.357 Shells Hard to Extract.

3

3006loader

New member
I recently Purchased a S&W model 19 revolver, used, at a gun show. It will shoot a full cylinder of .38 special just fine, and even 1 or 2 .357 mags ok, but if I load more than 2 .357 mag cartridges at a time and fire all of them then I have trouble extracting them. Even loading 1 or 2 .357 I have significantly more resistance while extracting them than 6 fired .38 special shells. They get stuck in the chambers enough that I can't push the ejector rod with my hand without impaling myself, I have to push it against a hard surface to extract all the fired cases. Does anyone know what the cause of this is and how I would go about fixing it?
 
Are you using factory ammo or reloads - if reloads - you'd better check your loading data.

If you are shooting 38s in it . . . have you cleaned the cylinder chambers well after shooting the 38s? You may be getting some carbon build up that is causing the 357 casings to be tight after firing. Scrub 'em out and clean 'em good - then see what happens.

Also, when you clean your pistol, are you oiling the cylinder chambers? If so, clean them, oil them and then run a patch through them. I doubt it that is your problem but if cylinder chambers are oiled and there is enough of it in there, when the casing expands, it will make them difficult to eject. But if your 38s are ejecting O.K. - that's probably not it.
 
Agreed. Clean the cylinder chambers.

Shooting .38's will give a build up of crud where the cartridge ends. .357's being longer will get hung up on the build up. Do you reload? Just do light loads in .357 for target and practice instead of .38's
 
Not at all unusual if a gun has been fired lots of .38. As others have said, cleaning will correct the 'problem'.
 
You can chuck a 9mm/.38 bore's brush on a drill rod and wrap it with 0000 steel wool. Saturate with oil and use it to polish the chamber walls. This will clear out any sediment and make for a smooth extraction.
 
The most common cause of sticking .357 cases (when .38s work fine) is a carbon crud buildup in the cylinder at the point of the .38 special case mouth. This comes from firing a number of .38s (or a few really cruddy ones) and is often not removed by casual cleaning (just running a solvent patch & bore mop through the cylinder)

Sometimes the stuff will have to be scraped out. A tight brush (or similar) and some scrubbing, along with a good solvent will usually do it.

Try this, and let us know how things work out.
 
Save a few of your .357Mag cases from your range trip and flare the mouths just a little so that they fit the chamber VERY snugly. Use them to scrape the carbon out of the cylinder.
 
You Guys Were Dead On

Thanks everyone for the helpful responses. I just recently bought it and only oiled and lightly cleaned it before firing for the first time. After reading these replies I removed and examined the cylinder and I saw some kind of dried hardened sludge on the inside of each chamber. When I slid a spent .38 shell into the chamber and looked at it with a light, the shell stops at pretty much exactly where the sludge begins. So I'm assuming its from the previous owner firing a lot of .38 special and not cleaning it afterwards often enough. I used the sharp 90 degree edge of a cleaning rod with no brush to try and scrape it but it wasn't going anywhere. I even hooked up a 20 gauge, then a .38 bore brush (don't have a .45 right now) to a drill and ran it in there and it still isn't noticeably cleaner. Right now I have it sitting in some Hoppe's #9 and hopefully letting it soak for a bit will make a difference. Anyone else have any suggestions of how to get this clean?
 
Anyone else have any suggestions of how to get this clean
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I'd first try a patch wrapped around a brush, coated with Flitz metal polish or automotive polishing compound and spun with a drill.

If that doesn't work, try the steel wool suggestion.
 
The chambers are now clean. I let them soak in Hoppes #9 for awhile, then used a 20 gauge bore brush on a drill for about 1 minute straight on medium in each chamber. They are sparkling now. I'll post an update on if the .357 shells are now problem free.
 
FWIW the crud is easier to remove if it's done promptly after shooting. Several gun-cleaning supply companies sell special stainless-steel chamber brushes specifically intended for cleaning the crud ring out of Magnum chambers after firing standard loads. Other options are a .375-caliber rifle brush or JohnKSa's suggestion to make a cleaning tool from a .357 case.

