25-06 velocity

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cdoc42

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I converted a Winchester Model 70 from .270 to 25-06 using a Hart 26-inch barrel, thinking I could move a 120gr bullet well over 3000fps compared to 3100 for a 130gr bullet in the .270.

What a surprise!

The Hornady manual lists H-1000 starting load 52 gr producing 2775 fps. By an error I'll never explain I started at 50.0gr, using the Hornady 120gr spire and hollow point. The spire gave me a 4-shot, 100 yd group that measured 0.27" and the hollow point gave a 4-shot group of 0.36 inches. Now I didn't chrono these loads but they can't be going much faster than 2600 fps.

Any higher charge with H1000 and any powder that delivers the max listed speeds, which are often under 3000 fps , gives me lousy groups.

How is it that a lighter bullet in a case that pushes a heavier .270 bullet can't produce velocities over 3100 fps, esp from a 26-inch barrel?
 
25-06

I've not loading any 120's for my 25-06 but I have used Norma 205 and 100 grains in a 26 inch barreled Ruger No. 1. The power is no longer available, but there is some close to it. I could come close to 3500 ft per sec with it.
 
I use 100 gr sierra spitzer with IMR4350 @ 3400 fps . Useing the Sierra book it seems IMR 4350 is a good powder for Sierra 120gr also .
 
I was disappointed with the velocity and powder I had to use just to get a .257" 115 gr Nos ballistic tip bullet up to 3050 fps at the muzzle. The soft Norma brass was not going to give me the 3200 fps I had hoped.

Then I shot 4 mule deer with it between 50 and 400 yards.
None of the deer took another step.
I was not disappointed with the effectiveness.
 
Well, if you hoped the 25-06 would perform like a 270, you weren't being realistic. The 270 will do everything the 25-06 can do, and more besides. But the reverse is just not possible. At least you have an accurate load.
 
It has to do with less bullet surface touching the barrel. You can shoot 150's out of a 30-06 much faster than a 270 because the bullets are shorter and create less resistance as they go down the barrel. But... the 150 gr 270 is longer and more aerodynamic. While it may be slower at the muzzle, it will reach a point down range where the more aerodynamic bullet is faster and has more energy. Longer bullets tend to penetrate deeper on game too.

That said you should be able to get at least 3000 fps, maybe 3100 with 120's in a 25-06. They won't do a thing 130's out of a 270 will do at the same speed though.

Not what you want to hear, but a 243 will out perfroma 25-06. With the best loads a 100 gr 243 is capable of 3000-3100 fps. It'll shoot flatter and hit harder at long range because of the much better BC's available in 6mm bullets vs 25 caliber.
 
Thanks to all who responded so far. I will certainly experiment with IMR4350.

I can understand the ability to get a lighter .257 bullet like 100 gr to go 3400 or more. But I can't understand why a 120gr, in the same volume case can't easily exceed the 130gr bullet speed of the .270. The difference in the diameter of the calibers is only 0.51mm or 0.02."
 
Try a different powder and bullet. I no longer shoot 120 gr but had no trouble with Sierra 117 gr and IMR 4350, speed was about 3090 fps.

The last 10 years I've switched to RL powders. They give more velocity then the IMR powders, velocity is the one thing the .25-06 likes. If I were shooting a heavy bullet I'd probably try RL22 or RL25. RL19 with the 85 gr Nosler gives me 3640 fps, that's moving. Haven't tried RL19 with heavy bullets but it may be a good one too.

I'm a big fan of the .25-06, been shooting one for 36 years. When I bought the rifle, a Remington 700, I wanted a .270 but it was not offered in that cartridge. The guy behind the counter suggested the .25-06, I'm glad he did.
 
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With our standard Rem 700 in 25-06 using the 24" barrel I could never break 3000fps with any powder I tried without ironing out primers. The load I settled on however is with the 115gr Partition over 56.5grs of RL-22 out of the older Hornady Fourth Edition Manual listed under their 117gr bullets. I worked up to it and get 3150fps and it groups around an inch or under at 200yds in most conditions.

