.30-06 Long Range Rifle
- Thread starter Mosin-Marauder
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Mosin-Marauder
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Also, the Krieger barrel is doable, very much so probably. However, a McMillan stock is very expensive, and would eat up close to all of my budget. H&S precision or a Bell and Carlson would be doable as well, and leave room for the scope and possibly a trigger. I'll have to do some more research. I am still up to change the caliber, of course, aa I stated I just like 30-06.
Mosin-Marauder
New member
Very funny...
I beat probably 5-6 people just in the marksman class, 1 or 2 of which was having troublet getting on paper, another had some sort of sporter type Savage, and the rest were like 6 or 6.5 shooters.
I'm not proud of my score, but it's something to build on.
You don't have to shut up, lol!
I should have clarified in my OP but I forgot, haha.
One thing to consider, Mo, is that you tend to want it all by this afternoon. 
I do understand budgetary concerns, and you don't have to start out with a $5000 package as a beginner, but there's something to be said by waiting a little longer till you CAN get the money together to buy quality.
You remember how frustrated you've gotten in the past when you've tried to accelerate the process and hasty choices didn't work out so well for you.
Denis
I do understand budgetary concerns, and you don't have to start out with a $5000 package as a beginner, but there's something to be said by waiting a little longer till you CAN get the money together to buy quality.
You remember how frustrated you've gotten in the past when you've tried to accelerate the process and hasty choices didn't work out so well for you.
Denis
Mosin-Marauder
New member
That is definitely a valid (and true) statement!
I understand $1000 may be too low of an estimate. Even if I do go over with the equipment you advised, it won't be by much, maybe 1 or 2 hundred over budget, which is largely okay.
Looking back, I did make some very hasty choices and tried to "expedite" literally everything, heheh.
HOWEVER...
...I have some news.
I have a scope.
It's a good scope.
It's a Nikon Monarch 3-12x42 BDC with sidefocus.
I have no idea whether this will work or not. My initial impression was "maybe". I have good eyesight, and if I have a good spotting scope, I can use that to see my hits. But I'm not sure 12x is adequate for anything beyond 300.
Thoughts?
I have seen, never shot some pretty cool LR rigs in .30-06.
Your optic...clarity is more important than just magnification. I have 4-20s on my .260 and .243 match guns which I shoot to 1200 or so. I have a 2-10s on my .243 hunting rig and my .223 DMR that I shoot to 750. My .223 3Gun rifles have 1-5s, and I shoot to about 600 with those.
If clear, 12x is good to 1000.
Your optic...clarity is more important than just magnification. I have 4-20s on my .260 and .243 match guns which I shoot to 1200 or so. I have a 2-10s on my .243 hunting rig and my .223 DMR that I shoot to 750. My .223 3Gun rifles have 1-5s, and I shoot to about 600 with those.
If clear, 12x is good to 1000.
Mosin-Marauder
New member
It's definitely clear, however the BDC at different yardage isn't very precise, so I'd have to click for whatever distance I shoot at.
dakota.potts
New member
Here is one that I am working on now. It is not an F class rifle (rather, I chose parts of mine with the intention to be an off hand/ field position target rifle). These are our project rifles for school. Done in a Montana Rifle Co. receiver (very close to a Winchester Model 70 but not quite) with ER Shaw barrels.
Shorter is stiffer, however I have yet to see any rigorous analysis of how much benefit can be gained from a stiffer action, and how much is just existential possibility...
I've seen "faster lock time is better!" as well too, but honestly the lock time is another one of those areas where I don't see any rigorous analysis of what the actual as opposed to perceived benefits.
A lot of the "308 is more accurate than 30-06" data comes from the M72 match load versus M118SB load. The military never could get the 30-06 to shoot as tight consistently, using the same powder, bullets, and primers, just different brass. But that is one load comparison, and is really only applicable to those two loads.
Jimro
I've seen "faster lock time is better!" as well too, but honestly the lock time is another one of those areas where I don't see any rigorous analysis of what the actual as opposed to perceived benefits.
A lot of the "308 is more accurate than 30-06" data comes from the M72 match load versus M118SB load. The military never could get the 30-06 to shoot as tight consistently, using the same powder, bullets, and primers, just different brass. But that is one load comparison, and is really only applicable to those two loads.
Jimro
Ok, I have to weigh in.
I started shooting 30-06 mil surplus. Like them, lot of fun.
I wanted a Heavy Barrel (HB) 30-06 to see what I could do with it.
Some laugh at me, why 30-06? Because it appeals to me. Its only for punching holes, 300 yds at most likely. But there are so many calibers so much better? So? This is my fun and that's what I want.
What I found eventually was that you can do a Savage fairly easily as it has a nut holding the barrel in place (AR like, or more accurately 50 cal machine gun) - easy to head space. About $150 in tools for first change, after than just barel cost (well just is $300 plus but the tools work forever)
I also have a 308, same HB setup.
Some days I shoot the 308 good, some days the 30-06, some days neither one. For an average shooter (me) you will never tell the difference.
We used to have a guy name of Bart B, 308 is vastly superior (well it is if you are into the .2 group sizes. Otherwise the 30-06 does 1000 better as you have a lot of case capaicyt to work with to keep the speed up out there.
Barrels: Two types.
Cut Rifled: These are the best for the best. Wasted on me.
BUtton Rifled: Range from good (Shilen) to accepail (ER Shaw).
If its a one time barrel, go Cut, gun smith costs are too high to switch around.
Keep in mind, barrels wear out, target barrels wear out all to fast, if you want it to last, check your calibers carefully if you go with other than 06.
Long action you can shoot anything single loading, short action it 308 and under.
