter donuts at just 15 feet.
I discussed some of what I've found with .44 Mag, above. So there's no point in covering that again. I bring it up mainly because that post was quite long, and I wouldn't blame anyone for skipping over parts of it.
Edit: fixed barrel length.
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FrankenMauser
New member
Same here. ...At least for .44 Mag, and regardless of whether I was using standard .44 Mag brass or modified .303/.30-40 brass.Salmoneye said:
My .44 Mag is a 1:20" twist.Will-j said:
My loads have also been tested in a 1:18.75" twist .44 Mag barrel.
The H&R .444 Marlin is a 1:20" twist. (22" 'Ballard')
The Marlin .444 Marlin is a 1:20" twist. (19.5" REM 'Ballard')
So, in my testing, twist rate and groove depth were essentially constants.
I do have access to a 1:38" twist (Micro-Groove) .444 Marlin that used to be in my possession, but I can't remember if it was the 1:38" or the 1:20" .444 barrel that I tested at 22". (The Ballard barrel got chopped and the Micro-Groove got sold.)
...But I don't know that the current owner cares to try the shot shells.
(Note: I had the barrel length wrong for my H&R, in previous posts. I'll fix it after posting this. ...Not that it's critical.)
I could be wrong but,.......well...I thought I was wrong once....But I wasn't...I was only mistaken; But....if I recomember correctly, any Micro Groove barrel is a 38" twist 24"er, and the 22"ers appeared on scene with the Ballard rifling. 'Course, I could be wrong but.....
Anyhow, an ex-IL's early model with MG barrel gave tighter patterns than my Ballard rifled New Model by better'n 50% +/-. Just sayin'
WiLl.
Anyhow, an ex-IL's early model with MG barrel gave tighter patterns than my Ballard rifled New Model by better'n 50% +/-. Just sayin'
WiLl.
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FrankenMauser
New member
All Micro-Groove Model 444 barrels were 1:38" twist, and all 'Ballard-rifled' Model 444 barrels are 1:20" twist. That is correct.
As for barrel lengths...
22" has been the standard barrel length for Marlin Model 444s since 1972.
1964-1971 rifles had 23.5" barrels (MG 1:38").
The few 1963 rifles that left the factory (mostly test rifles that then got sold), and a handful of early 1964 rifles, used rechambered .44 Magnum barrels, and were marked "336-444 Magnum" with several barrel lengths, from 18" to 24". They're uncommon, non-standard, and I don't include them in typical discussions - other than to mention that they're out there. There were all MG 1:38" barrels.
Some later special models, such as the Centennial, were offered with 23.5" barrels (MG 1:38"). There were also the XLRs which had 23.5" barrels. The only outlying oddity was the 18" ported barrel on the 444P ("Outfitter" ... sometimes found without the porting). Both the XLRs and 444Ps were only offered after 1998, so they're all 'Ballard-rifled' (1:20").
Aside from special models, 22" was the standard from 1972 until 2012.
The 'Ballard' barrels (1:20") were introduced - across most of the 336 family - in 1998, in order to quell customer complaints about cast bullets performing very poorly in .35 Remingon, .444 Marlin, and .45-70.
As for how that all applies to the common models (aside from replacement barrels)...
All original Model 444 barrels were 23.5" MG. (1964-1971)
All 444S barrels were 22" MG. (1972-1983)
--Cross-bolt safety added for 1984, and an additional 'S' added to the model name.--
All pre-1998 Model 444SS barrels were 22" MG. (1984-1997)
Almost all post-1997 Model 444SS barrels were 22" 'Ballard'.(1998-2011 -- A few 22" MG barrels were used in 1998.)
All 444 XLR barrels were 23.5" 'Ballard'.
All 444P barrels were 18" 'Ballard'.
The only known 444G (a mis-stamped Outfitter) is an 18" 'Ballard'.
