You don't live in a Republic. Stop acting as if you do.

Jack 99

New member
"...And this is the tendency of all human
governments. A departure from principle in
one instance becomes a precedent for a
second, that second for a third, and so on
'til the bulk of the society is reduced to be
mere automatons of misery, to have no
sensibilities left but for sinning and
suffering..." -- Thomas Jefferson.

Damn near prophecy if you ask me. If there's one defining characteristic of a Republic, one thing that really makes it different from Democracies or anything else, its the concept of Rule of Law, IMHO.

Given the "Rule by Decree" policies of the current administration, and the increased powers of Federal bureaucrats, and the complicity of the courts, and the lack of initiative on the part of the Legislative branch to curtail the usurptation, I have to ask the question:

Do Americans, in all practicality, still live in a Republic?

Our Constitution is completely ignored. You cannot deny it. Case in point, there is a "Gore Tax" on your phone bill. Don't look for it there, you won't see it. Passed by Congress, the funds are to be used to expand the Internet to libraries and schools. So what's the problem, Jack, you ask? First, its completely hidden. Second, the FCC is in control of how much the tax will be. That's right, powers EXPLICITLY granted to Congress by the Constitution are now in the hands of unelected, unaccountable bureaucrats. We're not talking about "grey area" here, we're talking about an exclusive function of the Leglislative branch usurped by a Federal Bureaucracy. That's not a Republic, that's not adherence to rule of law.

Now we have the Federal Courts decreeing that the FBI can keep NICS records for 6 months. Here you have CLEAR and EXPLICIT leglislation, carefully drafted by our legislative branch, that in no uncertain terms mandates the destruction of these records (for the record, I don't believe they are EVER destroyed, but let's pretend for the sake of argument that the FBI will follow the law).

What's the reaction of the unelected, unaccountable, FBI? "We need to keep those records anyway, to, uhhh, audit and stuff." Well, its not thier job, or thier right, or thier perogative, to do this. So they get taken to court, which is fine and dandy, that's one of the checks and balances built into the system. Yet despite the CRYSTAL CLEAR wording of the legislation, the Clinton-stacked court decides it doesn't like the law and it really should be different, so we're going to amend it (the court didn't come out and say it, but that's essentially what they did was amend the legislation). Well, break out your handy copy of the Constitution. THAT'S NOT THE COURT'S PEROGATIVE!! Not only that, these judges are also unelected and unaccountable to the people. Can you say "Rule of Men?"

Similarly, the FBI, we now learn, is intercepting emails through the Carnivore system (lots of irony in that name). Not email of known criminals or those under investigation, but everybody's email. That violates the principle of innocent until proven guilty. No "grey area" here either. Its exactly why the 4th Amendment exists, to keep the government from conducting "blanket investigations." Too bad, so sad, we're doing it anyway.

Then you have Clintoon decreeing millions of acres off limits by Executive Order. Interestingly, Executive Orders are not found anywhere in the Constitution. There are no laws, to my knowledge, governing EOs. Where did this power come from? Consent of the governed? Nope. These were just made up out of thin air, and as Jefferson observed, grew by precedent until now, the Prez is essentially appropriating funds, which is also very clearly not within his Constitutional powers. Why do we even have Congress? Obviously Clinton can run the whole show by himself.

If you really want to know what's going on, just listen to the rhetoric:

"Stroke of the pen, law of the land. Kinda Cool."

And how many times have we heard Clinton talk about "the will of the people is being thwarted by Congress." Usually right after that he issues a new decree. Is that a Republic? When the opinion polls reach a certain level, its OK for the Prez to go ahead and issue a mandate with that infamous "stroke of the pen"?

I would start in on the illegality of the 16th Amendment and the refusal of the courts to even hear the VERY VALID, VERY WELL DOCUMENTED FACTS surrounding the illegal, unConstitutional passage of that amendment. Unfortunately, we'd be out of server space very quickly. Suffice to say, this is the ultimate "wink wink, nudge nudge" fraud ever perpetrated by the gubmint. I guess that First Amendment guarantee of being able to redress greivences is just about as null and void as the Second Amendment's guarantee.

Other examples abound.

That's where we are today, a Republic in name only. Sadly, its not even recognized by the masses. Not that many would care anyway.

