1st carry handgun - CZ P-01

O

oncnawan

Inactive
Just picked up my first carry gun, a CZ 75 P-01. I am waiting for two holsters from Alien Gear, one IWB and one OWB. I need the OWB for suit trousers, which are fitted to my waist, whereas my other pants are loose fitting enough to accommodate the IWB carry, I hope.

I have had my concealed carry permit for over a year, but never got serious about carrying until some recent life changes and then an incident at work last week really put me in a different frame of mind. Though I have always had an abstract belief that more people should carry, and that I should be one of them, I feel an obligation to carry now, even more than before.

I am looking for a good option to carry a spare mag and also would like to find some classes to gain basic shooting skills. My wife has expressed an interest in getting her concealed carry permit. Looks like now is the time.

I plan on carrying in condition 3 for a while before moving to condition 2. While I understand and agree with the logic behind condition 2 carry in a DA/SA, I want to grow accustomed to carrying before I remove that extra step from being ready to fire. Did any of you do the same? Or, did you just start carrying condition 1 or 2 right away?

Any other words of advice are welcome.
 
I plan on carrying in condition 3 for a while before moving to condition 2. While I understand and agree with the logic behind condition 2 carry in a DA/SA, I want to grow accustomed to carrying before I remove that extra step from being ready to fire. Did any of you do the same? Or, did you just start carrying condition 1 or 2 right away?
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I did that when I first started carrying. It did not take long to realize that carrying chambered was no great risk as long as I followed the 4 rules.

Do what makes you feel comfortable, but realize that

Condition 3 gives you a small club IMO.
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Is pretty much true IMO as well.
 
Load the chamber drop it to the half cock notch with the deckcoker and learn to shoot the DA trigger pull and manage the DA/SA transition.

The P01 should serve you well.
 
I carry my Beretta PX4 Compact with a round chambered, hammer down, in an in-the-waistband holster right above my right front pants pocket. It is pointing at a favorite body part of mine. But I have no concerns carrying this way because I know the pistol will not go off unless someone pulls the the long, double action trigger.

I was watching a movie the other night which showed two guys robbing a diner. They just got up, pulled their guns and started shouting. I'm guessing if I'd have been there at the time, having to chamber a round before firing probably wouldn't have been a good idea. Yanking the pistol and pulling the trigger seems so much better.

Something to think about. Crime tends to rush upon you. It never moseys on up slowly so you have time to think about loading your weapon.
 
It probably won't take long for you to be comfortable moving to condition 2 (which is how I would recommend carrying), but until then, carry how you need to. As far as your inquiry about carrying an extra mag, I would recommend this:

http://www.amazon.com/Safariland-Co...32175199&sr=8-2&keywords=horizontal+mag+pouch

Being horizontal makes it very comfortable, since it won't dig in like a vertical one would. it also goes pretty well unnoticed, even if your belt is exposed. I love mine.
 
Thanks for the replies.

I appreciate the advice about using the decocker. That is how I plan to carry, eventually, and the DA/SA with decocker was one of the reasons I chose the P-01. I am pretty OCD about safety stuff in activities that are higher-risk (climbing, rappelling, non-carry firearm use with the Boy Scouts, motorcycle riding, etc.), but I know that accidents DO happen, even to careful people.

I am not really worried about causing a negligent discharge while carrying under normal circumstances. I won't be fingering the holster, etc. However, I am concerned about transitions, holstering, drawing, etc. I spend a lot of time in courthouses, so I will be carrying IWB on the way to the office, switching to OWB when I change into my suit for the drive to court, placing the pistol in a lockbox either in my vehicle or at the courthouse upon arrival, reholstering the pistol after court, and switching to IWB back at the office. Finger off the trigger, of course, at all times, but I plan on giving it a week or two for things to settle in before going to Condition 2.
 
I actually did the exact same thing for a long time when I first got my CCL. Yes, it does make you less 'ready' if something happens, but you're ztill better off than being unarmed. And while I consciously know nothing is going to magically materialize inside the covered trigger guard, it did help me get used to the psyhological burden that comes with carrying.
 
If you are going to be doing a lot of holstering/reholstering and plan to carry IWB I HIGHLY recommend looking at a holster that has a belt clip. That way you can take the holster off quickly, and put it back on quickly. The gun never has to leave the holster, and therefore has very, very little chance of anything bad happening.

I've been using a Wild Bill Covert Carry a lot for situations like these, its comfortable, conceals well, has a tuckable option and goes on/off very easily.

Even when I have to disarm during the day (sadly, at work :mad:) my Glock never has to leave its holster transferring from my hip to the lock box, and back.