I passed that one over to my daughter and built myself an Ackley version using a 28" Broughton 5C barrel with a 1-9 twist. Using Ramshot Magnum I can easily hit mid 3200's with no issues. My hunting load uses the 120gr Nosler Solid Base at just over 3300fps. It has shot quite a few groups at or under an inch at 300yds in calm winds. My oldest grandson used it last Thanksgiving to take this nice 10pt buck at around 325yds.
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The main reason I built the AI version was I just couldn't get what I wanted out of the standard version and wanted to utilize some heavier bullets to reach out across some wide open spaces for feral hogs. While the 115's work fine and dandy for deer out to 400yds and some, they are a but light for the bigger hogs we see. The 120's while only 5grs more are better but I also have some 130gr custom's that hit like the hammer of Thor and those are what I really wanted to shoot. Why not use the .270 instead, like mentioned above longer bullet gives better downrange performance and sectional density.

Back to your issue with the 120's though, I might suggest giving some Ramshot Magnum a try if you can find some. It might get you there. What you also have to consider is the smaller bore your looking to push all that pressure through. Trying the faster powders will get you velocity to a point, but your going to start hitting pressures as well. The slower ones will work better for you in the longer barrel.

Forgot to add, don't get caught up trying to run tight to the lands. It isn't good when looking for top end velocities from what I have found. It will however give you higher pressure quicker. My 115gr load sits back around .045" off, and the 120 & 130gr ones for the AI version are back around .035". I know they are closer but the powder is a lot slower as well.
 
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Thanks, joed, sureshot and mike; I'll investigate and experiment with your suggestions Nice deer -I'll bet the smile on his face was worth a million.

Pathfinder: the .270 I converted was a BOSS model and I burned the barrel out. Had been shooting one inch at 200 yards but lost it. Since I already had 3 other .270's I thought I'd jump over to .25-06.
 
I have not tried the 120gr bullets but I can get 3300 fps out of a 26" barrel 25-06 using RE25 and either a 115gr bt or a sierra game king 117gr. I also can get a 3250 fps with a 24" barrel with 7828. Both loads are under max in the manual. Accuracy with the 7828 load is excellent. But that is in a savage heavy barrel. I have had 3 25-06s I had one with a 1-12" twist it really liked light bullets I could get over 3800 fps with a 75gr Vmax using 4064.
 
I can't believe why some are comparing the .25-06 to the .270, they are 2 different cartridges. To say the .270 out performs the .25-06 is just not true. I can use mine for groundhog hunting shooting 85 gr bullets, the .270 shoots heavier bullets and was intended for larger game. Sure, there are light bullets for the .270 but they have a pretty bad bc when compared to the .257 bullets.

There is a lot of overlap with the two cartridges but the .25-06 handles lighter bullets while the .270 handles heavier.

To me they are both great cartridges.
 
Well, we all do have our favorites..... I find it interesting that many folks are so enamoured of their favorite that they will prove that theirs is better than another's favorite by playing with the numbers to no end, giving their own favorite the advantage of any number of wonder-bullets with astounding B.C., while comparing such against the competition's plain-jane, factory Corelokts of whatever. I'm thinking, for example, of those who claim that the 243 Winchester out-performs the 25-06. I am sure someone can prove it's true! Pardon me if I remain skeptical. It's like some of my 270 handloads that will outdo some 7mm Magnum factory loads; it's true, but c'mon, it ain't fair....
 
I have both the .243 and .25-06 and like them both. They're for hunting and all I shoot are hunting bullets. Both of these have their place.

Another favorite of mine, that I don't own is a .270 Win. If I come across one I'll buy it.

You are right that everyone talks up high bc bullets. I use them for targets not hunting.
 
If all I had was a 25-06 and was expecting to go on an Elk hunt, I would probably use that as an excuse to buy another rifle more appropriate for Elk, all the while, knowing that a good 120 grain bullet from the 25-06 would be perfectly adequate for Elk. We all could use just one more rifle, right?;)
 
The .25-06 was my only center fire for 25 years. It did everything I wanted till I found a nice 700 Classic in .300 H&H Mag. Next was a 70 in 7mm RM, another 70 in .308, another 70 in .243 followed by a few .22-250's. It never ends does it?

I like every one of them.
 
I told folks at a party one night, while sitting next to my wife: "There's 3 things that I own that I would never lend to anyone: my guns, my dog and my wife; in that order."
 
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