308 is easy on barrels. 30-06 is, 260 is good on barrels. 243 eats them up fast. Some of the 6 and 6.5 are barrel burners and some are good (I think 6mm BR is one of the very best long lived ones)
Still something like 5000 rounds it starts to drop off a good shooter, by 8k they are all gone.
So long term, you have to decide if the skill level warrants the investment.
I decided not, so went with the Savage. It will always shoot better than I can so I don't have to worry.
Model 70 according to Bart B is one of the best actions for this, its very rigid. Downside is gun smith costs.
I started shooting 30-06 mil surplus. Like them, lot of fun.
I wanted a Heavy Barrel (HB) 30-06 to see what I could do with it.
Some laugh at me, why 30-06? Because it appeals to me. Its only for punching holes, 300 yds at most likely. But there are so many calibers so much better? So? This is my fun and that's what I want.
What I found eventually was that you can do a Savage fairly easily as it has a nut holding the barrel in place (AR like, or more accurately 50 cal machine gun) - easy to head space. About $150 in tools for first change, after than just barel cost (well just is $300 plus but the tools work forever)
I also have a 308, same HB setup.
Some days I shoot the 308 good, some days the 30-06, some days neither one. For an average shooter (me) you will never tell the difference.
We used to have a guy name of Bart B, 308 is vastly superior (well it is if you are into the .2 group sizes. Otherwise the 30-06 does 1000 better as you have a lot of case capaicyt to work with to keep the speed up out there.
Barrels: Two types.
Cut Rifled: These are the best for the best. Wasted on me.
BUtton Rifled: Range from good (Shilen) to accepail (ER Shaw).
If its a one time barrel, go Cut, gun smith costs are too high to switch around.
Keep in mind, barrels wear out, target barrels wear out all to fast, if you want it to last, check your calibers carefully if you go with other than 06.
Long action you can shoot anything single loading, short action it 308 and under.
308 is easy on barrels. 30-06 is, 260 is good on barrels. 243 eats them up fast. Some of the 6 and 6.5 are barrel burners and some are good (I think 6mm BR is one of the very best long lived ones)
Still something like 5000 rounds it starts to drop off a good shooter, by 8k they are all gone.
So long term, you have to decide if the skill level warrants the investment.
I decided not, so went with the Savage. It will always shoot better than I can so I don't have to worry.
Model 70 according to Bart B is one of the best actions for this, its very rigid. Downside is gun smith costs.
Mosin-Marauder
New member
So, I have some good news, I shot my M70 again today and 4 rounds of my hand loads grouped just a hair over .50" at 100 yards. Im quite proud, it's the best group this rifle has shot as far as I know. I'm going to another shoot this week at 300 yards and I will most likely use this load in the rifle's current configuration. I'll let you guys know how it goes.
Mosin-Marauder
New member
168 SMK over 47 grains of IMR 4064 with WLR primers. I need to zero it for 300, still so I plan to do that tomorrow maybe.
Sometimes shooting what you have beats waiting on getting a basket case project finished.
Once your rifle delivers consistent decent performance...lets suppose maybe your .5 MOA group was a bit lucky but your load and improvement will deliver 1.125 MOA you can count on.(For my point,it does not matter)
Buying better equiptment is instant pudding gratification.Anybody can do that,but if you spend $3800 on a .125 MOA rifle,it only gains you 5 inches at 1000 yds.
If you keep shooting,and learning,and spend that money on ammo...and listen to some Old Guy (the right one.There are a LOT of bogus Old Guys) you will learn the stuff you cannot buy.
If I had to bet,and I had to choose between some Senior Distinguished Marksman with a 60 year old Model 70 30-06 versus somebody with a brand new shiny expensive ooooo and aaaaaaah rifle,I think the guy who knows his dope and wind and mirage,who has the focus to break a good shot every time,etc can use his skill to outshoot equiptment.
And the tougher conditions are,the more skill and experience is an advantage.
Once your rifle delivers consistent decent performance...lets suppose maybe your .5 MOA group was a bit lucky but your load and improvement will deliver 1.125 MOA you can count on.(For my point,it does not matter)
Buying better equiptment is instant pudding gratification.Anybody can do that,but if you spend $3800 on a .125 MOA rifle,it only gains you 5 inches at 1000 yds.
If you keep shooting,and learning,and spend that money on ammo...and listen to some Old Guy (the right one.There are a LOT of bogus Old Guys) you will learn the stuff you cannot buy.
If I had to bet,and I had to choose between some Senior Distinguished Marksman with a 60 year old Model 70 30-06 versus somebody with a brand new shiny expensive ooooo and aaaaaaah rifle,I think the guy who knows his dope and wind and mirage,who has the focus to break a good shot every time,etc can use his skill to outshoot equiptment.
And the tougher conditions are,the more skill and experience is an advantage.
Assuming you aren't shooting at tanks at 1000 yds, 5 inches is important!
At best it gets you 5 inches, environmental makes that almost impossible (maybe impossible)
I don't know anyone makes a .125 rifle.
A Savage project rifle can be done for reasonable, you still need good optics though.
Right now I am looking at the Save Magnum target, single shot, dump the barrel, 338 Lapua is way too much cost, get an aftermarket barrel and ......
List is $1177, probably can be had for a grand or so. Amazing.
Still limitation is mostlyh the shooter (don't ask me how I know)
At best it gets you 5 inches, environmental makes that almost impossible (maybe impossible)
I don't know anyone makes a .125 rifle.
A Savage project rifle can be done for reasonable, you still need good optics though.
Right now I am looking at the Save Magnum target, single shot, dump the barrel, 338 Lapua is way too much cost, get an aftermarket barrel and ......
List is $1177, probably can be had for a grand or so. Amazing.
Still limitation is mostlyh the shooter (don't ask me how I know)