OWB there are also several options that allow quick removal/addition of the holster without removing the firearm from the holster, paddles and those wrap-around belt things (yes, that's the technical term :D)

http://www.wildbillsconcealment.com/covert_carry.htm
https://www.rdrholsters.com/store/display/2210/132/the-iwb-holster-cz
 
First of all, welcome to TFL, oncnawan!

Welcome to concealed carry, as well!

Second, when I first started CCing, I also carried Condition 3. Like you, I wanted to take some time to get used to carrying before I started carrying in Condition 1. I never have carried in C2, but I've never owned or CCed anything with a decocker, either. Manually lowering the hammer on a live round is just not something I'm comfortable with, even after almost 5 years of CC.

A few things in your posts caught my eye.
oncnawan said:
. . . .I spend a lot of time in courthouses, . . . .
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So do I. My office is in a no-guns environment. If I'm not in the office, where I cannot carry, I'm over at the courthouse, where I cannot carry. So while I may not have all of the solutions for your situation, I have dealt with the same CC issues.

That said, I took a look at what you posted and have bolded some things for emphasis.
oncnawan said:
. . . . I am not really worried about causing a negligent discharge while carrying under normal circumstances. I won't be fingering the holster, etc. However, I am concerned about transitions, . . . .I spend a lot of time in courthouses, so I will be carrying IWB on the way to the office, switching to OWB when I change into my suit for the drive to court, placing the pistol in a lockbox either in my vehicle or at the courthouse upon arrival, reholstering the pistol after court, and switching to IWB back at the office. Finger off the trigger, of course, at all times, but I plan on giving it a week or two for things to settle in before going to Condition 2.
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That's a LOT of transitions for your day. Every transition means handling your pistol, in one fashion or another. It also means carrying two holsters, unless you get one that is convertible from IWB to OWB and back.

If I might make a suggestion, get a tuckable IWB and stick with one holster. You'll need pants that are an inch or two larger than normal, but it's worth it. I strongly recommend a CrossBreed Supertuck or one of its clones. You can tuck your shirt in over the holster, and you can remove the holster without having to entirely undo your belt. That's what I use, and here's what I do on days when I have court:
  1. Suit up.
  2. Pistol goes into CBST, over the shirt, but under the jacket.
  3. When I arrive at work, pistol goes in safe in the car.
  4. When I get to my office, CBST goes in a desk drawer.
  5. Go to court.
  6. When I leave the office (for anywhere other than court), CBST goes back on belt.
  7. When I get to the car, pistol goes back in CBST.
If I worked in an office in which I could carry, my routine would look like this:
  1. Suit up.
  2. Pistol into CBST.
  3. If I have to go to court, CBST & pistol into safe.
  4. Reverse process at the end of the day.
One of the things about the CBST & its clones is that you can tuck your shirt in over the pistol, so that the only evidence of its presence is the belt clips. And from what I understand, there are Velcro clips that actually go under your belt, so that's even more discreet.

Also, I don't know if you ordinarily wear a jacket at work. I don't necessarily wear the jacket, but I always have to have one in case I get called to court. The bottom line on suits and blazers is that you can CC just about anything you want under one. I usually carry IWB, over the shirt, under the jacket. If my wife and I go out to dinner, I make a quick stop in the restroom, tuck the shirt in over the pistol, and I can then remove my jacket at dinner. Yes, the pistol remains concealed. I pulled this routine for dinner one night last week, and Mrs. McGee actually asked me after dinner if I had been carrying!

Finally, be sure you get a proper gunbelt. I'm a firm believer in having a good gunbelt. It's the foundation of your whole carry system. I wanted one that wasn't an obvious gunbelt, so my first one was an Aker B21. I've worn it the whole time I've carried and nobody has ever asked me if it was a gunbelt. My second gunbelt is a DeSantis Econobelt. Not the fanciest belt, but it works, it's economical, and doesn't look (too much) like a gunbelt.

Good luck on this new adventure and let us know if you have questions.
 
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I appreciate the advice about using the decocker. That is how I plan to carry, eventually, and the DA/SA with decocker was one of the reasons I chose the P-01. I am pretty OCD about safety stuff in activities that are higher-risk (climbing, rappelling, non-carry firearm use with the Boy Scouts, motorcycle riding, etc.), but I know that accidents DO happen, even to careful people.
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I've always carried guns that I can acquire and fire upon a target quickly, reliably, and accurately with. At various times I've carried my Glock 17, my Commander Length 1911, my Sig P225 and P228, and lately my HK P30 9mm (V3, SA/DA). I have not carried my CZ 75B, although it can be carried as least as well as a full size 1911. Most anything can work as long as you train & practice with what you carry. For my own purposes, chambered & decocked DA/SA hammer fired pistols probably work best as EDC guns. That P-01 is an ideal carry gun, it shoots as well as the full size CZ's and the decocker makes it easy to carry. The "new" CZ P-07 with the updates is another good choice, the fact that you can swap out a safety or decocker in a few minutes is amazing!
 
