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.30Carbine-Legal DEER -In.THRU 2020
- Thread starter Skeets
- Start date
This begs the question: Where were you aiming that you hit the neck?I shot a Blacktail buck in Calif forty years ago at eighty yards broke his neck, fell down and died.....did not feel under gunned that day.
buck460XVR
New member
Seems to me that most folks using the carbine will be shooting factory FMJ ammo out of it.
Is FMJ legal for hunting deer in IN and/or do folks use FMJ outta other platforms/calibers?
If it's legal, then we are talking ethics, if it's illegal, we are talking violating. Ethics is a gray area, legality is black and white. For the most part, I've found the accuracy of most .30 carbine platforms just as much as a question as the bullets used.
Most Whitetail deer are taken at 40 yards or less in the Eastern U.S. Are you suggesting that a .30 Carbine is not capable of enough accuracy at that distance?I've found the accuracy of most .30 carbine platforms just as much as a question as the bullets used.
Art Eatman
Staff in Memoriam
I've always believed that the max range for a handgun with iron sights is that distance at which you can reliably hit the end of a beer can.
Since the Carbine round and the .357 Mag are similar in performance, I'd hold to that limit.
Since the Carbine round and the .357 Mag are similar in performance, I'd hold to that limit.
buck460XVR
New member
Most Whitetail deer are taken at 40 yards or less in the Eastern U.S. Are you suggesting that a .30 Carbine is not capable of enough accuracy at that distance?
Under 40 yards does not require much accuracy, so yes the .30 carbine is quite capable at that range, as is even a recurve bow. But @ 40 yards or less, there are a myriad of other options out there that would perform better terminally and are just as , if not more, accurate.......including the old Indiana standby........ a slug-gun.
The biggest reason so many in Indiana are jumping on the new handgun caliber cartridges now legal for use for deer is because outta a rifle/carbine you theoretically can extend the range over what you could do with a standard smoothbore and they are theoretically more accurate at longer distances. There is a substantial cost savings on ammo also if you don't reload for shotgun. For a 40 yard and under deer gun, I see no realistic advantage of a .30 carbine over a slug gun, or any other handgun caliber cartridge long-gun. It would simply be a "I got one, so I'm gonna use it!" . I don't have a problem with that. As I said, if it's legal any opinions on use are of ethics, and the .30 carbine is legal. Arguing ethics on the internet is like kicking yourself. I did find out tho that FMJ is illegal in Indiana so there shouldn't even be a discussion on that. IME, out to 125 yards, a rifled barreled slug gun, using sabots is a very accurate platform, and still a better option than a .30 carbine. Others may have dissimilar experiences and are free to disagree. Kinda what we do here.
My experience with .30 carbine accuracy comes from buying a Mil-Surp from a barrel from Montgonery-Ward back in the 60s when they sold for $99. The only other experience I had was with a friends Ruger Blackhawk revolver. Neither had what I would call "match grade" accuracy. It could have very well have been the use of Mil-Surp ammo in my carbine, but from talking with others with them, accuracy was not the priority. The fun factor of shooting a lot of ammo fast and inexpensively was. I found references for accurizing my carbine and tried many things that only slightly improved the accuracy. Others may have had other experiences and the new modern production guns are more than likely, better at the range. Similar to the old Ruger Mini's.
But the OP doesn't want to hunt with a slug gun, he want's to use his 70 year old combat vet M1 Carbine.Under 40 yards does not require much accuracy, so yes the .30 carbine is quite capable at that range, as is even a recurve bow. But @ 40 yards or less, there are a myriad of other options out there that would perform better terminally and are just as , if not more, accurate.......including the old Indiana standby........ a slug-gun.
I'd also add that that slug gun may not be better choice for many hunters the recoil will make it very hard to shoot with any accuracy.
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Carry weight and recoil...unless you have some 12 Gauge shotgun in mind that shoots slugs with almost no recoil. Also, I do not think that a "realistic advantage" is what shooters who want to use the .30 Carbine are really interested in.For a 40 yard and under deer gun, I see no realistic advantage of a .30 carbine over a slug gun...
buck460XVR
New member
Originally posted by mavracer
But the OP doesn't want to hunt with a slug gun, he wan't to use his 70 year old combat vet M1 Carbine.
Yes I know, this is why I posted this earlier.....
It would simply be a "I got one, so I'm gonna use it!" . I don't have a problem with that.
Originally posted by dahermit
Also, I do not think that a "realistic advantage" is what shooters who want to use the .30 Carbine are really interested in.
Maybe yes, maybe no. I have a firend that works @ Henry rifles. He claims their sales went thru the roof whenever a shotgun only state legalized handgun caliber rifles. I'm thinking the majority of folks that bought them were buying them for the advantage, real or perceived.
I live in a state where deer rifles calibers is restricted to being a centerfire cartridge of more that .22 caliber. Still for the last dozen years or so, my two boys and I have hunted deer exclusively with revolvers or revolver caliber carbines. The reason, because we can and it's more of a challenge. Again, folks in shotgun/handgun states that can now use handgun caliber rifles are for the most part buying handgun caliber rifles for the increased range and accuracy. BTW....I also use a recurve bow for deer hunting again after using compounds for years. No realistic advantage, just because I want to....so I understand where the OP is coming from. My point is, if you're someone considering a .30 carbine as a alternative to a shottie or other handgun caliber rifle, you should rethink.
Well growing up there were plenty of deer in our freezer from the little M1 Carbine. We used the Sierra 110gr RNSP over a dose of around 14 or so grains of 2400.
