243 Ammo for whitetail

[ripnbst]

Be careful with the SST bullets at close range. There are many reports of the bullets expanding violently. I haven't seen any scientific experiments of what causes it but there have been enough instances that it can be concluded that it does in fact happen. My personal belief is the high velocity is what causes it.

 

[4runnerman]

Loaded up some Serria 85 BTHP for a fiend of mine. Him and his son both dropped them dead in their tracks with one shot each.

 

[reloader28]

Ripinbst,
I've heard that too, but aint personally seen it. I've shot them in as close as 20yrds, but that one was a neck shot. The couple deer with chest shots at about 60-70yds worked fine too.

Not that it cant happen with proper shot placement, thats just my experience. I would agree that its probly the speed.


On a side note, I helped my uncle cut up his elk today that he shot with a Barnes Triple Shock I think he said. With his 270 WSM and that thing is pure junk as far as I'm concerned. It didnt even expand to full caliber diameter. It had lots of penetration. Quartering away and the bullet went thru the gut, thru the vitals and imbedded in the base of the neck by the shoulder. He did get the elk however.

 

[Nathan]

Jlove:

Let's do the algebraic math:

Fusion > Core-Lokt in performance due to true bonded core. Core-Lokt's fail.
Fusion < Partitions in price and >= in performance

sum = Fusion 95gr (and Winchester Powermax) best whitetail bullet period

I've got stories, pictures of entry/exit wounds, and a few trophy deer to prove this equation

I think you've nailed it, but I think we could add -
Core-Lokt(plus a few other hunting bullets) = good enough for most deer

Up close, the bonded core should keep it from blowing up, especially when hitting bone.

 

[PawPaw]

I was thinking of 100 grn Hornady interlock or maybe see if i can pick up some Federal with 100 grn partitions. Any suggestions,thoughts?

I use 100 grain Hornadys, pushed to about 3100 fps with a good load of Reloder 22. Very accurate in my Savage model 10. It's my go-to load in the .243 Win. I bought a bunch of them on sale four years ago, when they're gone I'll pick up another bullet, possibly the Barnes Triple Shock. Everything I've read about Barnes bullets say that they love speed.

I have had one of those Hornady's fail, but I don't blame the design. This may have been one faulty bullet out of a lot of 10,000. That bullet hit the deer in the rib at about 3000 fps and exploded, ruining the on-side shoulder. What was left of the bullet penetrated about 3", collapsing the on-side lung and shredding the heart. It looked like a small explosion had happened in that deer's chest. I know all this because I found him and dragged him out. He hadn't gone far.

On a side note, I helped my uncle cut up his elk today that he shot with a Barnes Triple Shock I think he said. With his 270 WSM and that thing is pure junk. It didnt even expand to full caliber diameter as far as I'm concerned. It had lots of penetration. Quartering away and the bullet went thru the gut, thru the vitals and imbedded in the base of the neck by the shoulder. He did get the elk however.

When it left the barrel it was full caliber diameter. The bullet went through the gut, thru the vitals and lodged in the base of the neck. Y'all dragged it out. It sounds to me like that bullet did just exactly what it was designed to do.

Unfortunately, so many hunters think that picking up a box before deer season is all the ammo they need ...... "One Boxers" ....... (exits, muttering)....

I had a rifle like that once, I didn't reload for the caliber, and just picked up a box of ammo. Four rounds later the rifle was zero'd and I had 16 rounds left to hunt with. Very accurate little rifle in 7mm-08, and as it turns out, I never loaded for that caliber. I'd pick up one box of ammo per year and I very seldom shot more than 20 rounds a year from that rifle. I didn't need to. Everything I shot at with that rifle fell over and kicked.

I lost that rifle during a divorce, and I admit that I miss the rifle a whole lot more than I miss the woman.

 

[Brian Pfleuger]

It didnt even expand to full caliber diameter. It had lots of penetration.

As PawPaw points out, the bullet was "full caliber diameter" when it left the barrel.

What is the final diameter of the bullet?