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I carried for a number of years in Condition Three, too, just to feel comfortable with carry first. I recommend it. Yeah, my friends teased me for it, because it isn't "tactical." Yes, your gun becomes less useful, but it is the safest way to carry.

To me, carrying concealed is not something somebody should just do without practice, and in my opinion, Condition Three is a good intermediate zone in between Condition 1. Once I had never had a negligent discharge, which I realize is impossible uncocked and unloaded but I mean a situation where my finger goes inside the trigger guard and presses the trigger, then I felt comfortable carrying in Condition 1.

For me, Condition Three was a good way of feeling safe while practicing good indexing, keeping your index/trigger finger high on the slide, and muzzle control.

Granted, I don't know what's right for you, and Condition Three while safe is certainly "worse" than Condition One.

Good holsters and good belts are a good idea. I like my Crossbreed, but I'll admit that it is kind of a pain in the butt to take on and off all the time, so it might not be the best idea for you, but it does have clips... it's just that the clips are so stiff that they are almost like loops. I like "The Beltman" leather belts (http://www.thebeltman.net/index.htm). You can go all the way up to horse or kydex reinforced whatever is your budget or preference. I like my horse + kydex reinforced belt a lot and it doesn't look like a CC belt, just a high-quality leather belt.

Oh, finally, I know a lot of people will say that nylon webbing belts are good, and they are, but for my millage, they fray when in contact with regular metal clip-style attachments. Think about it. If you clip and unclip your holster a lot (which I do) and you wear it a lot while moving (on walks for me), then there is a lot of wear. Nylon frays and once the fraying starts, it can get really snarly and nasty and eventually just fails. Leather wears, but does not wear much and doesn't fray as it wears. My 5.11 belt lasted me about 4-6 months with my Crossbreed holster. My leather belt hardly shows wear after about two years.
 
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Welcome to TFL! You've already got some excellent advice here. As Spats McGee suggested, you want to simplify things. With whatever holster system you've got, spend some time wearing it when you are not at work. See if it's comfortable. Practice drawing and reholstering in various circumstance, with your gun unloaded. Develop confidence before taking it on the job, both so you can be proficient and so you can wear it with peace of mind. If a tuckable IWB works for you and you can find the right one for your needs, slowly transitioning your wardrobe to the right waist size is worth it. You'll also want to invest in a decent gun belt.

Just a thought but do you always wear a jacket, blazer, or other cover garment at work? Shoulder holsters might be old school but they can be both comfortable and a lifesaver if you need to draw from certain positions.

As per carry condition, I strongly advise against an unchambered transition phase. It's not just the inherent drawbacks of that carry method. Remember: simplicity. You said you plan on carrying "Condition 2". So practice and develop memory skill with that method, right off the bat, every time. That includes handling practice with an unloaded gun. The goal is to make it second nature: comfortable, confident, and safe.

BTW, don't worry if you end up trying lots of different holsters on the way to finding what works best for you. Some of us get lucky on the first try but a lot of us have boxes of old holsters. It costs money but look at it as an investment in R&D. :rolleyes:
 
Welcome! After many years, I finally obtained my CCL a little more than a year ago. Like most, I have quite a few holsters, but I have "stuck" with one style in particular. Have you by any chance tried any of the "Sticky" holsters? The CrossTuck-type holsters are obviously very good and most like them very well, but with as much as you will have to take your firearm on and off, the sticky-types might be very helpful to you. It is so easy to just stick the holster/gun into your waistband where you like it, and pull the combination out just as easily. Your gun never needs to leave your holster. I love them. The primary brands are Remora, Sticky, and Stays-Put. The Remora has much more variety as far as the type of holster you want. I like the Sticky material better than Remora. The Stays-Put is more of a pocket holster, but can be used as an IWB as well on sub-compacts.

However, a couple of caveats:

*Tucked shirt. I almost always wear an untucked shirt, so it is very easy to just lift the shirt and stick the holster/gun in. Remora does have a tuckable option, however, along with some with clipped versions as well.

*Time. It takes some time to get used to the fact that these holsters are not going to fall down your pants. I occasionally adjust them when in and out of vehicles, but that is also a plus...that you can adjust for the feel of the day.