We did not stretch the ranges though, most of the deer were shot at around, or under 100yds. Probably closer to 50-75.
I have used my Ruger BH to take a few hogs using the Speer SJHP as well as the RNSP's. It might not be the top of the heap for a lot of folks, but you don't need a UBER magnum to kill a deer. Place the shot where it needs to go.
We did not stretch the ranges though, most of the deer were shot at around, or under 100yds. Probably closer to 50-75.
I have used my Ruger BH to take a few hogs using the Speer SJHP as well as the RNSP's. It might not be the top of the heap for a lot of folks, but you don't need a UBER magnum to kill a deer. Place the shot where it needs to go.
Took one deer many years ago with my M1 Carbine (1941 Inland). I used a Remington 110 gr RN SP and it was shot around 70-75 yards away. No tracking was required and not much of a difference between what I've seen from some other deer I've shot with a .30-30 win or .308 win. at similar distances.
I did have to make a wooden plug to put in my 15 round magazine to limit it to 5 rounds to make it legal.
There are plenty of factory M1 carbine load choices for deer hunting. Federal, Hornady, Magtech, PPU, Remington, and Winchester all make them.
I did have to make a wooden plug to put in my 15 round magazine to limit it to 5 rounds to make it legal.
There are plenty of factory M1 carbine load choices for deer hunting. Federal, Hornady, Magtech, PPU, Remington, and Winchester all make them.
Dahermit, At that distance I always try for a neck shot, drops them like a rock and saves a heck of a lot of meat. That was my one and only deer/ Carbine hunt. I have put down a half dozen or so Texas hogs (i shoot them in the shoulder or head) with a carbine and they were just as dead as if i had used my AR in .223 or 300 Blackout on them.....killed forty on my April -- May stay in Eastern Texas this year.
I think a lot of people might be confusing a cartridge / gun combination that is accurate enough as automatically being lethal enough. There is hitting a deer and their is killing a deer. The first doesn't guarantee the second.
If all I had was a .30 carbine to hunt deer, I would take it and make the best of it...after some practice and penetration tests. From the deer I have shot and / or butchered, I would want a bullet that penetrates completely through a deer's chest. That would determine the range and angles at which I believe the cartridge is "sufficient". I don't buy for one second that a bullet should be found just lodged under the skin of the far side of the animal or the energy is "wasted". If the bullet sails through and leaves a nice exit wound to leave a blood trail while the deer is running out its last few seconds of existence, that is great, and the "excess energy" wasn't wasted, but instead not needed.
If a .30 carbine can go through a deer's chest cavity broadside at 50 yards and no more, then it's a deer cartridge at a 90 degree angle at 50 yards and no more.
I own only a Ruger Blackhawk in .30 carbine and have never taken it deer hunting, so I can go only on what I know about shooting deer with other calibers...somewhere over 70, I suppose and way over 100 others I have cut up.
However, I do know a Korean Army vet who bowled over a running cow elk at 60 yards across a field with an M-1 carbine with a couple three-four shots. He wasn't really elk hunting back then, just carrying a rifle like many ranchers did "for whatever".
I asked that gentleman if he didn't feel undergunned with a .30 carbine, and he said, "Not since 1952 when I had to use mine because we couldn't get the barrel on the 1919A6 .30 changed fast enough...but when the flares went off, and I saw the better part of a division coming across that valley, even that Browning seemed inadequate!"
If all I had was a .30 carbine to hunt deer, I would take it and make the best of it...after some practice and penetration tests. From the deer I have shot and / or butchered, I would want a bullet that penetrates completely through a deer's chest. That would determine the range and angles at which I believe the cartridge is "sufficient". I don't buy for one second that a bullet should be found just lodged under the skin of the far side of the animal or the energy is "wasted". If the bullet sails through and leaves a nice exit wound to leave a blood trail while the deer is running out its last few seconds of existence, that is great, and the "excess energy" wasn't wasted, but instead not needed.
If a .30 carbine can go through a deer's chest cavity broadside at 50 yards and no more, then it's a deer cartridge at a 90 degree angle at 50 yards and no more.
I own only a Ruger Blackhawk in .30 carbine and have never taken it deer hunting, so I can go only on what I know about shooting deer with other calibers...somewhere over 70, I suppose and way over 100 others I have cut up.
However, I do know a Korean Army vet who bowled over a running cow elk at 60 yards across a field with an M-1 carbine with a couple three-four shots. He wasn't really elk hunting back then, just carrying a rifle like many ranchers did "for whatever".
I asked that gentleman if he didn't feel undergunned with a .30 carbine, and he said, "Not since 1952 when I had to use mine because we couldn't get the barrel on the 1919A6 .30 changed fast enough...but when the flares went off, and I saw the better part of a division coming across that valley, even that Browning seemed inadequate!"
Sure Shot Mc Gee
New member
So long as its bullet is a HP. Rd Nose don't seem to preform as well as the HP. My Father hunted deer for many years illegally with a 30 cal M1 paratrooper model. Light weight easy to aim semi. Never ever jammed ever. Whats not to like. Sighted for 100 yards it killed . No doubt about it providing Pop's shot hit the animals vital spot/s. Just because its cartridge is a small straight wall and a bit slow going down range don't be fooled that the 30 M1 carbine is totally inappropriate for use on thin skin animals. In the hands of a well seasoned woodsy hunter the 30 Carbine will drop a deer of any size or gender where it stands.