winchester model 12 questions

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shamus005

New member
I have some questions on the winchester model 12, 20 guage. This model was made around 1940-ish. It's in pretty good shape. I was wondering 2 things:

1. what is the value range of this weapon? Am I dealing with an average $400 gun or is this thing a $1000 collectable?

2. How do I strip this thing? I have no experience with shotguns.
 
shamus005,

Welcome to the Firing Line.

To quote a value without knowing either the condition of your M12, or knowing if it's a standard field gun, or one of the more collectible variants just isn't possible. Also, many classic Winchesters have, over the years, been refinished: this doesn't affect function, but it does affect value (to a collector).

The best manual covering "stripping" a Model 12 that I've seen is the factory service manual. It's available as a reprint through Ray Riling Arms Books. Type (or paste) "Winchester Model 12 Assembly" into the quick search feature on the index page that appears if you follow the link. The cost is $14.95, more than the alternative, but this book covers everything you'll ever need to know about how your M 12 (or M 1912) works.

Bob
 
Further question on Model 1912 Winchester 16 ga.

Regarding Mr. Foster's help to the fellow asking about value on a model 1912, I have the same question, but I have specifics on it.

The gun was made in 1919 according to the serial number. It is a 16 gauge, and the patent dates on the barrel start at July 21, 1896 and list several dates up til July 22, 1913. But Winchester says it was manufactured in 1919.

There is no model name stamped anywhere, such as a "wingmaster"
or anything such as that.

The gun has been completely refinished (reblued and the stock and foregrip refinished. (I understand that decreases, not increases value?)

Any help would be appreciated on value. (Naturally, it is in excellent firing condition, as I use it for dove and quail.
Gary Conner
Dripping Springs, Texas
 
I'm no Model 12 expert, but here's something....

ANY Model 12 capable of firing around here is a $300 shotgun. Like new field guns, more like $450 up. Refinishing does not add much value.

In ads in the latest issue of Shotgun Sports, one vendor mentions a variety of 11 Model 12s in 12 gauges, some cased. Prices run from $450 to $4K.

What drives prices up includes things like rarity. Pigeon grades, Trap and Skeet guns, 2 barrel sets, etc, are sought after by collectors. After market stuff like ribs and wood do not do much, while factory redos do.

A lot of old 12s had Cutts devices installed for Skeet. Do not regard these as detriments. Shoot some skeet and see why.

Polychokes, Lyman adjustable chokes and so on are not good on a collector but OK on shooters. And 12s are very nice shooters.

Engraving sometimes adds lots of value but not always. Winchester did some at the factory inexpensively, and quality varies. So with inlays.

HTH, maybe a REAL expert will come on and illuminate the fog I may have caused....
 
Yes, you're correct Gary. Refinishing (except when it has been done by a very few specialist smiths) generally decreases the value of American made guns, more so in the less common variants than in field grade arms. I'll agree that for a simple field grade M 12 "shooter" in servicable condition $450 is a good average, but this does vary somewhat by region.

The only thing I can think of regarding 1919 vintage M 12's is that there are a few guns with uncommon roll stamps. The transition from the M 1912 to M 12 began in 1918, and continued into 1919 and perhaps a bit later. I'm not an advanced collector, but I've seen three different arrangements of the patent dates on the barrels of M 12's made during this time frame. I don't know whether or not the uncommon "patterns" of patent dates command a premium on the collector market, or how a collector advanced enough to be interested in such "oddities" might evaluate a refinished gun.

One thing about most advanced collectors- they'll talk for hours if you're sincerely interested.

Bob
 
Stripping the gun....

To remove the trigger, just take out the screw on the bottom by the grip.

To remove the bbl, find the steel pin (about 1/4" dia.) at the muzzle end of the magazine tube, while holding the gun w/ top of bbl towards you, push the pin in from the top) and rotate the magazine tube counter clockwise using the pin. Once done, using the forearm, raise or push the magazine tube outward till it stops, now roatate the whole assembly (bbl, forearm and magazine tube) counter clockwise and remove from receiver.

To assemble, same steps only backerds. :)

Star54
 
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