I carry crossdraw, but these holsters are great for any position.

Again, great adjustability, and just removing the holster/gun together are nice advantages. Also, they are fairly cheap, so not too big of a deal to try them out.

There are also many very well-made tuckable holsters out there with one strong clip. I have several of these as well, and with the right kind of clip, these can be installed and removed with the gun in the holster. I generally wear these with scrubs, gym shorts, or any pants without a belt.


As an aside, I have always carried every gun (except one)with one down the chamber and ready to fire. I suppose that is condition 2. (SIG's, Kahr, XDm, Taurus TCP). It did take me awhile to become comfortable carrying cocked and locked (condition 1) with my little Colt Mustang, or subsequently my SIG p238. At this point, it does not bother me at all. Do what you need to do to feel comfortable, though. It takes awhile to not feel enormously self-conscious when carrying, let alone the condition one is carrying in.
 
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Thanks for all the advice and words of welcome! I am excited to begin carrying, but also cognizant of the responsibility that comes with it. I have got two holsters coming soon, so I'll be able to figure out what works for me. Reading your responses has helped me understand that I have time to figure all of this out. I want to know and do it all right now, but I realize that I can take it easy and take my time with the whole process.

I am not excited about buying suit trousers two inches larger than my actual size. I will have to balance that against the OWB holster when the holsters arrive. I do realize that sticking with one holster removes at least two transitions during the day. Time will tell.

I appreciate the collective wisdom of the forum and all of your help thus far. I will update throughout the process.

EDIT - I have not looked at the sticky holsters. I will take a look.

My listed work scenario doesn't happen every day, as I don't go to court every day. My most frequently visited courts are just around the block from my office, so I would just change into my suit, leave the gun and holster at the office and then re"install" the holster on my belt when I get back to the office.

I am looking into a basic handgun course in or around Ogden, Utah. Does anyone have any experience with, or opinions on, Utah Tactical Coaching, LLC? http://www.utahtacticalcoaching.com/index.html
 
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You picked a winner in the P-01. It can do it all. Carry, range work, and home defense. I have a 75D PCR which is very similar except no light rail, and it is superb. Congrats on a great choice.
 
Aliengear holsters came in the mail yesterday. The OWB hoster was as ordered, but they sent an IWB with neoprene backing, instead of the leather backing I ordered. I contacted customer service and the rep told me that they will ship out the correct IWB holster and told me to keep the neoprene backed holster. Huzzah for good customer service!

I am waiting on a belt from A&G Custom Gun Leather. Very excited. Need to find a place stocking Speer Gold Dot 124 +P ammo in 9mm. Everyone seems to be out of stock.
 
Congrats on your P-01!

I'll echo what others have said concerning carrying; with one of my DA/SA pistols, one's in the chamber, and it's decocked (@ the 1/2 cock position). As for holster choices, I prefer an IWB with wide-spaced belt loops. For me those provide better retention than loops positioned right beside each other or clips. However, if wearing shorts/pants without belt loops, good clip retainers are a must!

Concerning ammo, it's not +P, but I wouldn't be so worried about it:
http://www.ammunitiondepot.com/Order-CCI-Speer-9mm-124-Grain-JHP-p/53618.htm

But if you must have +P (though HST vice Gold Dot)....
http://www.ammunitiondepot.com/Federal-Premium-Tactical-HST-9mm-147-Grain-P-Ammo-p/p9hst4.htm

http://www.ammunitiondepot.com/Federal-Premium-Tactical-HST-9mm-124-Grain-P-Ammo-p/p9hst3.htm

Enjoy your purchase and practice, practice, practice!
 
Nice deal getting 3 holsters for the price of 2! I like the neoprene backed Alien Gear, personally. It has been super comfortable for me, and I don't get a sweaty side. The OWB gave me some trouble with reholstering at first - the decocker lever on my P07 was getting caught up on the top of the leather backing. I used the included parts kit to make the top front mount a bit looser than the top rear one, and it is now nice and smooth.
 
Concerning ammo, it's not +P, but I wouldn't be so worried about it...
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I generally don't in 9mm. With high-quality modern ammo, I wonder how much extra you really get in terms of actual effect on a threat versus increased wear and tear on the gun. (Exactly how much it increases wear and tear on particular models is another popular topic.) Yeah, I know most people don't feed their guns steady or exclusive diets of their high-priced carry ammo. Yeah, people want the best in the rare occasion that they'll need it. I believe in practicing with what I carry. I also like to refresh my carry ammo on a regular basis, which means periodically emptying my active magazine downrange, followed by a good clean and lube.
 
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