If you handload, I heartily concur with tomingreeneco's suggestion to use .357 brass for your light or target loads. There is no downside to this aside from the standard .357 warning to exercise caution to avoid double-charging, since the deep cases make it hard to discern the extra powder.
 
all revolver rounds leave a ring of "goo" at the end of the case when fired.

Since 38s are a tad shorter then357s, the 357 goes past that ring left by the 38.

When the revolver is fired the case expands. That ring of goo left by the 38 crabs the longer case, making it hard to extract.

Cleaning out the goo ring left by the 38 needs to be done before shooting the 357.

I personally don't worry about it, I shoot 38s out of my 38 Revolvers and 357 out of my 357 revolvers, but most people shoot both out of the same gun (that's the way they were designed).

There are several ways to do this. Lots of scrubbing with a brush, using a Lewis Lead Remover, etc.

All in my opinion are a pain in the behind.

I take a 357 case, bell it with the expander die to where it has to be forced in the cylinder. Then I force the empty case in the chamber which cuts out the goo ring left by the 38. Followed by normal cleaning.

Before shooting 38s, put oil in each cylinder, it makes the "goo" ring come out easier no mater what method you use to clean the cylinder.

If I were to shoot a lot of 38s, I'd oil the cylinders ever few rounds.

If you're using your 357 in events such as Bowling pins or something that may require a fast reload, I wouldn't even shoot 38s in it.

I'm a huge fan of easy extraction of my revolvers.

A long the same lines, cylinders get dirty even if you shoot 38s in a 38 or only 357s in 357. I like to keep my cylinders clean to the point where if the cylinder is open and turned upside down, the fired brass comes out under their own weight and gravity.

This is critical if you shoot ICORE or similar games. Handy in SD if you might need to do a fast reload also.

I carried a Model 28 in my 20 year LE career. I was a fanatic about keeping my cylinders clean. I wouldn't shoot 38s in my service revolver. If for some reason I wanted light 38 loads in this gun, I'd load light loads in my 357 cases. But I ALWAYS used different bullets then I used in my service ammo.

Wouldn't pay to get them mixed up.
 
Howdy

Not at all unusual for a 357 Mag that has been fired mostly with 38s. This is very typical of a Model 19. They are often fired a lot more with 38s than Mags. Mine sure has been.

What happens when a cartridge with a lead bullet fires is that the hot exhaust gasses generated by the powder burning vaporizes a small amount of the lead at the base of the bullet. As the bullet emerges from the mouth of the case, the pressures generated blast the vaporized lead and carbon through the narrow gap at high pressure, depositing carbon and lead in a narrow ring on the chamber. The effect diminishes as the bullet moves further down the chamber throat.

This happens with all cartridges and lead bullets, its just that you don't notice it most of the time, because the lead buildup at the case mouth is usually up by the chamber throat, where it does not interfere with anything. But because 38 Specials have a shorter case than a 357 Magnum, the carbon/lead buildup can interfere with chambering, and ejecting the longer 357 Mag cases.
 
The carbon crud build up in the cylinders is the lube gunk ring I've mentioned in other responses.
Since there's a hardened lube gunk ring, it has to come out as mentioned. You'll likely have to soak the cylinder in normal solvent for an hour or so before brushing it out. Kind of surprised you're able to load any .357 ammo in a gunked chamber though.
 
I'm not sure why other people seem to get concrete deposits from shooting 38's in a 357, but the only thing I've ever needed was a patch with some Hoppes, 2 swipes with a nylon bore brush, and another patch or two to clean it out.
 
I'm not sure why other people seem to get concrete deposits from shooting 38's in a 357, but the only thing I've ever needed was a patch with some Hoppes, 2 swipes with a nylon bore brush, and another patch or two to clean it out.
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You probably clean after ever range session or close to it. OP has a used gun and no idea how it was maintained. It could have been fed thousands of 38s over decades without a good cleaning. I also had issues with a gun I bought used and they did not re-occur. I'm not exactly a 'clean after every range trip' kind of guy either.

If you can manage the flared case mentioned above that seems the best IMO. May not have worked for your really gunked up chambers, but now that you have them reasonably clean it makes a good tool to keep them that way.

Even a brass bore brush, once chucked in a drill, can be a bit much IMO.
 
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