.223/5.56 - Would you own it if not for a semi?
- Thread starter Blade37db
- Start date
I started in .223 with ARs. I really liked the round and what it could do as a varmint and predator rifle. But what I found was that my AR 223, set up to hunt coyotes and whistle pigs, was about 3-4 lbs heaver than my deer rifle.
I like ARs. I like the privilege of owning them. I really enjoyed specing and building them from the ground up. But what I found is that I don't like carrying them around in the woods an fields.
So to make a long story short, I ended up with a .223 Ruger Predator with AR mags (Ruger 26944). It is the most fun gun I have ever owned. It weighs 3 lbs less than may lightest .223 AR did with the same scope on it. With Federal Fusion it groups 3/4" at 100 yds. With Winchester Ballistic Silvertip 55 grn Varmint rounds, it groups a little tighter still! I'm thinking I might ask Ruger if they give a bulk discount on cases of 10!
I like ARs. I like the privilege of owning them. I really enjoyed specing and building them from the ground up. But what I found is that I don't like carrying them around in the woods an fields.
So to make a long story short, I ended up with a .223 Ruger Predator with AR mags (Ruger 26944). It is the most fun gun I have ever owned. It weighs 3 lbs less than may lightest .223 AR did with the same scope on it. With Federal Fusion it groups 3/4" at 100 yds. With Winchester Ballistic Silvertip 55 grn Varmint rounds, it groups a little tighter still! I'm thinking I might ask Ruger if they give a bulk discount on cases of 10!
montanaoffroader
New member
Yes, I would.
I owned a Savage .223 bolt gun long before I owned a AR15. I still have it, no plans to get rid of it any time soon. It's a great gopher gun and the .223 is a pretty good varmint round, IMO.
That said, I really like my AR's. Fun to shoot, relatively easy to customize, and cheap ammo. My biggest problem with them is keeping them from disappearing when my daughters stop in for a visit...........
I owned a Savage .223 bolt gun long before I owned a AR15. I still have it, no plans to get rid of it any time soon. It's a great gopher gun and the .223 is a pretty good varmint round, IMO.
That said, I really like my AR's. Fun to shoot, relatively easy to customize, and cheap ammo. My biggest problem with them is keeping them from disappearing when my daughters stop in for a visit...........
johnwilliamson062
Moderator
If you want a centerfire .22 bolt gun it makes sense in comparison to the other cartridge options for most. Cheaper, more widely available, etc. Henry also has a long ranger in 223.
bamaranger
New member
Sure
You ready for this.......I don't really have any strong feelings for the AR. Yes, our longest running military rifle, and it leaves me lukewarm. The AR comes across to me as a great tool, but I went a long time before I bought one, and don't shoot the one I have very much.
First .223/5.56 firearm I shot was a Mini14. In fact, the Mini was the agency rifle for about a decade or so from the late 1970's. Then they switched to the AR platform and have remained with it, as has about everybody else. But the AR left me cold. The full size rifle, especially the A2 version, seemed way to long and heavy for the cartridge. The M4/carbine arrangement, as long as there's not to much hardware hung on it, appeals a bit more. But not by much. I don't have a Mini14 either, though it appeals more than the black rifle.
What I do shoot, more often than the AR, is a Interarms MiniMauser bolt rifle. I had to tweak the bedding a bit, and it is fussy about ammo with the slow twist, but it is light, classic, has a decent trigger, shoots as well as I can hold, and to me, visually appealing. I've had several different scopes on it, and am still looking for just the right glass. The current 3x9x40 is just a bit too big.
I also just picked up a Savage Hog Rifle in .223. Not as pretty as the MiniMauser, nor as light, but a real workhorse and I don't see worrying about scratching it up. It'ss faster twist rate should let me use some heavier slugs. The fixed 10x w/ turrets and a 20degree base should let me reach as far as the cartridge is able.
I like the cartridge as it's relatively cheap to load for......25 gr or so of powder is about half what you drop in a .30 cal. Also, .223 slugs are a good bit cheaper than .30's as well. But to 300 yds or so, a 2" high zero at 100, will mimic .30 cal trajectory, so the .223 is a good practice rifle.
You ready for this.......I don't really have any strong feelings for the AR. Yes, our longest running military rifle, and it leaves me lukewarm. The AR comes across to me as a great tool, but I went a long time before I bought one, and don't shoot the one I have very much.
First .223/5.56 firearm I shot was a Mini14. In fact, the Mini was the agency rifle for about a decade or so from the late 1970's. Then they switched to the AR platform and have remained with it, as has about everybody else. But the AR left me cold. The full size rifle, especially the A2 version, seemed way to long and heavy for the cartridge. The M4/carbine arrangement, as long as there's not to much hardware hung on it, appeals a bit more. But not by much. I don't have a Mini14 either, though it appeals more than the black rifle.
