I have always been interested in WWII weapons, and have recently decided to purchase my first WWII rifle. The big question is, which one??? Im basically looking at three options, the enfield #4, the mauser 98k, and the garand (which is actually out of the price range right now.) Could you tell me how much I should expect to pay for each rifle and what I should look for when trying to find one that would be safe to shoot. Any other Info you could give me would be helpful as well. Also, is it safe to order through shotgun news sight unseen. I see mausers and enfields all the time for $65-$95 dollars. Are these actually good deals or rusted out weapons?? Thanks for your help.
WWII Rifles for shooting??
- Thread starter Bob S
- Start date
Danger Dave
New member
Bob S,
First, I have to warn you, buying WWII weapons will be addictive. It is not, however, particularly hazardous - except to your savings account.
Second, you picked some good ones to choose from. Eventually, you will want a good shooter (because you really do want to know what it's like to fire these rifles, after all) of all three, and you should probably throw in a Carcano and a Mosin Nagant, just to keep things on an even keel. Then there's the different variations of each, the other service rifles, the handguns, SMG's, etc., etc.
See, I told you it was addictive!
Personally, I would start with the Enfield, either a #4Mk1 or #4Mk1* (Canadian made). Then, I would get the Mauser. Then, save up, get the Garand (you should look into the CMP for that) ASAP. I wouldn't argue with anyone who picked a different order - it's mostly personal taste & interest. All three are pretty doggone rugged weapons, that if well cared for, you can pass on to the next generation.
I have purchased some of those "$65-100" Enfields - some are in good shape, some are not so good. That's surplus rifles for you. As far as actually purchasing your rifle, I would recommend spending a few extra dollars and try to find it at a local gun store or gun show, or maybe even a pawn shop. That way, you can actually see what you're getting. I've just heard a few horror stories from people who ordered surplus rifles (and a few "I got better than I expected" stories, too). Getting a rifle you know you'll be happy with is worth a little extra time & money.
Enjoy!
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Beginner barbarians probably had the idea that every house they broke into would be full of untouched loot and frightened, unarmed victims. It just doesn't work that way, my friend.
I hope these evil men come to understand our peaceful ways soon - My trigger finger is blistering!
First, I have to warn you, buying WWII weapons will be addictive. It is not, however, particularly hazardous - except to your savings account.
Second, you picked some good ones to choose from. Eventually, you will want a good shooter (because you really do want to know what it's like to fire these rifles, after all) of all three, and you should probably throw in a Carcano and a Mosin Nagant, just to keep things on an even keel. Then there's the different variations of each, the other service rifles, the handguns, SMG's, etc., etc.
See, I told you it was addictive!
Personally, I would start with the Enfield, either a #4Mk1 or #4Mk1* (Canadian made). Then, I would get the Mauser. Then, save up, get the Garand (you should look into the CMP for that) ASAP. I wouldn't argue with anyone who picked a different order - it's mostly personal taste & interest. All three are pretty doggone rugged weapons, that if well cared for, you can pass on to the next generation.
I have purchased some of those "$65-100" Enfields - some are in good shape, some are not so good. That's surplus rifles for you. As far as actually purchasing your rifle, I would recommend spending a few extra dollars and try to find it at a local gun store or gun show, or maybe even a pawn shop. That way, you can actually see what you're getting. I've just heard a few horror stories from people who ordered surplus rifles (and a few "I got better than I expected" stories, too). Getting a rifle you know you'll be happy with is worth a little extra time & money.
Enjoy!
------------------
Beginner barbarians probably had the idea that every house they broke into would be full of untouched loot and frightened, unarmed victims. It just doesn't work that way, my friend.
I hope these evil men come to understand our peaceful ways soon - My trigger finger is blistering!
C
CHEMNCO917
Guest
Bob S.... of COURSE the Garand!!...
but as you say, it can be a little out of the price range....
but never fear... it will turn out to be the best of the lot....
as for the Mosen-Nagant (Russian/Finn), the Enfield (UK) and Mauser 98k series (Swede or German)are generally pretty good for reworking into a good shooter.....
which one will depend upon $$$$$ and what you want to do with it and, also, if you are a collector....
some collectors will pay more for a version of a Finn MN than for the Garand.!!!...
a couple of us are in the process for converting German/Swede 98K's that are in "fair" shape only (cracked stock etc) into .308 sporters....
well.... I am doing the .308 and a buddy is doing a .30-06.....
I choose the .308 because I already have a couple of .30-06’s and no .308’s and my friend is the opposite.
We avoid the Enfields for our own reasons, so do not discount them… that may, indeed, be the best one for you…
we, also avoid the MN’s because that is REALLY a hard and costly thing to do…IF you succeed (I have only seen one in my life and it was a POS).
I recommend that you go visit the TUCO forums and read and ask more questions there…. That board is designed for Mauser/MN/ and such and then you will have the data you need for a decision They may be found at : http://www.mosin-nagant.net/index.html, then go to “Interactive Area” then pick a forum…..
