dave_in_delaware
New member
Here's a scenario that played out for me and my fiancee just this past Monday night.
I had taken her up to Scranton, PA (2.5 hour drive each way - ouch) to see her favorite band in concert. The concert started at 8, went until about 11, it took us a while to get out of the building, and then we walked back to the parking garage. There were already tons of cars lined up to get out of there, so we decided to stand at the car, and cool off, and re-hydrate w/ some soda we had brought along, wait for the line of cars to die down... No problem.
Anyway, these 4 guys walk past us to their SUV, parked about 5 spaces away from my car, and start playing music really loud, pissing on the wall (rude, but ok), talking really loud, etc. They were younger and a bit intoxicated (ok, really intoxicated). We stood at the car for about 20 minutes, just watching them, and the cars going past us, etc. As time went on, the group of 4 punks started getting slowly closer to us. It didn't seem like it was on purpose, but maybe it was. [I went to college in Philadelphia, and I've been in a few stupid fights, and know that a group of guys inching towards you is not a good thing] So, I tell my fiancee to get in the car, that those guys are getting too close for my confort level. We both get into the car, and pull out of the space, and wait our turn in the line of cars to leave the parking garage. Technically, those guys didn't do anything wrong, except get progressively closer to me and my fiancee. Maybe I'm just paranoid, or overly protective of my girl. OK, I'm both.
Sorry for a no-action story, but this is a hypothetical kind of post now. FYI: I don't have my CCW yet. I had thought about a home defense kind of scenario, but not this kind. I'd love to hear your opinions on my thoughts and questions here:
What if those guys would have suddenly rushed up on us? If I was carrying, would I have been able to unholster my gun and at least point it at them in time? What if I didn't have time to say anything? Do they deserve a verbal warning? What about a warning shot? Would I have been justified in just opening fire on the closest one without any warnings like "Stay back" or "STOP" ? Even if I hit one of them and he stopped, there were still 3 others....
Or, if they weren't rushing us, and just kept getting closer (be it accidentally or purposely), would just saying "Please don't come any closer" or "Could you guys please go back over closer to your vehicle?" be enough? Of course, if they didn't, or decided to get all macho, I guess warning them I'm armed would be justified, and if they still don't then drawing the weapon would be a necessity. Then what? Have them all get down on the ground, etc etc.. until the police come, or just stay down until we drive away? What does one do in a situation like that?
Or, even though I have as much of a right to stay at my car and they stay at their's, if they are advancing, is my only legally acceptable possibility to just turn tail and get in the car to avoid a situation? Actually, I guess I'll read up on my State code again. I do have it all saved on my hard drive.
I'm just asking these questions now since I'm thinking of it, and imagining if it hadn't panned out the way it did, and those guys were looking for trouble, what should I have done, or could I have done? As a responsible gun owner and [future] CCW owner, I want to know what I can/should do in a situation like that. So many questions. I know hindsight is usually 20/20. How would you have reacted to these situations? Any of your thoughts, comments, tips, etc. would be appreciated. Thanks.
I had taken her up to Scranton, PA (2.5 hour drive each way - ouch) to see her favorite band in concert. The concert started at 8, went until about 11, it took us a while to get out of the building, and then we walked back to the parking garage. There were already tons of cars lined up to get out of there, so we decided to stand at the car, and cool off, and re-hydrate w/ some soda we had brought along, wait for the line of cars to die down... No problem.
Anyway, these 4 guys walk past us to their SUV, parked about 5 spaces away from my car, and start playing music really loud, pissing on the wall (rude, but ok), talking really loud, etc. They were younger and a bit intoxicated (ok, really intoxicated). We stood at the car for about 20 minutes, just watching them, and the cars going past us, etc. As time went on, the group of 4 punks started getting slowly closer to us. It didn't seem like it was on purpose, but maybe it was. [I went to college in Philadelphia, and I've been in a few stupid fights, and know that a group of guys inching towards you is not a good thing] So, I tell my fiancee to get in the car, that those guys are getting too close for my confort level. We both get into the car, and pull out of the space, and wait our turn in the line of cars to leave the parking garage. Technically, those guys didn't do anything wrong, except get progressively closer to me and my fiancee. Maybe I'm just paranoid, or overly protective of my girl. OK, I'm both.
Sorry for a no-action story, but this is a hypothetical kind of post now. FYI: I don't have my CCW yet. I had thought about a home defense kind of scenario, but not this kind. I'd love to hear your opinions on my thoughts and questions here:
What if those guys would have suddenly rushed up on us? If I was carrying, would I have been able to unholster my gun and at least point it at them in time? What if I didn't have time to say anything? Do they deserve a verbal warning? What about a warning shot? Would I have been justified in just opening fire on the closest one without any warnings like "Stay back" or "STOP" ? Even if I hit one of them and he stopped, there were still 3 others....
Or, if they weren't rushing us, and just kept getting closer (be it accidentally or purposely), would just saying "Please don't come any closer" or "Could you guys please go back over closer to your vehicle?" be enough? Of course, if they didn't, or decided to get all macho, I guess warning them I'm armed would be justified, and if they still don't then drawing the weapon would be a necessity. Then what? Have them all get down on the ground, etc etc.. until the police come, or just stay down until we drive away? What does one do in a situation like that?
Or, even though I have as much of a right to stay at my car and they stay at their's, if they are advancing, is my only legally acceptable possibility to just turn tail and get in the car to avoid a situation? Actually, I guess I'll read up on my State code again. I do have it all saved on my hard drive.
I'm just asking these questions now since I'm thinking of it, and imagining if it hadn't panned out the way it did, and those guys were looking for trouble, what should I have done, or could I have done? As a responsible gun owner and [future] CCW owner, I want to know what I can/should do in a situation like that. So many questions. I know hindsight is usually 20/20. How would you have reacted to these situations? Any of your thoughts, comments, tips, etc. would be appreciated. Thanks.