It sounds to me like it performed exactly like every anecdote I've ever heard regarding the TTSX bullets, meaning perfectly. I've never heard of a failure to expand (at speed), I've never heard of the bullet coming apart (except a "petal" or two on heavy bone) and they always penetrate like crazy.

Of course, you're apparently not even sure that's the correct bullet so I think it's a little silly to pass judgement based on no information.

 

[jimbob86]

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbob86
Unfortunately, so many hunters think that picking up a box before deer season is all the ammo they need ...... "One Boxers" ....... (exits, muttering)....

I had a rifle like that once, I didn't reload for the caliber, and just picked up a box of ammo. Four rounds later the rifle was zero'd and I had 16 rounds left to hunt with. Very accurate little rifle in 7mm-08, and as it turns out, I never loaded for that caliber. I'd pick up one box of ammo per year and I very seldom shot more than 20 rounds a year from that rifle. I didn't need to. Everything I shot at with that rifle fell over and kicked.

The "One Boxers" I was referring to only shoot the 4 rounds to "zero" .... and nothing else all year ..... in any caliber.

 

[jlove1974]

Hmm I see I struck a nerve when I mentioned core-lokts and failure in the same sentence. We've got a guy in our club that had complete core separation at the 'locking crimp' etc. They are not a bonded bullet, just a fact.

I've shot corelokts out of my .30-06, when I was shooting groups to decide.
The regular ones and the premiums shot like crap in my Browning so I moved on. Winchester power points shot well out of my wife's Savage .243, but when we finished the box (and my son shot a nice buck with it) I moved all our centerfire ammo to Fusion. It's as cheap as a Corelokt or WWB ammo but just a superior bullet.

I have a .243 Fusion 95gr bullet that we recovered from my wife's 175-lb 8 point buck that she shot 20 days ago. I'll post a pic but here's the run down:

Buck was 80 yards, quartering away at an extreme angle. She shot him 3 inches forward of the rear ham, bullet travelled thru the deer, thru the heart, and lodged into the neck. The buck made it almost 30 yards in a death leap. My B-I-L recovered it while processing the neck roast.

It was fully expanded, completely extended petals and retained 82% of the weight. I feel like if she would have a mechanically locked or otherwise unbonded core bullet, it would have had jacket separation. Would the buck have died? Probably. But for the same money, I'll have to really work to find a better bullet.

 

[Brian Pfleuger]

Didn't strike no nerve with me.

I've seen Core-Lokts fail. Fail, as in not hold together, still killed the deer. Main reason I investigated and went with TTSX for my own loads.

 

[jlove1974]

Here's pix:

Also, at my local Dick's sporting goods,as of today Federal Fusion ammo costs $19.48 with a 2.50 mail in rebate per box. Core-Lokt is $16.98 with a rebate making it 14.98. $5.00 extra is cheap insurance. And Federal doesn't believe in sending out pre-tarnished brass in every box

 

[militant]

Any of the name brand soft points in 100 grains should work fine.

 

[Brian Pfleuger]

I like the TSX. This is someone else's picture:

 

[jlove1974]

no doubt the TSX is a fine bullet as well. But we aren't required to use lead-free bullets here in NC, and it's about ten to twenty bucks more a box and harder to find locally. I would try some if someone gave me a box
If I were hunting with a AR15 in .223/5.56 then I would definitely go with the TSX.

 

[Brian Pfleuger]

They are pricey but if you load your own they're cheaper than any normal factory ammo. Factory TSX ammo runs like $47/20 last I looked. I load my own for about $13/20.

 

[jlove1974]

Yep that's what they cost around here for factory loaded TSX or TTSX. I am still saving .243 brass to justify buying a set of dies for it. Once I hit 100 or so, then we will probably start working up some hot loads. But Fusion bullets are available as components too, and darn near cheap as dirt too.