Good luck….
but as you say, it can be a little out of the price range....
but never fear... it will turn out to be the best of the lot....
as for the Mosen-Nagant (Russian/Finn), the Enfield (UK) and Mauser 98k series (Swede or German)are generally pretty good for reworking into a good shooter.....
which one will depend upon $$$$$ and what you want to do with it and, also, if you are a collector....
some collectors will pay more for a version of a Finn MN than for the Garand.!!!...
a couple of us are in the process for converting German/Swede 98K's that are in "fair" shape only (cracked stock etc) into .308 sporters....
well.... I am doing the .308 and a buddy is doing a .30-06.....
I choose the .308 because I already have a couple of .30-06’s and no .308’s and my friend is the opposite.
We avoid the Enfields for our own reasons, so do not discount them… that may, indeed, be the best one for you…
we, also avoid the MN’s because that is REALLY a hard and costly thing to do…IF you succeed (I have only seen one in my life and it was a POS).
I recommend that you go visit the TUCO forums and read and ask more questions there…. That board is designed for Mauser/MN/ and such and then you will have the data you need for a decision They may be found at : http://www.mosin-nagant.net/index.html, then go to “Interactive Area” then pick a forum…..
Good luck….
Danger Dave
New member
Hmm. I assumed that you wanted to keep them in "as-issued" condition when I wrote my first post. If you're looking to sporterize a military rifle for hunting, I would definitely go with a Mauser. Mostly because parts for sporterizing the Mauser are cheaper and easier to find.
Good Luck!
Good Luck!
You can get a very nice Enfield No 4 for around $100 if you order it yourself, or about $125 to $150 if you buy from a dealer. I recommend going to: http://www.aimsurplus.com/
They are a great company to do business with. Many people start their collecting with an Enfield because they are so plentiful and in such good shape - hard to buy a bad one.
I second you going to Tuco's forum. Great info on what the best deals are at the time. And the best deals keep changing!
They are a great company to do business with. Many people start their collecting with an Enfield because they are so plentiful and in such good shape - hard to buy a bad one.
I second you going to Tuco's forum. Great info on what the best deals are at the time. And the best deals keep changing!
Mike Baugh
New member
Bob S , the old military rifles are addicting . I have a Enfield No4 MKII , a Polish Mosin 44 and a Romanian Mosin 44 . These guns are a lot of fun . They are the ones that everybody wants to see when you open the safe . I also recommend Tucos forum . Good luck , Mike...
Daryl Waldron
New member
I would go for the Enfield as my first WWII rifle. But I think you should get the rifle that feels right to you. It would be hard to go wrong with any of the ones you have listed.
If you go with the Enfield, Gino is right, Aim is the best way to go, IF you have your C&R FFL.
Be careful the WWII rifles do have a way of multipling
.
Tuco is outstanding place to start, but Gun and kife is also very helpful. http://www.gunandknife.com/boards/
Good luck in your search, and welcome.
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TOUJOURS PRET
Swamprat
[This message has been edited by Swamprat (edited November 12, 1999).]
If you go with the Enfield, Gino is right, Aim is the best way to go, IF you have your C&R FFL.
Be careful the WWII rifles do have a way of multipling
. Tuco is outstanding place to start, but Gun and kife is also very helpful. http://www.gunandknife.com/boards/
Good luck in your search, and welcome.
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TOUJOURS PRET
Swamprat
[This message has been edited by Swamprat (edited November 12, 1999).]
Destructo6
New member
Don't knock some of those surplus rifles. My Polish M44 (Mosin-Nagant) is surprisingly accurate, once I cleaned the packing grease from it. The design is a bit ugly (it's a Russian gun!) and the carbine versions can be brutal to shoot, but I think I received way more than the $120 I paid for it.
My Lee-Enfield No4Mk2 is one of the prettiest rifles I've seen. I haven't been pleased with the accuracy, but I haven't really looked into it. It will certainly put a round into a man-sized target at 200 yards, but it won't put out 1moa. I had to a longer bolt head for the Enfield, as its headspace was a bit out of spec (not a big deal).
My next surplus, bolt gun, acquisitions will be, probably, either a German Mauser or Yugoslav copy. I've also been looking at Chech VZ-24s, which if I'm not mistaken is a Mauser copy itself (have a soft spot for Czech guns).
My Lee-Enfield No4Mk2 is one of the prettiest rifles I've seen. I haven't been pleased with the accuracy, but I haven't really looked into it. It will certainly put a round into a man-sized target at 200 yards, but it won't put out 1moa. I had to a longer bolt head for the Enfield, as its headspace was a bit out of spec (not a big deal).
My next surplus, bolt gun, acquisitions will be, probably, either a German Mauser or Yugoslav copy. I've also been looking at Chech VZ-24s, which if I'm not mistaken is a Mauser copy itself (have a soft spot for Czech guns).
I would recommend Empire Arms, Ormond Beach, FL for hand selected milsurp guns, esp. for beginners, like me. I bought a Mauser 96 I'm quite happy with there. I will say that it was imported by Samco, which retails the same gun cheaper. Dennis Kroh, the owner of Empire is a middle man who weeds out the crap from these larger suppliers and sells the best ones.