I don't know what we do, except hang on to our "Liberty Teeth" and shout from the rooftops, but you and I don't live in a Republic anymore and probably haven't since FDR. We should at least be honest with ourselves about that. Year after year it gets worse. I'm hopeful the next administration will turn things around, but realitically either Bush or Gore will probably maintain the status quo. Its that whole precedent thing Jefferson noted.

When you talk about your rights, remember that while they still exist and can never be eradicated by govt, the mechanisms by which they are guaranteed, the BOR and concept of Rule of Law, no longer exist. They fell with the Republic. Its just something you should keep in mind.
 
"and the lack of initiative on the part of the Legislative branch to curtail the usurptation"

**Why should they - we elected them - and knew.

Altogether a good rant that echos my sentiments well. I'm disgusted with the sheeple, the government and I can't do a damn thing about it.

I also keep hearing "maybe the next administration will turn things around..."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!

Not going to happen. The bottom line is: the will of the sheeple will be done.

CMOS :(

------------------
NRA? Good. Now join the GOA!

The NRA is our shield, the GOA will be our sword.
 
Ooops. Another example just reared its ugly head. This stuff happens almost daily now:

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

EPA Defies Congress On Water Pollution

By DAN MORGAN And JULIET EILPERIN
Washington Post
July 12, 2000

WASHINGTON - The Clinton administration, in direct defiance of Congress,
Tuesday issued far-reaching environmental rules that will require states to
control the pollution runoff into thousands of lakes and rivers that officials
called "the greatest remaining threat to America's waters."

The action by the Environmental Protection Agency will require states to
make comprehensive pollution surveys of more than 40,000 bodies of water
over the next 15 years. They will have to produce their first lists of polluted
lakes and rivers in April 2002 and subsequently develop cleanup plans.

The EPA move circumvents an effort by Congress to block the issue of the
new regulations as part of a new spending bill approved in both houses and
scheduled to be signed Thursday by President Clinton.

With Tuesday's action, the EPA will still not be able to fund the
enforcement or implementation of the rules until at least October 2001. But
it forces Congress to come up with some definitive new action of its own if it
wants to stop the program from going into effect.

Clinton called the EPA action a "critical, common-sense step" to clean up
the nation's waterways. But House and Senate members, including several
Democrats, complained that the administration was simply trying to
cement its environmental legacy in the final months of the administration.

"All of this is no more than a political power grab by the people who are
running the EPA," complained Rep. Marion Berry, D-Ark. "They have no
sound scientific reason for doing any of these things."

Sen. Larry Craig, R-Idaho, called the EPA move "a slap in the face of the
policy-making body of this country," while Thomas Donohue, president of
the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, predicted it would be the first in a series
of moves by the administration to sidestep Congress in the final months of
the administration.

"The executive branch should not circumvent decisions by the Congress
unless the president personally vetoes a law," said House Appropriations
Committee Chairman Bill Young, R-Fla. "Congress on a bipartisan basis
expects that the law is the law." In a reference to EPA Administrator Carol
M. Browner, who made Tuesday's announcement, Young said "an agency
head should understand that."
 
Taz: You may not have even realized what a good point you have there. Bureaucracy derives their imagined authority only from the recognition of the people. If the people were to ignore them.. then what? They'd have been, essentially, "fired".

Jack: I don't know...? Shoudn't we try "working within the system" for a few more years before speaking so pesimisticly??? Maybe we should "vote for change"?

yeah right.
 
TAZ,

The EPA's SWAT team would come in & kill 'em all - for their own good. Have some pictures taken with children afterwards - maybe swimming next to Al Gore's canoe(after that extra water release) - if it's good for one photo op, certainly good for another.

This latest EPA thing is targeted straight at the farmers. Say good-bye to food.
 
1) I am "voting for change." Whenever that's brought up here I get slammed so I'd rather not go down that road.

2) The whole point is that "the system" isn't what we think it is, or should be. "We" are playing by the rules and haven't figured out its become a free-for-all.

3) Hmmmm. "Just ignore them and they'll go away." Maybe, maybe not. Maybe I'll get into the Idaho Legislature once I've moved up there and start floating the "Republic of Idaho" idea. If any state would do it, Idaho would be it.