Any of the electrofused or copper-core bullets are a step above cup and core, and for your average 100-150lb deer they will do just fine. My son absolutely CRUSHED a big bodied 5-pointer last year with the 100-gr Winchester power points, but it was a 40 yard shot in the high shoulder and he was done. That's when I realized that the .243 gives up nothing to a bigger caliber if it's put in the vitals. It's a 'mini-magnum' in my book

 

[reloader28]

Brian, in case you didnt notice, your bullet expanded to more than caliber diameter. It looks great.
I said my uncles didnt expand to even caliber diameter. To make it simpler, it means the nose didnt open up at all. It was no better than a FMJ. And it even hit a bone and was bent like a banana. I dont have pictures cause he's 80 miles away. Some people love them and get good performance with them, we will never buy anymore or recommend them to anyone. The reason they get so much penatration could be because they dont expand as they're supposed to.

I didnt mean to hi-jack this thread any further, so I wont go on about this anymore.

Sorry Jevyod.

 

[jlove1974]

Ya that bullet I posted expanded out from .243 to around .403, and I think Federal loads it to fly around 2980 fps (probably from a 24" barrel).
If I were loading some barrel-burning .243 loads, I'd probably go with something just a tad more robust like a Barnes TSX. But the boattail fusion performs like a premium bullet at a fraction of the cost. It's pretty slippery and doesn't give up much in the way of ballistics to the tipped deer grenades like SSTs.

 

[Brian Pfleuger]

Brian, in case you didnt notice, your bullet expanded to more than caliber diameter. It looks great.
I said my uncles didnt expand to even caliber diameter. To make it simpler, it means the nose didnt open up at all. It was no better than a FMJ. And it even hit a bone and was bent like a banana. I dont have pictures cause he's 80 miles away. Some people love them and get good performance with them, we will never buy anymore or recommend them to anyone. The reason they get so much penatration could be because they dont expand as they're supposed to.

I didnt mean to hi-jack this thread any further, so I wont go on about this anymore.

Sorry Jevyod.

All I can say is that your experience is the polar opposite of every story I've ever heard about Barnes bullets. The reason they penetrate is weight retention, not lack of expansion. They wouldn't kill the way they do if they didn't expand. I've seen picture after picture of TSX bullets that look just like that picture and sometimes better and they've penetrated animals, from wild hogs to deer to water buffalo, sometimes literally from end to end.

I would hesitate to completely write-off a proven performer because of a singular failure.

Also, I've interacted with Barnes reps on several occasions and found them informative, friendly and helpful. I bet they'd love to have that bullet back to see why it failed.

 

[PawPaw]

I said my uncles didnt expand to even caliber diameter. To make it simpler, it means the nose didnt open up at all.

Okay, now you've confused me. If the bullet was full caliber when it left the barrel and it wasn't full caliber when you recovered it, did it shrink? Trust me, that bullet was full caliber diameter when it left the muzzle. It may not have expanded, but it probably didn't shrink to below full diameter.

Once I hit 100 or so, then we will probably start working up some hot loads.

You don't need hot loads in the .243. I'm pushing a 100 grain bullet at 3100 fps (my rifle, my chronograph) and I'm not yet to the max load. I quit when the group shrank to under an inch. I've shot some wonderfully small 3-shot groups, but this 5-shot group is about average of what my bone-stock rifle is capable of doing.

Hmm I see I struck a nerve when I mentioned core-lokts and failure in the same sentence. We've got a guy in our club that had complete core separation at the 'locking crimp' etc. They are not a bonded bullet, just a fact.

No, you didn't strike a nerve at all. Core-Lokt's are good bullets, but they're standard cup-and-core construction. Remington makes them, literally, by the millions. But, yeah, they're known to fail. However, if you consider the failure, you recovered the bullet, so... the game animal was laying somewhere you could find it. There's nothing especially wrong with Core-Lokt's, just that they're not premium bullets. They've killed a whole lot of game.

 

[jlove1974]

Yep, they have killed alot of game this is true. But the cap and ball revolver has killed alot of men in the civil war, but I don't see alot of military and LEOs carrying it anymore. I think they were both designed around the same time, right?