What I do shoot, more often than the AR, is a Interarms MiniMauser bolt rifle. I had to tweak the bedding a bit, and it is fussy about ammo with the slow twist, but it is light, classic, has a decent trigger, shoots as well as I can hold, and to me, visually appealing. I've had several different scopes on it, and am still looking for just the right glass. The current 3x9x40 is just a bit too big.
I also just picked up a Savage Hog Rifle in .223. Not as pretty as the MiniMauser, nor as light, but a real workhorse and I don't see worrying about scratching it up. It'ss faster twist rate should let me use some heavier slugs. The fixed 10x w/ turrets and a 20degree base should let me reach as far as the cartridge is able.
I like the cartridge as it's relatively cheap to load for......25 gr or so of powder is about half what you drop in a .30 cal. Also, .223 slugs are a good bit cheaper than .30's as well. But to 300 yds or so, a 2" high zero at 100, will mimic .30 cal trajectory, so the .223 is a good practice rifle.
Sure Shot Mc Gee
New member
Bought a new walnut stocked Rem Model 7 223 a long long time ago. At a time when keyed bolt locks were a new security promotion to the market place. Never have been fascinated by or had a erg to own a Black Rifle. "Just a matter of a fellers need and some other fellows > has no use for."
223 shooter
New member
Same here. But even before the bolt rifles my first .223 was a 14" Contender. Have owned/own 223 bolts actions from Remington , Savage and CZ. My most fired 223 is a Rem 700LTR.
About 15 years after I started shooting .223 in a rifle I finally picked up my first AR and it was a Rock River varmint.
One of my favorite "mobile" woodchuck rifles is my Browning Low Wall, single-shot rifle, chambered in .223 Remington, with a Burris Compact 3x9 scope. Though I already had a Ruger Mini-14 and an AR rifle when I bought the petite Browning, I would have chosen the .223 round regardless.
Imo, the .223/5.56, along with the .222 and .222 Magnum, are some of the best cartridges available for varmint hunting in the rolling hills and farmlands as found in midwestern states like Ohio.
For denser population areas, I hunt with either a .22 Magnum Savage or a .22 Hornet Browning bolt-action rifle. For wider, flatter terrain having fewer people, I like the .220 Swift cartridge, chambered in a Ruger Number One, single-shot rifle. But for everything in-between, it's hard to beat the .223/5.56 cartridge.
Imo, the .223/5.56, along with the .222 and .222 Magnum, are some of the best cartridges available for varmint hunting in the rolling hills and farmlands as found in midwestern states like Ohio.
For denser population areas, I hunt with either a .22 Magnum Savage or a .22 Hornet Browning bolt-action rifle. For wider, flatter terrain having fewer people, I like the .220 Swift cartridge, chambered in a Ruger Number One, single-shot rifle. But for everything in-between, it's hard to beat the .223/5.56 cartridge.
Nope. Have zero use for it out of a bolt gun, as I've already got .22WMR's.
The Army kinda cured me of wanting one for a long time...
altho the temptation to get one, and Cerakote it in General Lee colors & whatnot
has been an interest lately, just to honk off liberals...well...
But without semi-auto? Buttload of rounds out there that do better on everything.
It's too small for deer in Florida. They'll let you use it on pig,
but .30-30 works far better on pig and deer.
Heck, for that matter, so does 10mm & .44magnum.
Florida being Florida, most shots on game are taken at 125 yards or less.
it's just too brushy...lotsa undergrowth and tiny bushes.
And all varmints smaller than pig or deer can be taken with .22WMR at those ranges, easily.
Added bonus that nobody is looking to take away our rimfire bolt-action rifles with 4-rd mags
So without being semi-auto, it's kind of a useless caliber here.
With semi-auto, it's probably good for repelling a Cuban invasion...maybe a Chinese one...
but I'd rather have an M60...as I prefer my enemy combatants to be DRT.
The Army kinda cured me of wanting one for a long time...
altho the temptation to get one, and Cerakote it in General Lee colors & whatnot
has been an interest lately, just to honk off liberals...well...
But without semi-auto? Buttload of rounds out there that do better on everything.
It's too small for deer in Florida. They'll let you use it on pig,
but .30-30 works far better on pig and deer.
Heck, for that matter, so does 10mm & .44magnum.
Florida being Florida, most shots on game are taken at 125 yards or less.
it's just too brushy...lotsa undergrowth and tiny bushes.
And all varmints smaller than pig or deer can be taken with .22WMR at those ranges, easily.
Added bonus that nobody is looking to take away our rimfire bolt-action rifles with 4-rd mags
So without being semi-auto, it's kind of a useless caliber here.
With semi-auto, it's probably good for repelling a Cuban invasion...maybe a Chinese one...
but I'd rather have an M60...as I prefer my enemy combatants to be DRT.
