40 caliber?

.40 S&W is not dead.
The cases make great .44 caliber jackets for bullets. :D


And 10mm Auto is probably more popular now, than ever.

Small market share? Yes.
But not dead.
 
It’s plain and simple:
380 - too marginal for a full size gun
9mm - getting better, but choose your load carefully
10mm - recoil is severe
45 auto- great round. Grips can be large and recoil is a bit much

40 s&w - just right

357 sig - probably better, but not much comercial viable right now

So, yes the 40 is alive and well!
 
Forte S+W said:
I won't bother arguing on the subject any further, but needless to say, I disagree.

If pistol cartridges were as ineffective as certain folks assert thatthey are, then neither the Military nor Law Enforcement would even bother to carry conventional handguns anymore and would have transitioned to compact PDWs a long time ago.

You can carry a bat if you want to, I'll stick with a .40cal pistol.
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Agreed
 
Nathan said:
It’s plain and simple:
380 - too marginal for a full size gun
9mm - getting better, but choose your load carefully
10mm - recoil is severe
45 auto- great round. Grips can be large and recoil is a bit much

40 s&w - just right

357 sig - probably better, but not much comercial viable right now

So, yes the 40 is alive and well!
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[emoji106]
 
10mm - recoil is severe.
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Ha, Ha. Yep, the 10mm's rather notorious "donkey-kick" recoil was famous for knocking FBI agents into next week during qualifications. :rolleyes:

Funny how a Glock 20, shooting full-power ("real") 10mm ammo, is the number one "bear defense" handgun & cartridge combo in Alaska, where real men still roam free. Put's the Grizzlies down DRT with one or two shots at most.

Not one complaint heard about "severe" recoil.

Not to mention, the 10mm is Mil-issue for Denmark's Sirius Sledge soldiers for self-defense during chance encounters with Polar bears in the arctic regions they patrol.
 
I’ve said it once and I will say it again.

I can easily go buy a box of .45GAP and they sold like 11 of those pistols with like 6 of them going to people with the last name Glock. Facetious I know but let’s face facts .45GAP didn’t exactly set the sales world aflame.

They sold like eleventy billion .40s&w pistols to everybody from local, state and federal law enforcement right down to the milk man and your neighbor. Then many of those agencies sold those guns to your other neighbors. All I am saying is if I can go buy .45GAP or .41 Magnum or frankly .357SIG. I think .40S&W will be around for a little while since they sold a wee more guns they all of the above combined…….times 10. :)

As for the efficacy of the caliber, it’s an excellent and proven defensive caliber. All the martial calibers are excellent these days with pros and cons that are mostly lost in the statistical noise. 9mm is probably the most efficient defensive handgun round. If, however, you own a .40 or want a .40 or a .40 is all you can get right now………rest assured it’s doing more then just bruising an assailant’s ego.

One caveat that I will agree with is certain manufacturers made great .40 caliber handguns by basically designing around the cartridge while others basically upsized their 9mm platform. Something like a SIG P229/239 or an HK USP/P series etc. is a match made in .40 heaven. The Glock 22/23/27 or Beretta 96 not so much in general terms. Not that those are HORRIBLE guns but they just are not as good or as nice to shoot as the platforms designed around the .40.
 
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JustJake said:
Ha, Ha. Yep, the 10mm's rather notorious "donkey-kick" recoil was famous for knocking FBI agents into next week during qualifications. :rolleyes:

Funny how a Glock 20, shooting full-power ("real") 10mm ammo, is the number one "bear defense" handgun & cartridge combo in Alaska, where real men still roam free. Put's the Grizzlies down DRT with one or two shots at most.

Not one complaint heard about "severe" recoil.

Not to mention, the 10mm is Mil-issue for Denmark's Sirius Sledge soldiers for self-defense during chance encounters with Polar bears in the arctic regions they patrol.
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A while back I decided to run a battery of drills (Bill, FAST, Devil, etc. Even the FBI qualification course) with a 5" 1911 in .45 ACP and one in 10mm.

230 grain at around 900 fps and 200 grain at around1200 fps

The 10mm definatley popped a bit more, and absolutely required more focus on rapid fire strings, but the times I clocked were remarkably close and I was surprised and how well it did on times, with the added bonus of I just shoot that 10mm better at longer ranges than darned near anything.

So, no the recoil isn't terrible compared to a .45, and I bet it would have done even better in a Glock 20 (since I find my Glock 21 shoots .45 much softer than my 1911s).

Anywho, back to the question at hand. .40 dead? No.

I don't see it around yet, and I'm seeing .45 and 9mm ammo showing up occasionally, haven't seen any ammo in a good while so if I wasn't a reloader I wouldn't get into it right now.
 
I don't shoot 40 anymore, but I liked it.
Get the Sig, they make a great 40. I had a stainless P226 in 40 that was a real nice shooter.
My favorite 40 was a Glock 29 with a KKM 40 conversion barrel.
 
The 40sw was created so that 9mm-lovers could make excuses. IMHO of course.
My favorite utility pistol is an M&P40 compact 2.0 (4"). And I'm a G19 and 1911 owner as well. Glad we have so many choices.
 
. Glad we have so many choices.
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I feel like there are the single caliber or single gun owners who either worry about making the best choice possible or who get wrapped around the axel over their given choice.

