.44 mag and rifle powder

If you still have that reloading manual, could you post a scan of the page?

If I believe QuickLoad:

20gr / IMR4831 is 100% case fill under a 240gr jacketed bullet
20" barrel / 7,633psi / 875fps / ... and only 25% burn

27gr is 13% compressed (I'm not sure that wouldn't distort the case) for 30% burn, 10,500psi, and 990fps.
 
BTW: (Followup from post OpCit)
Top 5 powders for a 20" rifle 240gr jacketed, staying at/under 35,000psi and/at under 100% case fill:

1,918fps Hodgdon Lil'Gun
1,886fps Winchester 296
1,858fps Rottweil R910
1,850fps Hodgdon H110
1,812fps Ramshot Enforcer

(Interesting note: Difference between identical powders (w296/H110) comes from bomb tests of two different lots)
 
Last edited:
I like a 200 gr Hornady XTP with 26.5 gr of H110. Cycles best in my lever gun. I would not shoot this in my Tauras Tracker handgun.
 
IMR 44 mag rifle data,,1990

not sure what I am doing here....

mehavey If you still have that reloading manual, could you post a scan of the page?


It's on page 50

http://pdf.textfiles.com/manuals/FIREARMS/imr_reloading.pdf

44 REMINGTON MAG.
REM. CASE; REM. 2 1/2 PR
REM. 240 GR. SP
.430" DIA.; 22" BBL; 1.610" C.O.L.
SR 4759 21.0C 1630 38500
IMR 4227 23.5C 1680 39500
IMR 4198 25.5C 1515 26400
IMR 3031 27.0C 1190 18900
IMR 4064 27.5C 1145 16600
IMR 4895 28.0C 1225 18300
IMR 4320 28.5C 1200 20900
IMR 4350 27.0C 850 13900
IMR 4831 27.0C 720 12500


:)
 
I stand amazed. :eek:

4831 is a relatively slow rifle powder -- even by rifle standards.
For it to appear in a published manual for a pistol cartridge....
Well.... :rolleyes:
 
I stand amazed.

4831 is a relatively slow rifle powder -- even by rifle standards.
For it to appear in a published manual for a pistol cartridge....
Well....

Ditto. Just for curiosity, I filled a .44 Mag case to the case mouth with 4831 - it can hold about 38 grains. Same for 4350. (NOTE: Those are NOT recommended safe loads, just in case someone reading this figures out how to get a bullet seated with a case full of powder).

With the recommended charge of 27 gr, the powder is about .3 inches below the case mouth, and the 240 gr LSWCs I happened to have nearby measure about .4 inches below the crimp groove, so the load would indeed be compressed. I suspect both loads, and many of the others in that table, are based more on the volume of the powder, i.e., the maximum charge that still allows a bullet to be seated, rather than the more-typical peak pressure considerations.

So, apparently it can be done, but why anyone would want to do it is a mystery to me.
 
I tried it....same rifle. Just to entertain myself and experience it firsthand. Anything slower than 4198, say....4064 or slower, its gonna give you this pathetic "PLUNK". Think of a cross between a .22l.r and a staple gun. I had no squib projectiles that day....but felt I easily could have. Black soot....smoke....unburned powder. All the muzzle energy of a pellet gun. I knew all this....buuuut...wanted to see for myself. Know I did this one round at a time, and rammed out the barrel each time. Yay! Messin around.
 
Well I suppose you could fully load the case with IMR 4831, and get a maximum velocity of 720 fps out of a 22 inch barrel.

Most of this old data got dumped once ammunition companies dumped copper pressure testing. I called Alliant, Hercules just to have some sort of a rifle/pistol load with all their powders. Then they stopped. It is my recollection they had Blue Dot loads in rifle calibers. Anyway, that was the point of discussion, Blue Dot loads in rifle calibers. Alliant told me that with the piezo electric test equipment they are able to look at the pressure curve in real time and are able to see irregularities, scary pressure curve slopes, etc. You did not see this with crushers. The scary pressure curve slope was directly related to Blue Dot in rifle calibers: small changes in anything made huge changes in pressure. There is a promoter named Seaforth who popularized Blue Dot loads in rifle calibers, and occasionally, someone blows up their rifle with his recommendations. It is all due to the unpredictability of the powder in the application. The shooters who blew up their rifles think they double charged the load, and they could have, but their blowups could be due to using an inappropriate powder and load combination.

So, that was when I found that Alliant had dumped a lot of old data, and was now, only recommending powder/charge/cartridge combinations that made sense, and were safe on the pressure barrel.

So, I think this is what has happened with these IMR powder combinations. Does anyone want 720 fps loads out of their 44 Magnum rifle? Not me. Are rifle powders the best way to have 720 fps loads, don't know, but it sure would be the most expensive.
 
attachment.php

100 yards Ruger carbine with Marlin barrel 44 mag 4x scope 240 gr JHP 24 gr H110 roll crimp

Yes.
One can use Bullseye or 4895 in a 45/70 at 100 yards and never know the difference.
But in a 44mag, we most often want to make efficient use of the volume.
 

Attachments

  • 44 mag 100 yards.JPG
    44 mag 100 yards.JPG
    32.1 KB · Views: 453
The appropriate burn rate of powders has more to do with bullet sectional density than barrel length. Pistols need fast burning powders because they typically shoot large caliber but light weight bullets, not because they have short barrels.
Shotguns, with their 28-34 inch barrels use fast burning powders for the same reason.
 
Back
Top