You may get a really good gun cheaper elsewhere, but the aforementioned company would be a good way to go if you just want the gun and not a posible lemon or fixer-upper. Note that it is better to buy your accessories (stripper clips, slings, etc.) from a big dealer.
You may get a really good gun cheaper elsewhere, but the aforementioned company would be a good way to go if you just want the gun and not a posible lemon or fixer-upper. Note that it is better to buy your accessories (stripper clips, slings, etc.) from a big dealer.
I would go for a M98 Israeli FN mauser in 7.62[Nato] stamped on their receiver.The last and best of the surplus rifles in my opinion, stay away from the Yugo/Nazi M98s with the arctic(Russian front)trigger guards -unless at a super-good price and in SSAA perfect bore condition, as they are ruff...er..rough.
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***Big Bunny***
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***Big Bunny***
Nestor Rivera
New member
if you are going to SHOOT it a lot you will propably need to make sure you have a good ammo source.
.303 brit - no prob NEW US stuff
.30-06 - duh
7.62x54R - Go witht the S&B stuff it is good and non corrosive
6.5x55 - US or PMC both new production.
7.92x57 & 7x57 Mauser both new and surplus in great numbers
The Hard Stuff .......
6.5 Carcano - only made by Norma & Lapua (I think ) and cost more than the gun
7.7 & 6.5 Jap See above
8x56R Plenty of surpuls but NO new mfg. components are available but costly.
Remember that ALL surplus ammo should be considerd Corrosive until PROVED otherwise.
.303 brit - no prob NEW US stuff
.30-06 - duh
7.62x54R - Go witht the S&B stuff it is good and non corrosive
6.5x55 - US or PMC both new production.
7.92x57 & 7x57 Mauser both new and surplus in great numbers
The Hard Stuff .......
6.5 Carcano - only made by Norma & Lapua (I think ) and cost more than the gun
7.7 & 6.5 Jap See above
8x56R Plenty of surpuls but NO new mfg. components are available but costly.
Remember that ALL surplus ammo should be considerd Corrosive until PROVED otherwise.
Bob S.
When I was in the Corps at 29 Palms, I bought several WWII era rifles. My favorite is the Russian made Mosin Nagant. Had it refinished, new stock made, and the trigger adjusted. Shoots like a dream. Was my primary coyote rifle while still in 29 Palms. Non-corrosive ammo is no longer that hard to find. Lapua makes some great stuff, but it will break your wallet if you are an every weekend shooter. Reloading data exixts for the 7.62x54 cartridge, but is not all that extensive in scope. The 7.62x54 is comparable to either the .308 (7.62x51) NATO, and the venerable .30-06. Performance for most ammo for this rifle falls somewhere in between the two. I shoot 150gr FMJ by Lapua. Good luck.
[This message has been edited by antenna (edited November 16, 1999).]
When I was in the Corps at 29 Palms, I bought several WWII era rifles. My favorite is the Russian made Mosin Nagant. Had it refinished, new stock made, and the trigger adjusted. Shoots like a dream. Was my primary coyote rifle while still in 29 Palms. Non-corrosive ammo is no longer that hard to find. Lapua makes some great stuff, but it will break your wallet if you are an every weekend shooter. Reloading data exixts for the 7.62x54 cartridge, but is not all that extensive in scope. The 7.62x54 is comparable to either the .308 (7.62x51) NATO, and the venerable .30-06. Performance for most ammo for this rifle falls somewhere in between the two. I shoot 150gr FMJ by Lapua. Good luck.
[This message has been edited by antenna (edited November 16, 1999).]
I like the Lee Enfield No.4 Mk 2 and No.5 Mk1 (Jungle Carbine). With these two you get a decent peep sight. This makes it much more user friendly than the others. Recoil is mild due to .303 being a low intensity cartridge.
The No.4 Mk2 also has a slightly better trigger than its predecessor the No.4 Mk1. These rifles can be accurized to some degree. I have had sub 1.5" 5 shot groups with my 100 yd No. 4 Mk2. It was slightly modified.
The Jungle Carbine is harder to find but it looks real cool. It weights only 7.5 lb. Some of these rifles suffer from a wandering zero problem. I know of one rifle that had this problem and the owner fixed it by completely bedding the barrel (he glued the barrel onto the stock). The best I could do with mine was 2" at 100 yd.
Will
The No.4 Mk2 also has a slightly better trigger than its predecessor the No.4 Mk1. These rifles can be accurized to some degree. I have had sub 1.5" 5 shot groups with my 100 yd No. 4 Mk2. It was slightly modified.
The Jungle Carbine is harder to find but it looks real cool. It weights only 7.5 lb. Some of these rifles suffer from a wandering zero problem. I know of one rifle that had this problem and the owner fixed it by completely bedding the barrel (he glued the barrel onto the stock). The best I could do with mine was 2" at 100 yd.
Will