I thought about the farmers when I read that too. All of those restrictions seem aimed right at them. I guess our food doesn't cost enough so the EPA is going to inflate the price for us with a few more regulations. Hope you like $6 carrots.
 
Gentlemen, it boils down to the fact that "voting" will not change anything because the overwhelming majority of the people are "sheeple". They simply do not care or do not understand.

"We" are the minority.

So, again, what can we do, if anything?

CMOS

------------------
NRA? Good. Now join the GOA!

The NRA is our shield, the GOA will be our sword.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TAZ:
What would happen if the states told the EPA to shove it?[/quote]

Boston Tea Party II ?

Skyhawk
 
Well there's lots you can do. Many of us are doing things we should, joining NRA, GOA, writing letters, etc.

The whole point of the post is that you should be aware that "the rules" are not being followed and you should bear that in mind when you're ranting on about your rights, or this politician, or that agency, how could the court have ruled that way, yadda yadda yadda.

It ain't supposed to be this way, but this is what we've become, something other than a Republic. I'm not even sure exactly what it is we are.

Ron Paul introduces legislation once in a while that tries to "right the ship" so to speak. I have mixed feelings on these. On the one hand, its nice to know someone in Congress recognizes the problems. On the other hand, what good does it do to write a law to force the gubmint to obey an existing law, or the Constitution? If they're going to ignore the Constitution, what good does it do to pass more laws? Obviously they're not worth the paper they're written on.
 
Bear in mind that it is over. Whatever the U.S.A. once was had been slowly eroding for a century and was gone by 1980. What we are left with is a hodgepodge of conflicting authorities who hold one another in contempt while the people caught in-between are taxed into poverty and regulated into defenselessness.

There is no point in whining about it or clinging to some type of political idealism that you learned in a ninth grade civics class. All you can do now is get down in the muck and fight it out for what you believe is rightfully yours. History and God will sort it out.

If you are too dainty or delicate for this operation, you can always opt out and go watch must-see TV. Oprah is waiting for you.

The odd thing is that the U.S. was destroyed on the grounds that the next change or reform was all about democracy and equality. What you see around are the bitter fruits of the mobs and elites tearing at the bloody scraps of the failed experiment. The fallacy of democracy is that people act with a sense of enlightned self-interest. Instead, they are largely cowards and fools who can be bought off by corrupt politicians with bread and circuses.

People get the government they deserve. Americans are getting theirs now.

Stay sober, stay alert, and keep your powder dry.

------------------
We have never been modern.

[This message has been edited by Trevor (edited July 18, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by Trevor (edited July 18, 2000).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jordan:
Jack: I don't know...? Shoudn't we try "working within the system" for a few more years before speaking so pesimisticly??? Maybe we should "vote for change"?
[/quote]


Let's see what the next few years have instore for America *pulls out industrial strength consentrated Magic Eight Ball (tm)*

><Dee-dee-dee-lup><><Dee-dee-dee-lup><><Dee-dee-dee-lup><><Dee-dee-dee-lup><

October 1, 2000:
California's Attorney General, under powers given to him in the Roberti-Roos Assault Weapon Act, outlaws ALL semiautomatic handguns and rifles. States "California will now be a crime free zone."

November 7, 2000:
Bush is elected president.

Sometime in 2001-2002:
Gunowners working within the system are ignored by elected represinitives. Congress passes Roberti-Roos nationaly. Reps state, "We know what's best for you. Now go back and chew your cud."

January 23, 2012:

The new president vows that crime will be abolished. Former gun owners and those who fight for the Constitution are marched off to re-education camps. A resistance forms, but has little success as they can only fight back by throwing rocks.

><Dee-dee-dee-lup><><Dee-dee-dee-lup><><Dee-dee-dee-lup><><Dee-dee-dee-lup><

Back to reality.

We keep forgeting a few major points. This country has LEFT the Constitution. Once that happened, it ceased to be a Constitutional Republic and became a socialist democracy. Those elected to office had NOTHING to fear from the people, thus allowing them to forget about things like The Bill of Rights, The Federalist Papers, The Declaration of Independance, ect.


When the people fear the government, there is tyrrany. When the government fears the people, there is liberty.

Do you fear the government? Your should right now. Either we bleed a little now, or bleed alot then....

The time to fight and give the government something to fear is now.
 
Back
Top