All newer Model 444 barrels (no 'S's, post-move, ~April, 2011) were 22" 'Ballard' and massively inconsistent in nearly every way. (2011-2012)
When Remington resumes production of the Model 444 (no 'S's), they will again be using 22" 'Ballard' barrels (1:20").
I hope that clears things up...
**(I ignore Marlin's ongoing attempts at convincing customers that their rifles actually have 18.5", 20", 21.5", 22.5", or 24" barrels, because the hood that extends into the action is not included in LEGAL measurements of barrel length. As such, it's a lie, in my opinion. The legal barrel lengths of Marlins lever guns are about 1/2" shorter than advertised. -Depending upon model, year, production batch, and variant.)
As for barrel lengths...
22" has been the standard barrel length for Marlin Model 444s since 1972.
1964-1971 rifles had 23.5" barrels (MG 1:38").
The few 1963 rifles that left the factory (mostly test rifles that then got sold), and a handful of early 1964 rifles, used rechambered .44 Magnum barrels, and were marked "336-444 Magnum" with several barrel lengths, from 18" to 24". They're uncommon, non-standard, and I don't include them in typical discussions - other than to mention that they're out there. There were all MG 1:38" barrels.
Some later special models, such as the Centennial, were offered with 23.5" barrels (MG 1:38"). There were also the XLRs which had 23.5" barrels. The only outlying oddity was the 18" ported barrel on the 444P ("Outfitter" ... sometimes found without the porting). Both the XLRs and 444Ps were only offered after 1998, so they're all 'Ballard-rifled' (1:20").
Aside from special models, 22" was the standard from 1972 until 2012.
The 'Ballard' barrels (1:20") were introduced - across most of the 336 family - in 1998, in order to quell customer complaints about cast bullets performing very poorly in .35 Remingon, .444 Marlin, and .45-70.
As for how that all applies to the common models (aside from replacement barrels)...
All original Model 444 barrels were 23.5" MG. (1964-1971)
All 444S barrels were 22" MG. (1972-1983)
--Cross-bolt safety added for 1984, and an additional 'S' added to the model name.--
All pre-1998 Model 444SS barrels were 22" MG. (1984-1997)
Almost all post-1997 Model 444SS barrels were 22" 'Ballard'.(1998-2011 -- A few 22" MG barrels were used in 1998.)
All 444 XLR barrels were 23.5" 'Ballard'.
All 444P barrels were 18" 'Ballard'.
The only known 444G (a mis-stamped Outfitter) is an 18" 'Ballard'.
All newer Model 444 barrels (no 'S's, post-move, ~April, 2011) were 22" 'Ballard' and massively inconsistent in nearly every way. (2011-2012)
When Remington resumes production of the Model 444 (no 'S's), they will again be using 22" 'Ballard' barrels (1:20").
I hope that clears things up...
**(I ignore Marlin's ongoing attempts at convincing customers that their rifles actually have 18.5", 20", 21.5", 22.5", or 24" barrels, because the hood that extends into the action is not included in LEGAL measurements of barrel length. As such, it's a lie, in my opinion. The legal barrel lengths of Marlins lever guns are about 1/2" shorter than advertised. -Depending upon model, year, production batch, and variant.)
This may sound crude and probably is but I had a skunk get into my attic and after setting a trap and caught him during the night I decided to get him out in the morning but by then he figured out how to escape. I reset the trap but he was too smart for that. I then built a setup that used my Ruger Super Blackhawk (very light trigger) to fire when the skunk took a piece of chicken bait. I worked up a shot load because I didn't want to blow a hole in my roof with a 240 gr bullet.
I cut up pieces of lead solder for shot. My second workup load was just perfect but the first too powerful. During the next night the gun went off and blew the skunk under about 3 feet of insulation. The whole house stunk and I went to the store and bought about a dozen air fresheners.
I cut up pieces of lead solder for shot. My second workup load was just perfect but the first too powerful. During the next night the gun went off and blew the skunk under about 3 feet of insulation. The whole house stunk and I went to the store and bought about a dozen air fresheners.