Attachments
This is like saying that because you have a bolt rifle chambered for .22Short, you have no use for a bolt rifle chambered in .22WMR. Or because you have a bolt rifle chambered in .357Mag there's no point in having one chambered in .35 Whelen.
The .223, with the same bullet weight and barrel length will propel the projectile more than twice as fast as a .22WMR.
Which came first... the chicken or the egg? This is sort of a circular discussion... would the .223/5.56mm be so popular if it wasn't chambered in the AR vs would the AR be so popular if it wasn't chambered in .223/5.56mm? I submit to you that I would own an AR if it was chambered in .123 Puffball if the ammo was as cheap and plentiful as .223/5.56mm is, particularly if it was GI issue (almost guaranteeing it's success as a civilian round.)
If the AR or it's equivalent didn't exist, then, no, I probably wouldn't own a firearm chambered in .223/5.56mm... I am more a fan of the .30 cal cartridges, and the rifles chambered in them.
If the AR or it's equivalent didn't exist, then, no, I probably wouldn't own a firearm chambered in .223/5.56mm... I am more a fan of the .30 cal cartridges, and the rifles chambered in them.
Model12Win
Moderator
I'd love a bolter in the cart.
Don Fischer
New member
I've ad two 223's. An L461 Sako and a 788. Both shot well and in those days I did shoot a gopher or two. These day's I have no use for a 22cal CF of any kind. If I did I find a 222 Rem, most accurate cartridge I ever owned. I suspect if I shot sage rats, a 223 might be nice but I've never shot the first rat. If I had a 223 it would seldom get shot.
As for bolt actions, I've owned a lot of rifle's over the years. One Rem 760 and every other one a bolt. I really have no desire to own a semi auto of any kind.
As for bolt actions, I've owned a lot of rifle's over the years. One Rem 760 and every other one a bolt. I really have no desire to own a semi auto of any kind.
Let's see, I have 2ea AR mid-length 16" carbines, a scoped AR 20" rifle for long range, a scoped Savage Model 10 bolt, and a irons 583 Series Mini-14. They are all great plinking and/or small game guns and I enjoy the caliber. That said, I also have a 40s&w carbine, leverguns in 22lr, 357mag, 45 Colt, and 30-30 as well as scoped leverguns in 300 Savage and .308 In addition, I have semi auto M1 Garands, M1 Carbines, and M1As plus a Win Model 70 in 30-06. I handload for all of them except the 22lr and I mostly shoot the 357mag leverguns and the Mini-14 followed closely by the M1A and M1 Carbine.
Would I keep a 5.56 caliber rifle? Absolutely.
Would I keep a 5.56 caliber rifle? Absolutely.
223 shooter
New member
Yeah if it came down to getting rid of my AR Varmint or 700LTR bolt I would definitely keep the bolt 700LTR. The Rock River Varmint can fire the relatively heavy 77 MatchKings pretty darn accurately though. I might get 1 in 8" 223 barrel for the Savage 12BVSS and try the 77s in that.
muzzleblast...
New member
Yes. I owned a .223 bolt action varmint rifle long, long before I ever bought an AR.
Just pointing out that the .223 was developed based on the .222 magnum. So there was plenty of varmint use for a .223 sized cartridge long before the AR platform came along (a multitude of similar cartridges shot in bolt actions).
I find it a very affordable centerfire cartridge for short/medium range target shooting and plinking.
I find it a very affordable centerfire cartridge for short/medium range target shooting and plinking.
After using a .30-06 for varmints and deer and it packed quite a wallop. I could even bounce a 150 grain bullet into a chuck on its mound sometimes. Of course, the '06 was primarily a deer/bear cartridge, but it was great practice to hunt woodchucks and crows with it.
I finally got a .22-250 and it was a great varmint cartridge, but due to it's taper had case-stretching issues that somewhat decreased case life and required lots of trimming. However, springtime wind deflection in Maine was a problem beyond 200 yards.
Like the .223, it also had considerable wind deflection, so I switched to the 6mm Rem and that cured the problem, but the heavy-barreled varmint rifle it was in was a pain to carry around all day.
Now, my favorite longer-range varmint cartridge is the .243 Win. I love how it hangs in there in the wind and delivers a great punch on an eastern coyote beyond 200 yards.
JP
I finally got a .22-250 and it was a great varmint cartridge, but due to it's taper had case-stretching issues that somewhat decreased case life and required lots of trimming. However, springtime wind deflection in Maine was a problem beyond 200 yards.
Like the .223, it also had considerable wind deflection, so I switched to the 6mm Rem and that cured the problem, but the heavy-barreled varmint rifle it was in was a pain to carry around all day.
Now, my favorite longer-range varmint cartridge is the .243 Win. I love how it hangs in there in the wind and delivers a great punch on an eastern coyote beyond 200 yards.
JP