Then there are those of us like myself that when asked 9mm, .40 or .45 (.etc) our answer is YES. :)

If I personally was going to own one single handgun or handgun caliber it would be .45 cuz…….I like it. If I was going to tell a new person to own one single gun or caliber it would be 9mm because as I said it’s the most efficient. If you come up to me and tell me about your caliber or platform of choice or need I say rock on you will be fine barring anything legitimately dangerous or defective etc. I mean I will have a talk with you about your Lorcin .25 for example. :)

One thing I lament about the Internet is that it would have you believe you have two effective firearm choices. A Glock 19 or an itty bitty 10+ micro pistol ala SIG 365. Everything else is obviously obsolete, useless, unable to be effectively used etc. Now that is not to say a Glock 19 isn’t a fantastic choice nor does it take away the paradigm shift that is the P365 but the reality is there is a literal ocean of fine choices of firearm of all types, actions and calibers.

Except the Beretta Tomcat…….I hate those damn things and I can’t shoot them worth a darn. :p
 
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JustJake said:
Funny how a Glock 20, shooting full-power ("real") 10mm ammo, is the number one "bear defense" handgun & cartridge combo in Alaska, where real men still roam free. Put's the Grizzlies down DRT with one or two shots at most.
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Let’s put these real men on a shot timer. I get that they are tough enough to shoot a 10mm....aren’t we all?

I’d like to see them have 100% hits on an 8” steel at 50’ with under 0.4s splits. This is not particularly difficult with 9mm or 40 s&w, I believe.
 
I love it when folks push 10mm Auto, which is factually only about as powerful as .357 Magnum, as a "real man's" cartridge. My mom shoots .357 Magnum out of a 2.5" barreled snubby.

Don't get me wrong, it's dumb in general to associate one's ability to shoot any given cartridge out of any given firearm as an indication of one's masculinity, but if you're going to do that then at least make it .44 Magnum, not 10sillymeter.
 
I read an interview with Pat McNamara a year or two back .

The pistol he carried in bear county is a Glock chambered in .40 S&W.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
...10mm Auto, which is factually only about as powerful as .357 Magnum...
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That's right. They are very similar in energy and momentum with the 10mm having a slight advantage in momentum with heavy bullets and the .357Mag having a slight advantage in energy with light bullets.
 
I'm not knocking 10mm Auto, it's a fantastic cartridge, I'm just saying it's silly to push it as a "real man's" cartridge (as if there is such a thing) when it's factually not all that powerful compared to magnum handgun cartridges like .44 Magnum and upwards.

If 10mm Auto is a "real man's cartridge" then .500 S&W Magnum must be a "super human's cartridge" considering the vast difference in energy between the two.
 
Because 15+1 of “.357 Magnum” is a bad thing???????
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Nope, not at all. Just making an observation.

I would actually say from my experience that 10mm in a full-sized autopistol recoils less than .357Mag in a full-sized revolver because of the way the two platforms differ in terms of dealing with recoil.

I think the point is that if a person can deal with .357Mag, they shouldn't have problems with 10mm either.

That said, .357Mag isn't a light-recoiling caliber, not even in a full-sized revolver, so I'm not sure that's saying much.
 
Absolutely I’ve never found 10mm recoil all that much to write home about to be honest even in the Glock……….29???? Is that the G30 sized one?

Now I’m not a 10mm acolyte by any stretch but I agree it’s not the ballistic missile it’s made out to be in terms of recoil at least, I’ll let everybody else argue ballistics.
 
While felt recoil is highly subjective, these days most folks seem to agree that anything over Standard Pressure 9mm Luger is unpleasant to shoot, hence the persistent references to the "snappy" recoil of .40 S&W not to mention the assertion that follow up shots with the .40 S&W take substantially longer to pull off than 9mm Luger.

This is probably also the basis for the overblown reputation of 10mm Auto being a guaranteed one-shot-stop against Grizzly Bears which rivals .41 Magnum in terms of Ballistics that federal agents had to stop using because it just had too much darn recoil.
 
Forte S+W said:
While felt recoil is highly subjective, these days most folks seem to agree that anything over Standard Pressure 9mm Luger is unpleasant to shoot, hence the persistent references to the "snappy" recoil of .40 S&W not to mention the assertion that follow up shots with the .40 S&W take substantially longer to pull off than 9mm Luger.

This is probably also the basis for the overblown reputation of 10mm Auto being a guaranteed one-shot-stop against Grizzly Bears which rivals .41 Magnum in terms of Ballistics that federal agents had to stop using because it just had too much darn recoil.
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You cannot directly corelate "snappy" and "unpleasant to shoot"

I was issued and qualified with a Glock 22 .40 cal gun for several years.
Snappy, yes
unpleasant to shoot, no
enjoyable to shoot, subjective, personally no

Personally, in handguns
Full frame 3+ in barrel 38/357 , snappy, pleasant, enjoyable
snubbie or airweight 38/357, snappy, unpleasant/painful, not enjoyable
44 mag, full sized gun, 6in barrel. snappy, unpleasant not painful, enjoyable
45 acp, not snappy, pleasant, enjoyable
50AE desert eagle, very snappy, pleasant but hard to control, very enjoyable

I still need to add 10mm to the list of calibers I have shot. To me it seems it would fall under snappy, pleasant, and enjoyable
 
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