185 or 230gr in 3 inch 1911.

Wow, there is a lot of good info here (maybe my 2 cents can add to it).

There is no way you can go wrong (as far as killing/stopping power is concerned) with a major caliber gun (.45/.44/.41/10mm/.40). 230gr is does the job, but if you can't handle to recoil to place two shots in the proper body cavity, to cause that permenate damge, in the quickest time, then go with a lower grain.

Velocity is not the be all to end all when you talk about stopping someone. Can anyone honestly say that a 230gr out of a 3-inch barrel will "bounce off someone's chest?"...of course not. What you want is maximum tissue damage from a controllable package.

Dude as long as you are .45 you are good to go. I would be more concerned with overpenetration.

You can't compare "defensive" rounds with FMJ.....that is just bad ju ju. We are talking about killing someone right...not just target shooting.
 
Whoa! Thanks alot! I think Im going to stick with 230gr.

It works flawlessly, 185gr just doesnt seem right to me. Maye its a mental block thing, but my .40SW was 180Gr...yaknow?

Thanks for all the info guys. This is a good thread!
 
Don't forget that this is something that is an individual decision, and may require a lot of research and consideration before you feel comfortable making an informed decision with which you feel satisfied.

It's also a subject that causes a lot of discussion and which doesn't generate a lot of 'agreement'.

FWIW, the revised Winchester 185gr STHP (Silver Tip Hollow Point) in .45 ACP offers what many folks feel is an acceptable compromise for personal defensive ammunition from the perspective of reduced felt recoil, acceptable reliability and accuracy, as well as expansion. Even Winchester, however, admits that this is intended to be a bullet which offers less penetration than the ammunition commonly being marketed to L/E. A Winchester L/E rep once told me that Winchester deliberately intends this to be a round which exhibits more shallow penetration than the ammunition contained in their Ranger line.

I'll paraphrase, but remember that when Federal first introduced their Personal Defense line of ammunition, they basically said they felt most civilian users wouldn't ever require ammunition with the characteristics necessary to defeat the sorts of intemediate barriers encountered by L/E users, and that deep penetration wasn't considered necessary for ordinary civilian ammunition.

Their current advertising reads:
Premium® Personal Defense® (Featuring Hydra-Shok® bullets)
We hope you'll never have to use our Premium® Personal Defense® ammunition in a critical situation. But if you do, you'll appreciate the increased muzzle velocity and energy compared to standard loads, and the rapid bullet expansion that delivers instant stopping power. You'll also appreciate that recoil is significantly reduced. In addition, our unique clear packaging lets you see the ammo before you even open the box.

Personally, even though I prefer a 230gr bullet in my defensive pistols, if I owned a small-framed .45 that exhibited a 'preference' for a 185gr load, and demonstrated it's best functioning with a 185gr load, I'd use the 185gr load and focus on training.

I'm restricted to using a JHP/BHP by agency policy, in both my issued and my personally owned, off-duty weapons. That means there's a lot of ammunition out there that I'm not permitted to use (i.e. FMJ, expanding non-HP, etc.), but which is preferred by some other folks.

When I carry a chosen load, whether it's issued or personally purchased and approved for off-duty usage, my focus is on potentially using it when invoking my peace officer powers, which can mean some situations not commonly encountered by non-L/E.

Some folks have concerns about the potential for over penetration, which seem reasonable. Other folks have concerns about under penetration, which seem reasonable.

A lot of folks seem to forget the risk offered by bullets which are fired and miss their intended target, and hit an unintended target somewhere else.

While it's certainly an often enjoyable subject for polite discussion to 'debate' the relative merits of different ammunition commonly used for the purpose of lawful defense, it's obviously necessary to remember that in the final analysis we're talking about the potential use of deadly force. I'd spend sufficient time becoming familiar with the laws governing the use of deadly force, and considering the potential criminal & civil repercussions of using it.
 
I'm using 230 grain +P Gold Dots in my Kimber Ultra Carry. Its been reliable and I think the bullets are launched with sufficient velocity.
 
I seem to remember that the all Copper (barnes) bullets Taurus has did well out of short barrels

I will try to find the data
 
Note--The RD was calculated by averaging the smallest and largest diameter of each recovered projectile (ex. .47 x .87 = .67). Averages for 5 shots noted below:
9 mm Black Hills/Barnes 105 gr copper JHP
Bare: VEL = 1426 f/s, PEN = 12.9” RD = 0.62”, RW = 104.4 gr
Denim: VEL = 1417 f/s, PEN = 12.7”, RD = 0.60”, RW = 104.7 gr
Auto Glass: VEL = 1444 f/s, PEN = 13.6”, RD = 0.41”, RW = 88.6 gr

.45 ACP Taurus/Barnes 185 gr copper JHP
Bare: VEL = 921 f/s, PEN = 11.7”, RD = 0.67”, RW = 184.4 gr
Denim: VEL = 922 f/s, PEN = 11.0”, RD = 0.67”, RW = 185.8 gr
Auto Glass: VEL = 924 f/s, PEN = 13.6”, RD = 0.48”, RW = 184.6 gr

While the .45 ACP copper JHP is slightly deficient in penetration, I would not hesitate to use this load when a lower penetration projectile is desired--it is more versatile in different potential engagement scenarios and far superior compared to Triton Quickshok, Aguila IQ, Magsafe, Glaser, etc...
 

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Basically, any JHP cannot be expected to expand reliabily with less than 800 muzzle velocity, IMHO. I carry Hornady 200gr. in my Kimber Ultra Carry. Velocity is a little over 900, good expansion, good bullet weight, low flash and accurate.
 
Something to think about:

The heavier the bullet, the longer it stays in the bore and the more pressure it generates.

I have heard (no experience on my own) that the 3" 1911's are almost lacking in enough barrel to get sufficient energy to rack the slide.

If I noticed that 165's or 180's were leaving me out of battery or not fully running the slide, I would increase bullet weight to get more pressure into the spring.

Take my 2 cents and get some change from it.:p
 
I think you make a good point, azredhawk. I haven't had the problem...165gr works fine in my gun. That's why I compromised on 200gr, enough velocity to mushroom properly with enough weight.
 
I'd feel better with 230. Most .45 ACP ammo is designed for 5" or at least 4" barrels. 3" will sap a lot of velocity off the round and it isn't going all that fast to begin with. If I can't have fast bullets I figure I might as well have heavy ones. Of course 230grn is all I'd use in any .45 anyway. If I wanted light and fast, I'd use my 9mm.
 
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